Help, we need DRY heat!

[Protagonist]

All I can say is, what I'm doing seems to be working.

I'm camping at Bayou Segnette State Park, Westwego, LA. Outside temperature 47°F, relative humidity 74% after about 24 hours straight of light rain.

Inside temperature 68°F throughout, relative humidity 40%, despite allowing my raingear to air-dry in the wet bath (door closed, vent fan on)— and I haven't even used my dehumidifier or electric heater so far this trip. No condensation on any windows or elsewhere.

[DreamStreamr]

Protag,
I had no doubt your system works and needs to. Your conditions are much more challenging than ours currently - no rain since 30 hours ago; 29 degrees; dew point is 19 degrees. So yeah, the trailer's windows were all dry this morning. And running the catalytic, furnace, and ceramic portable I've moved the interior from 44 an hour ago to 59 now. Debbie's probably gonna crawl out of bed when it gets above 62 inside or she finishes her 2nd cup of tea.

I enjoy reading your solutions on the forum. Your answers are descriptive and helpful. Thanks!

Living the Dream

[Gringo]

We've been in northern Colorado in our 27 FB since late September. It's gotten down to 14 deg. already. We are in a campground, and have been running three small electric heaters along with the furnace. It looks like we are going to take the trailer to Texas and spend the rest of the winter in it. I have been looking at skirting ( emailed the RV skirt people here in Colorado but never got a reply and didn't follow up) and I have some questions. Vinyl is just not much of a thermal barrier. It would certainly cut the cold wind going under the trailer to zero, but in a steady biting cold I just don't see it holding much heat. I've been reading the threads about using sheets of insulation foam, and this seems to make more sense both thermally and financially for a trailer that will be in a fixed location for several months.

Do any of you have any comparison data on using thin sheets of vinyl sheeting vs something like a nominal 1" thick sheet of foam? The foam would be a one-time use throw-away, but it looks like it could be done for way less than $100.

Any info on what it should cost to buy professionally fit vinyl sheeting for a 27 ft. trailer? And where do you store all that folded vinyl when traveling?

I think I'm liking the foam ideas.

[slowmover]

I’d keep at the skirting people.

Under the TT it’s really more a matter of cutting loss by wind. Any air movement, versus absolute temps.

[J. Morgan]

Night before last it was 19 degrees in Southern New Mexico, we stayed warm all night with an electric space heater with the furnace kicking on a couple a few times for a short run.

The water in the trailer never froze, but the supply line to the trailer did freeze... had to shower on tank water that morning. Nothing in the windows, and no skirting....

I think the key here was to keep the trailer warm all day before it got really cold.

[Gringo]

[QUOTE=J. Morgan;2043863

The water in the trailer never froze, but the supply line to the trailer did freeze...
[/QUOTE]

a couple weeks ago when we got hit with temps in the teens several nights in a row, I went to Ace Hardware and bought a 15 ft. heating element. I've heard it referred to as heating tape, but it's not tape. This is a long element that you run alongside a water supply hose. It comes in various lengths. I just chose 15 ft. because I already had a length of the white hose cut to that length that I wasn't using. I also picked up some 1/2" fluffy pink insulation that comes in about a 4" wide strip, and some quality hi-temp duct tape. Put it all together as per instructions and we haven't had any supply line freezing issues after several days of sub freezing weather in a row.

[J. Morgan]

Originally Posted by Gringo

a couple weeks ago when we got hit with temps in the teens several nights in a row, I went to Ace Hardware and bought a 15 ft. heating element. I've heard it referred to as heating tape, but it's not tape. This is a long element that you run alongside a water supply hose. It comes in various lengths. I just chose 15 ft. because I already had a length of the white hose cut to that length that I wasn't using. I also picked up some 1/2" fluffy pink insulation that comes in about a 4" wide strip, and some quality hi-temp duct tape. Put it all together as per instructions and we haven't had any supply line freezing issues after several days of sub freezing weather in a row.

That sounds like a great idea that I would try, but unfortunately my supply hose is over 100 feet long....

[Gringo]

Originally Posted by J. Morgan

That sounds like a great idea that I would try, but unfortunately my supply hose is over 100 feet long....

Ouch. I thought 25 ft. was too long. But we are usually either in the local KOA or boondocking up on some property near the Wyoming border. I carry water in a 40 gallon bladder in the back of the pickup truck, pump it into a 50 gallon plastic tank, and then pump that into the AS.

[Gringo]

Originally Posted by J. Morgan

That sounds like a great idea that I would try, but unfortunately my supply hose is over 100 feet long....

Can you dig a trench and bury it?

[J. Morgan]

Originally Posted by Gringo

Can you dig a trench and bury it?

That just isn’t practical in this case. It crosses 20’ of concrete, 40’ of asphalt and 12’ of truck scale...

[mandolindave]

But for those inquiring about wood stoves….

They are small and you would have to get up several times overnight to feed them or worse, have to start a new fire.

They also need an air supply to replace the air that goes out the " chimney ". Without an air supply or open window, you couldn't get a draft going to start a fire. An open window would bring in a lot of cold air, and it wouldn't be worth while in temps much below 40 F. But yeah, some people use them, and like them.

They are nice for day time use in cool weather though.

[Gearheart]

There are wood burners specifically made for the application that use outside air for the combustion just like the furnace does.

[amschind]

I was very curious about how "Wet heat" (i.e a heater that INCREASED rather than DECREASED relative humidity) would even be possible. It seems like people are running catalytic heaters that vent exhaust gasses directly into the camper? Humidity or not, that sounds absolutely nuts to me (i.e. it's a slightly less effective version of suicide by running car in a closed garage). CO produces coma before dyspnea which makes it more dangerous, but CO2 in an enclosed space will absolutely asphyxiate you.

[LNBright]

Originally Posted by amschind

I was very curious about how "Wet heat" (i.e a heater that INCREASED rather than DECREASED relative humidity) would even be possible. It seems like people are running catalytic heaters that vent exhaust gasses directly into the camper? Humidity or not, that sounds absolutely nuts to me (i.e. it's a slightly less effective version of suicide by running car in a closed garage). CO produces coma before dyspnea which makes it more dangerous, but CO2 in an enclosed space will absolutely asphyxiate you.

Pardon? Isn't the point of a catalytic heater that it's safe in a place like a camper? That there isn't a flame?

(And, this thread is ~5 years old, maybe start a new one perhaps?)

[civeng99]

I’d be darn careful using a catalytic heater for much more than taking the chill off.

[civeng99]

Originally Posted by amschind

i was very curious about how "wet heat" (i.e a heater that increased rather than decreased relative humidity) would even be possible. It seems like people are running catalytic heaters that vent exhaust gasses directly into the camper? Humidity or not, that sounds absolutely nuts to me (i.e. It's a slightly less effective version of suicide by running car in a closed garage). Co produces coma before dyspnea which makes it more dangerous, but co2 in an enclosed space will absolutely asphyxiate you.

exactly.

[Jcondon]

Originally Posted by civeng99

exactly.

Burning one pound of propane creates 1.2 pounds of water vapor. It does this by consuming the oxygen inside the trailer. If enough oxygen is consumed the flame will suffer from incomplete combustion which produces carbon monoxide. Lots of deaths have occurred from CO posoining in enclosed trailers. They should never be recommended. Furnaces can also leak combustion products into a trailer. The heat exchangers are positive pressure generally so any leak will dump lots of moisture. If you think your furnace increases the humidity in the trailer when using it then y’all may want to get it tested. We use smoke in the intake as a tracer with the gas off. Sometimes the exhaust is partially blocked causing excess pressure.

[IcemanTX]

Her is a description of the catalytic heater "heating" process.
http://https://www.epa.gov/sites/def...ic-heaters.pdf

A byproduct of the catalytic heat is water or moisture. So, it will produce a "wet heat". Whereas an electric heater of a typical gas fired furnace is a straight adiabatic heating process and decreases the relative humidity.

Ken

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Not at all sure that tacking onto a 5 year old thread will get this information viewed by many folks. Typically everybody involved in a thread like this has moved on to other things. Stuff at the end of dead thread gets missed.

Bob

[Jcondon]

Originally Posted by IcemanTX

Her is a description of the catalytic heater "heating" process.
http://https://www.epa.gov/sites/def...ic-heaters.pdf

A byproduct of the catalytic heat is water or moisture. So, it will produce a "wet heat". Whereas an electric heater of a typical gas fired furnace is a straight adiabatic heating process and decreases the relative humidity.

Ken

Decreasing the relative humidity does nothing to the dew point. Condensation occurs at dew point no matter the relative humidity. We all should be discussing few point when it comes to condensation. Unvented appliances raise the dew point so condensation occurs at a warmer outside air temp.