Winterize by blowing the lines

[handn]

Originally Posted by Wayne&Sam

I use only air pressure to winterize. I've never blown out the black tank sprayer and haven't had a problem. But don't forget to blow out the galley sink sprayer and the toilet flusher.

I don't have a toilet sprayer, but use compressed air only to blow out the kitchen sprayer and it works the same as the other water valves.
I use Rv anti freeze for traps and holding tanks only.

[alreed]

I have just a 1/3 HP, 3 gallon 100 PSI air compressor. Can I get enough volume out of this to adequately blow out the lines on my 22' CCD?

[Friday]

Originally Posted by alreed

I have just a 1/3 HP, 3 gallon 100 PSI air compressor. Can I get enough volume out of this to adequately blow out the lines on my 22' CCD?

If it has a pressure regulator, dial it back to 50psi... that is plenty to blow out, and blow up your plumbing.

[Friday]

Here is one to make you go hmmm.... last year I blew out, and anti-freezed. I had pink everywhere... it got to -40 and my toilet step valve froze and cracked... and pink anti-freeze came running out of it.

This year I bought 'name brand' pink stuff... in the big 3 gallon jugs...

[Gene]

Friday, that's a bummer. One year I forgot to purge the toilet valve and send antifreeze through it and it cracked, but since then I remember and no problems. There must have been water trapped in there or the antifreeze wasn't good enough for -40˚ (same temp either C or F). I have read RV antifreeze becomes less effective when mixed with some, maybe not much, water, but don't know how much water or whether it is even true.

It is relatively warm here compared to Canada and I don't think it has gotten down to -20˚ F, but I figure it can get a lot colder in any one year. I blow the lines (45 psi), make sure all faucets and drains are blown out in succession, and then run antifreeze through the water pump bypass. On ours there's a drain under the water heater for a water line (valve just under the water heater bypass) not mentioned in the owner's manual. You can't count on the owner's manual.

The water heater, when drained, still has as much as a gallon in it and Atwood says that's not a problem—it won't affect the tank. But, stuff can accumulate in the bottom—other than turning the trailer over and shaking the water out, you can flush it with lots of water and then try to blow it out with compressed air.

I use a pancake compressor and it works fine. If I run out of air, I wait, it pumps up, and blow some more. The size of the tank only will slow you down briefly. You can get adapters at Camping World to attach to the compressor hose and the city water inlet—that will make it a lot easier than holding the air hose to the hole.

The models with the water pump under the wardrobe in the secret compartment is mounted backwards at the factory so you can't get to the filter or easily attach a bypass. Apparently they've done this for years and may still do it. I got Airstream to pay the dealer to turn it around and attach the bypass kit I had bought. It takes a gallon or so of antifreeze to fill the pipes and fixtures—cheap insurance I think. I also put some in the P traps and a cup or two in the tanks to lub the drain valves (open and close them quickly to coat them with antifreeze). You could leave gallons of water in the tanks and there would be no damage I would think because there's plenty of expansion room, but you wouldn't be able to lub the drain valves.

Remove any activated carbon filters—antifreeze doesn't get along with them and you will have to buy new ones.

I may be overcautious, but the costs of broken lines are more than I want to deal with. There's enough maintenance as it is and winterizing only takes an hour or two. Summerizing takes much more time as I have to flush everything out and then sanitize the system.

Gene

[lewster]

I can relate lots of instances where clients only blew out the water lines and paid dearly. This is especially a problem in larger trailers and motor homes. Air pressure is no guarantee that you will displace all of the water, as some always seems to drain back and will collect on any low points in your plumbing.

I really look forward to the Snowbirds coming back to FL, especially after Dec. when they have to drive in freezing temps and inevitably blow a valve, ice maker, faucet or other part because they were too lazy, uninformed of just plain cheap to do the job right and winterize with a quality RV antifreeze.

My special favorites are folks that don't use anti-freeze and have Aqua-Hot hydronic heating systems. They inevitably blow a water heating coil, requiring a replacement unit starting at $5000.

Do it right the first time and use anti-freeze!

[CanoeStream]

Good point Lew.

Your Airstream plumbing is designed for pressures not to exceed 40# if I recall correctly. I set my air compressor to this pressure and have never failed to see a fine mist continue to blow out. Leave it to sit a while and you'll spit out solid glugs of water again. It's always scary imagining what amount of water might settle in the plumbing. Pex may be able to withstand that (I'm not saying so! copper sure can't) but if frost forms at a fitting, all bets are off.

What about using higher pressures? You might get closer to an antifreeze-free plumbing blowout with that if you have a partner with good tap dancing skills (eh-eh.. ). It would be risky even to describe what that might entail. "Dealers do it." Yeah, they assign some flunky to use 80, 100 or 120 psi. Walk ... slowly ... away ... from ... them. For the low price of RV antifreeze I know where I'm putting my $$.

Just don't put the antifreeze to circulate via your freshwater tank and expect it to rinse out before August. Install a bypass valve. Winterizing becomes an easy process once you've done it once or twice. Just one opinion.

[Florida 55]

Someone suggested to me putting a gallon of cheap vodka in the water lines instead of pink RV anti freeze in order to avoid the residual taste problem in the spring. Use regular RV pink anti freeze in the traps. Has anyone tried this?

[Aage]

:hic: nope!

[CanoeStream]

I've read the vodka suggestion before. I don't know a mechanism by which the alcohol portion could evaporate significantly when it is inside your plumbing, but if it did the remaining 60% by volume is good ol' H2O.

The RV antifreeze seems to be washed out after the water coming out the faucet aerator stops foaming. I'm usually free of taste by the third trip of the spring. We've got gallon water jugs we refill from the home tap for personal consumption. And for use at so many campgrounds whose water has strong chlorine flavor.

[jcanavera]

Originally Posted by Friday

Here is one to make you go hmmm.... last year I blew out, and anti-freezed. I had pink everywhere... it got to -40 and my toilet step valve froze and cracked... and pink anti-freeze came running out of it.

This year I bought 'name brand' pink stuff... in the big 3 gallon jugs...

I used to buy the cheap stuff until one year when I dewinterized, I found that the toilet valve was leaking. After taking it apart I found the rubber in the valve had turned to mush. I can't say for sure it was the antifreeze but I've stayed with the brand name ever since. Never had a reoccurrence of that situation.

Jack

[Gene]

I've never had an antifreeze aftertaste. In the spring I flush until the chlorine for sanitizing is all removed—that is what causes the foaming I thought. Anyway, 3 flushes after the chlorine treatment, no aftertaste.

The system drains faster if you leave the water pump on.

Gene

[mojo]

If you blow out the lines of antifreeze in the spring, you waste a lot less water and get the residual antifreeze out much quicker when finally flushing with water.

[polarlyse]

Where would I look for low point valves if I have them ????? What type of valves were used ???? Should they be left open to drain and closed in the spring or let to drain and then closed ?

Didn't have any on my old trailer and not sure where to look for them on the new one.

Thanks all,

[Gene]

Roger,

Valves move around on different trailers. The fresh water tank is usually located in recent years between the wheels and the drain cock is between them on a tandem trailer. Next to them and slightly in front are two (one for hot and one for cold I imagine) drains with wing nut type drains. I also have one below the water heater, but not for the heater, but for a water line to or from the heater; the valve is in the compartment above and next to the heater.

But your model is different and hopefully someone will tell you who knows. Other than that, crawl around underneath and look for plastic or other tubing sticking out of the belly and various spigots of different types. From what I've read valves can be anywhere including under furniture. Some models had a outside hose spigot and many have outdoor showers that need to be drained too.

I have not run antifreeze out of these 3 drains for the pipes and I do not put much antifreeze in the fresh water tank (just enough to lub the valve). The white plastic valve on the fresh water tank is junk and becomes very hard to open very quickly. I finally replaced it with a brass hose bib, though I understand Sharkbite makes a spigot that fits better.

Gene

[macofpei]

I have a 2003 Classic. I disconnect the suction line from the freshwater tank and hook up a hose fitted to the pump. I bypass my water heater tank and drain. I use the 3 Gallon tank and start the pump. It quickly pressurizes and stops. I start in the bathroom and open the cold tap until I see pink. I than open the hot water valve, again until I see pink. I do this with every tap and the toilet and wash hose. I do flush out the water valve that is outside. I haven't really founded out what it is there for. :-)
It doesn't take that long to get rid of the smell of the antifreeze. I do the flush out before I leave in the spring, while at home.

[polarlyse]

Thanks Gene. I'm aware of the tank drain getting brittle. I had to change the one on my old trailer last fall. Another one of those PITA jobs. I had gotten 2 valves at that time so I have a spare for the emergency job when / if it comes up. I will take a closer look around the belly. I haven't seen any protruding drains. I don't have the outside shower option but do have the outside hose valve and will drain that one also.

[tvanwave]

What capacity compressor is needed IE how many scfm? I'm looking for a compressor to do this type of work.

Originally Posted by tkowalyk

I use both air and antifreeze to winterize.

Drain all water from the system: fresh water tank, water heater, low point grain lines, and valve near water heater, with all valves open, hold open toilet fill line for a few seconds

Using an adapter at the city water line - blow out the lines, opening and closing valves and drain lines. you need a compressor with a tank to do this. IMPORTANT -- NEVER EXCEED 60 PSI, and always have one valve open. The water heater is bypassed for this.

Drain black and gray tanks Flush black tank several times on your last outing, leave dry.

Purge system with antifreeze - using water pump bypass input hose. Starting with high point (shower) open up one valve at a time (hot and cold), until antifreeze runs through. Pour 1/2 cup into each trap. Pour 1/2 gallon of antifreeze into black tank.

I have been doing this method for 25 years, and have never had a problem. It is my opinion that the valves and piping system is in better shape with antifreeze in the system, rather than dry -- lubrication etc.

I have never blown out the black tank sprayer -- but probably not a bad idea. The volume of air will not be a problem, as the tank os vented. In fact when we dump our tank, I usually fill up the black tank 2 or three times to flush it. I can see the monitor panel from the outside, and I keep an eye on my watch to time the fill cycle.

[StreamRollin]

Was wondering if anyone leaves a small amount of PS in the toilet bowl as to not dry out the rubber flapper in the bottom of the bowl? The two small petcocks that are on the bottom of the tank by the drain that is so hard to get to, to drain the fresh water tank do you open these and drain them too? I don't remember opening them last year.
Thanks Jim

[Ag&Au]

Originally Posted by StreamRollin

Was wondering if anyone leaves a small amount of PS in the toilet bowl as to not dry out the rubber flapper in the bottom of the bowl? The two small petcocks that are on the bottom of the tank by the drain that is so hard to get to, to drain the fresh water tank do you open these and drain them too? I don't remember opening them last year.
Thanks Jim

If I am correct about what you are referring to, those are the cold water and hot water low point drains. It is important that they be opened and blown out just like the faucets.

I alway sput a little antifreeze in the toilet bowl when I am done.

Ken