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n8andm · 05-16-2011, 08:38 PM

I have so many questions, if you are knowledgable about any, I would really appreciate the input. Thanks!

I have a 1956 SS Jet with a weird lock problem. PLease Ignore the ugly paint job on it, that's also on my to-(un)do list. the outside handle is broken, like so many of these handles are. I am on the waiting list for a replicate one. I just want the insides to work.

1) Can you identify this lock?

Is the L54 & L55 just the handle name?
If I replace the handle, do I have to replace the lock too?

2) When I turn it to the right, it unlocks and I can turn the handle and the interior lock is in the up position. Unfortunately, to get the key out I have to turn it CCW (left) and it locks halfway.

3) When I turn it CCW to lock it the interior lock is in the down position and the interior handle does not turn. Also, I can't remove the key and have to turn it CW (right) to the key slot vertical position. This makes it sort of half locked, but I still can open it. But at times the door is just locked, and I have had to crawl through a window- lucky I have a temporary window screwed in.

4) Is it me are the interior locking bits broken?

5) What's up with the interior door handle?
Is it supposed to look that way?

Ganglin · 05-17-2011, 07:39 PM

It appears to be an L54/55 - here is a replacement handle and bezel for it at a very good price:

VintageCampers.com :: Vintage Campers, Vintage Trailers, Vintage Parts, Vintage Restorations

There has to be a parts diagram out there somewhere.....

n8andm · 05-17-2011, 10:09 PM

Here is the Bargman lock that JUST SOLD on eBay.co.uk. The item only posted on the uk site and it was actually located in Ohio.

Excerpt:
"HERE IT IS THE RARE AND HARD TO FIND H-20-2 TRAILER DOOR HANDLE/LOCK MADE BY THE THEODORE BARGMAN CO. BACK IN THE 1940'S & 1950'S AND THEN DISCONTINUED
THIS MODEL WAS USED BY AIRSTREAM, SPARTAN AND MANY OTHER COACH COMPANYS
THIS HANDLE IS NOT BROKE ( ALTHOUGH IT IS MISSING THE KEYS, AND INTERIOR LATCH STRIKER & HANDLE )
IT DOES HAVE THE LOCK CYLINDER IN PLACE, WITH ALL SQUARE STOCK PIECES PROTRUDING FROM THE BACK ( THAT CONNECT TO INTERIOR LATCH/HANDLE)
THE LITTLE ROUND LOCK COVER IS LIGHTLY BENT ( SEE PICS) I'M SURE IT CAN BE BENT BACK INTO PLACE ( BUT I DID NOT WANT TO DAMAGE IT EVEN MORE, AS I'M NOT A LOCKSMITH)
THIS HANDLE HAS A GOOD SPRING & NICE BEZEL
THIS UNIT HAS WONDERFUL CHROME ON IT WITH ONLY MINNOR PITTING AND A FEW SCRATHES.
THIS IS A VERY NICE UNIT AND WILL BE THE JEWEL OF ANY VINTAGE TRAILER
I ALSO HAVE A BARGMAN L-77 VERTICAL UNIT, & A BRAND NEW IN THE BOX L-400 THAT I WILL ALSO BE LISTING, SO STAY TUNED AND PLEASE CHECK OUT MY OTHER VINTAGE AUCTIONS"

Ganglin · 05-18-2011, 02:57 AM

An interesting post from Steve at Vintage Trailer Supply:

The Skinny on Bargman Locks#7 [URL="http://repairingyesterdaystrailers.yuku.com/forum/getrefs/id/13414/type/0"] [-]

Posts: 1
01/27/11 12:06

Hey folks, first of all... I want to apologize for all our out-of-stock problems. I can't say I blame anyone who stopped looking for some of those parts. The drip caps have gone through a long frustrating history and I won't bore you with it. Suffice to say I am trying to keep them in production but it is a long back-and-forth with the manufacturer.

As for Bargman locks... I spoke with the head of Bargman last week. I bumped into her and had a chance to talk to her at length about the Bargman locks. By the way, Bargman is now owned by Cequent which is owned by Trimas. That should tell you the whole story right there.

Here's what we know for sure about Bargman locks: every model has been discontinued and dropped from the Bargman line. Here's the complete list of dead Bargman models (in the order they have been dropped through the decades): H20-2, L-77, L-400, L-66, L-100, L-200, L-300.

There are virtually no parts available for any of them. Bargman does not have the tooling for any of them. The tooling for components and bodies wear out over time and with no new OEM demand for the locks, Cequent does not feel that the investment in repairing or replacing tools is worth it. Most of the lock pieces were made overseas and the tools are now scrapped so not retrievable.

We are working cooperatively with Bargman to reintroduce a few components but it is not going to be fast or easy. Please don't wait for us. Instead, look on eBay and old salvaged trailers. I once bought an entire trailer on eBay for the L-77 lockset. I then emailed the seller asking if he would be interested in just sending me the lock and keeping the trailer to relist. He said "heck yes."

Let me know if you have any questions about this topic.

Good luck with your restorations,

toastie · 05-18-2011, 07:13 AM

Here is a picture of mine back from the chromer, you can spend up to $500.00 to get a complete keyed mechanism working..........toastie

n8andm · 05-18-2011, 09:40 AM

Your lock is sure something to envy!
I never knew why there was a little hole on the key portion of the lock, I now see that it's a cover plate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by toastie

Here is a picture of mine back from the chromer, you can spend up to $500.00 to get a complete keyed mechanism working..........toastie

BTW, Where did you get it fixed? I am really tempted to send the entire lock out to get serviced. Can you make a mold of your handle? There is a kit you can buy at Michaels craft store that's a silicone mold. I would use this to make a plaster relief & then make another mold and hope someone could make the part.

n8andm · 05-18-2011, 09:42 AM

I'll be searching more of the international Ebay sites now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ganglin

An interesting post from Steve at Vintage Trailer Supply:

The Skinny on Bargman Locks#7 [URL="http://repairingyesterdaystrailers.yuku.com/forum/getrefs/id/13414/type/0"] [-]

Posts: 1
01/27/11 12:06

Good luck with your restorations,

bredlo · 05-18-2011, 09:46 AM

It's not surprising that you can occasionally find an ENTIRE TRAILER for the same amount as some of us are willing to pay for just the door handle. That's the world of meticulous restorations and sticklers for authenticity. I'm just glad there are a few parts trailers still out there to be had.

n8andm · 05-18-2011, 02:27 PM

No kidding! Know that I have a better idea of the scarcity, i'm up for the expense, even if that handle is really half the cost of my trailer. If I bought that and the lights I want for it, I'll be at my purchase price.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bredlo

It's not surprising that you can occasionally find an ENTIRE TRAILER for the same amount as some of us are willing to pay for just the door handle. That's the world of meticulous restorations and sticklers for authenticity. I'm just glad there are a few parts trailers still out there to be had.

BradS · 05-20-2011, 04:30 PM

n8andm

Here are the photos that I said I would send you. Sorry it took so long. This is an extra lock that I bought when I was trying to put together a complete one

Brad

n8andm · 05-20-2011, 04:38 PM

Brad,

It's tempting to buy, but I wish we cold try it out before hand to compare it with mine. I have to see if it's our lock that is broken, or maybe it's the catch part or maybe the door is crooked?
How much is your lock?

I gave up on the door handle replacement, all the AS's in the books have replaced theirs with regular old knobs. I am thinking of going to Architectural Antiques or the like to get a period appropriate handle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradS

n8andm

Here are the photos that I said I would send you. Sorry it took so long. This is an extra lock that I bought when I was trying to put together a complete one

Brad

BradS · 05-20-2011, 04:57 PM

Dont give up! I thought it would be impossible to get a complete lock. I now have the parts , from several sources to create one. I think the hunt was worth it.

PM me if you want to consider buying the lock. If I was you I would remove the lock from the door first and look at it. You may very well be able to figure it out, something could be loose

Either way I would love to see your trailer when time allows and would gladly show you mine when and if you have an interest. Ill look at every trailer that I get the chance to. Im surprised how much I have learned and I feel like I just got started.

bredlo · 05-26-2011, 10:12 AM

Keeping the thread alive... I bought the NOS handle referenced above. It was on the American-flavored eBay, fyi - not sure why it didn't show up in your search, N8.

Took the interior plate off the inside of the door to determine how much of the original setup remains. Exterior handle is gone (with the resulting holes patched) but I'm hoping the "lockset guts" were left alone.

Can't quite tell if it's the same as yours, BradS. If not, I'll certainly be interested in yours if it isn't already spoken for. I can't remove it completely right now to be sure... but I'm feeling semi-confident at the moment since the handle is lining up with the guts. That's shown in a little video clip of the situation:

YouTube - ‪Bargman Confusion‬‏

pbearsailor · 05-26-2011, 11:00 AM

I'm thinking that you are looking at an original H20-2 in there Brad. There are a couple of pics in my thread and Melody Ranch had pics in another thread as well. One thing I see in your video is that the skin around the lock is pop riveted on and it definitely would have been buck riveted originally. Sure looks like that skin has been patched at some point to accomodate the new handle.

-steve

bredlo · 05-26-2011, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pbearsailor

I'm thinking that you are looking at an original H20-2 in there Brad. There are a couple of pics in my thread and Melody Ranch had pics in another thread as well. One thing I see in your video is that the skin around the lock is pop riveted on and it definitely would have been buck riveted originally. Sure looks like that skin has been patched at some point to accomodate the new handle.

-steve

I sure hope so, Steve. Thanks for weighing in.

I agree on the ext: I was already confident no door would've left the factory with anything besides a single sheet of aluminum, and the pop rivets add weight to your conclusion. I believe the interior handle being original as well (mine looks like Toastie's) means they may have just replaced the exterior portion.

InsideOut · 05-26-2011, 12:57 PM

We too found several donor locks on eBay when rebuilding our lock. I think we needed to buy two or three partials plus we had the broken one that came on Birdy - then we sent it all out to be re-chromed. A couple of hundred dollars later, we have two complete locks, plus some extra bits & pieces.

"It's a Girl!!!"

By taking all of them apart and comparing bits & pieces, it was pretty easy to see how they work and what was broken on some wasn't on others. Of the three we have, we have two different inside handles (in pics) but they are interchangable. There also are some that the outside hangle is oriented horizontally and others vertically (like ours), these are interchangeble as well.

They can be found...sometimes you just have to have patience and buy it when you see it, not when you need it.

Shari

bredlo · 05-26-2011, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InsideOut

We too found several donor locks on eBay...
...They can be found...sometimes you just have to have patience and buy it when you see it, not when you need it.

Perfect - thanks Shari. It's reassuring to see additional "door gut" photos that look just like mine, and good to know that they come up now and then for N8 and the rest of us.

Having spares of anything that's been out of production for 50 years is a great insurance policy.

BradS · 05-26-2011, 03:53 PM

Brad

What you seem to have is the guts for what I call a right hand door in a left hand door. The extra lockset I have is the same as yours.

I moved the door in my Overlander and made it swing the same way as yours seems to. The lock was on the bottom. I talked with Dan at Vintage Campers and he was able to come up with the correct lock set for me. My key will be on the top now.

So long story short, you have the right lockset for the left door.

bredlo · 05-26-2011, 06:09 PM

I see what you're saying. In other words, to use this I'll have to position my handle horizontally, as with the lock is on the bottom the handle would be covering it.

Aesthetically I'd probably prefer to have the handle pointing down, but you could argue it's less likely to be broken off being horizontal; I think people would be more likely to twist it down than pull on it.