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Old 06-26-2017, 06:55 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by SeaLevel View Post
Another viewpoint for these points.

Durability and updates: Again, buy quality and make sure Windows is configured for auto-updates. It can't get much easier than that. And before you say, yeah, but Windows updates can mess up your computer, see above. Don't install crap software. I haven't had a Windows update break anything for over 10 years.

This is simply not true. It's well publicized that Windows updates can regularly cause issues and must be rolled back until the next fix is released.

And since we're talking about updates - major OS upgrades on the Mac are FREE, while Microsoft expects you to pay $200 for their latest and greatest.
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:07 AM   #22
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I'm a retired IT guy, wrote Windows code in the early days, then into management. One of the groups that reported to me was our corporate Internet security team. We started calling Tuesdays 'Microsoft Tuesday' because that was the day we installed new patches for the vulnerabilities that had been recently discovered.

My opinion is that Apple does a far better job in their operating system design and quality assurance efforts for their products. Prior to retiring, I changed to Apple for my personal/home use, and it was an excellent decision for me. I can't imagine ever going back to a Windows platform, if for no other reason than Microsoft has a giant target tattooed to their corporate buttocks because they're the de facto standard in business. Is Apple perfect, nope... but their products work for me.
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:20 AM   #23
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Wow, I need to buy a personal laptop before I retire. I was going to get a Microsoft operated unit. I do a fair amount of mapping through Garmin for motorcycle travel. It's all got to be downloaded into a Garmin Montana. I haven't seen it done on an Apple laptop. Guess I better rethink going with Microsoft. Only one windows recommendation? Hopefully Garmin Basecamp will work with Apple software.
FYI, I'm on my iPad now. Much easier than getting out my laptop.
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:37 AM   #24
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I've been pleased with my Microsoft Surface Pro. Pricey, but high quality. It is a great workstation when that is what I need, and a decent tablet when that is what I want. It also has an excellent touch screen that also accepts stylus input. Windows 10 works fine for me, and may seem more familiar to you if you are coming from Windows 7. I think you will be fine with an Apple notebook as well - they are great - but give some thought to whether a touch screen on your notebook is something that you'd like. Joe
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Old 06-26-2017, 08:24 AM   #25
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I'm not going to recommend you grab a PDP-11/20 and run that in your Airstream. Indeed I did run one back in the 70's as a home computer. I also would not recommend comparing a 1982's PC (Mac or IBM back then, had both) to a 2017 PC of any sort. One flaw in the shopping process is to compare your ten year old "whatever" to a new and shiny "something else". Since computer prices (spec for spec) drop each year, it's no different than comparing a $400 computer to a $4000 computer. High end Mac's are pricey. They also last a long time. High end PC's tend to be a bit heavier and a bit more capable (sorry Mac). I used to lug a "PC Workstation" laptop for work. It was a beast (both in terms of performance and heavy weight).

One thing that *will* cost you money on anything you buy is the disk drive. Solid state disks (SSD's) are much more rugged than the old rotating hard drives. They also are way more expensive size for size. At least in my experience, rotating drives tend to die an early death in laptops. SSD's tend to go on forever. No matter what you look at, a disk that seems "really big" today will be full of stuff and seem "really small" down the road. Whatever you *think* you need for a disk, double it ... On each generation of Mac's less and less can be swapped out and more is soldered to the motherboard. It's the same on some PC's, not quite the same on the giant beast versions.

Lots to think on !!


...on a 15" MBP late 2016 with touch bar ... gotta have a touch bar , 16 GB memory, 1TB SSD.
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Old 06-26-2017, 08:49 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by uncle_bob View Post
Since computer prices (spec for spec) drop each year, it's no different than comparing a $400 computer to a $4000 computer. High end Mac's are pricey. They also last a long time. High end PC's tend to be a bit heavier and a bit more capable (sorry Mac). I used to lug a "PC Workstation" laptop for work. It was a beast (both in terms of performance and heavy weight).

I disagree. I've found that the high end MacBook pros are everybit as well equipped as the similarly priced high end Dell or Lenovo's. At the same time they are generally much lighter and thinner, and the power adapter isn't a giant brick.
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Old 06-26-2017, 10:07 AM   #27
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I give my sister flack for being an Apple snob. She still holds a grudge against Bill Gates for stealing DOS back in the day. Iíve been buying $400 Windows PCís about every 5 years. Eventually, something will go wrong with them, but when you get a new one, you get the software upgrades included. Windows 10 works fine and Iíve had good luck with Dell, Toshiba, Acer. Iíve been on this low-end Acer desktop now with Windows 10 for about 1 Ĺ years; it starts up in about 10 seconds and downloads everything faster than I can use it. It really depends what you are going to use it for and what youíre already comfortable with.
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Old 06-26-2017, 11:07 AM   #28
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1. If you use your laptop mostly for Facebook, websites, and NetFlix, it doesn't matter what OS you use.

2. Macs are beautifully machined from solid blocks of aluminum. Case closed.
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Old 06-26-2017, 11:15 AM   #29
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Asking for opinions between windows and Apple reminds me of asking about what brand of tires to get. Nevertheless, my wife uses the apple family of products including a MacBook Pro while I use a Microsoft Surface Pro with Windows 10. We both like our machines and get along fine with them with absolutely minimal problems. She does do some work with programs that do not have an Apple version; therefore, she has to run an emulator on her MacBook so that she can also run Windows 10 on it. Just be sure you know your needs, and you should be fine with either choice. If you go with Windows be sure to get a high quality machine. I really like the Microsoft Surface, but there are plenty others that are fine as well. Based on our usage needs and experiences with both systems, I have absolutely no desire to switch to Apple nor does she have any desire to switch to a Windows PC.
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Old 06-26-2017, 11:17 AM   #30
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I have been using HP notebooks for years. I replace every five or six years for around $400. This system has worked well for me.

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Old 06-26-2017, 11:19 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Wingeezer View Post
maybe I am a sucker for icons .... Apple? Airstream?
Perhaps there should be an Aristream edition with rivets.
But it costs twice as much and doesn't have a door like others.
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Old 06-26-2017, 12:04 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by carl2591 View Post
So here is the delima. my asus laptop running windows 7 with a amd E2 chip is getting slower or let me say was never real fast new (5 yrs old) but over time internet speed has gone up and my load times have not.

So i am looking at a new laptop and while using my daughters mac book air (1.5 yrs old) i see how a speedy unit loads pages..

Now I have never own apple products and dont have an iphone and dont really plan to get iphone as I like my android samsung 6. I may do come video editing but not big time.

I see the best unit run a i7 intel chip but i dont need to be cutting edge so looking at i5 or comparable in apple products..

any good advise appreciated on models like HP dell apple etc

One question to the OP which wasn't clear - what are you needing to do with it? It's possible you might be completely covered with an iPad Pro and not need a full laptop.
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Old 06-26-2017, 12:09 PM   #33
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Well I'm a Mac person also. I was a PC Windows person for much of my working career even doing customer support for computer equipment brought into the St. Louis convention center and domed stadium. I sold wired and wireless network services and with a staff of 4, we all were put to the test when large events came into our facility. The bulk of the equipment we saw was Windows driven equipment but in my last few years I saw a marked change as more and more users brought in Apple hardware. I got a iPad and MacBook Pro for personal use and for educational purposes because I figured I better know how this Apple stuff worked since I probably would have to support it. Interestingly enough we had very few calls if any for support of the Apple equipment.

What I came to learn over time was the fact that the Mac's come with everything you need. No need to buy sound cards, cameras, etc. Every thing works and the peripheral equipment is designed to work with your Mac. The other thing that means the world is the fact that the various Apple products work together. For example if I enter something into the Calendar on my iPhone, that entry is carried forth to every Apple product I own which has a calendar. Any photo I take is available from any device and in most cases the interfaces for these applications are pretty much the same.

Operating systems are free with a major operating system upgrade/release annually. Patches and security updates come out as necessary. With Apple you have the ability to get product support via the phone or from an Apple store at no charge. And that's not just during the warranty period. It's welcoming to be able to call Apple and get a US support based person on the phone or make an appointment at your local Apple store and bring your Apple device in to a person who will sit with you and resolve your issue, be it hardware, or just education on how to do something.

My neighbor bought a Mac after seeing me use my Mac and he commented to me several months later about his experience. He said Jack, you know I was a little leery about going from the PC world to Mac's. But you know, it just works! (He was used to calling me over to fix the blue screens of death on his PC and other issues that he would encounter due to software incompatibility to issues with the peripherals.)

There is a learning curve and if you have been Windows oriented it will take a bit to get used to. For example if you want to scroll down on a screen you use a downward key or motion on the pad, vs using the upward motion on a Windows PC. When you end a program on a PC you usually hit the red x button on the window with a windows operating system. On a mac you move the cursor over the name of the program at the top of the screen and a drop down shows which says exit and you click on that. But once you get the operational differences down, you find that the operating system is a joy to work with.

What's telling is locally Microsoft has opened a store in a major mall here in St. Louis. It a major attempt to created an Apple looking store. This store in the mall is on the same floor about 100 feet or so from the Apple store. The Apple store is full of shoppers with folks looking trying, attending free classes. The Microsoft store is almost vacant of shoppers. Maybe 5 employees working, where the Apple store has at least 30. It's just mind boggling what Apple has done and it's not smoke and mirrors.

Now there are some software applications in the gaming world that won't run on a Mac. For those applications you can purchase a copy of Windows and set your Mac up as a dual booting system. For example I own an iMac and when it boots, I an make a choice to run the Mac OS or Windows 10. Apple provides the booting mechanism so you create a mac disk partition and a Windows partition. You have to go out and buy the Windows Operating system. The folks at Apple can explain what you have to do. For me it works great and it's nice to not have to give up some of my gaming software that is Windows based only. As noted by others there is software that you can run on the Mac that will allow you to run both operating systems concurrently, but you do have to buy that. The dual boot solution is not a concurrent operation which means if you want to go to the Mac side, you have to exit Windows and reboot to Mac. But I don't have to buy any additional software and quite honestly I'd rather be running Windows natively than having the Mac OS have to run Windows as a subset of the Mac OS.

Bottom line I fully recommend the Mac. Yes it will cost you more, but when you look at the entire package from ease of use, hardware, and support, you get a lot more bang for the buck in the long run.

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Old 06-26-2017, 12:16 PM   #34
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When a client ask this question, my first response is:

"What applications do you need to run on your laptop?"

If one of the applications requires a windows operating system, that is the system they will get. But of the applications are only: Microsoft Office, Email, Web... Then both macOS and Windows would work, I suggest using the Macintosh. A Macintosh can run Windows programs (via Emulator or Bootcamp), but a Windows pc can not legally run the Macintosh OS (License agreement requires Apple Hardware).

Disclaimer: I am using a Mac Pro, MacBook Pro, and many other apple products
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Old 06-26-2017, 12:23 PM   #35
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No comparison. Apple is the only way to fly.
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Old 06-26-2017, 12:35 PM   #36
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You can run Windows on a Mac but you can't run Mac OS on a Windows computer.
I buy a new Macbook Pro every three years because the used value of my older Macbook Pro is pretty good which makes the upgrade very cost effective.
Everyone I know who has switched to Mac will never go back to Windows.
If you do switch to an iPhone and iPad you'll find the integration very nice.
The very good software set that comes free with a Mac is likely all you'll ever need.
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Old 06-26-2017, 12:41 PM   #37
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I like and use both systems, it kind of depends what I am doing at the time. One thing you mentioned was slow upload, assuming you are talking about uploading via internet then your problem is internet connection and or router speed which is not determined by your computer. Before you make any giant leaps I think you should start by working on that issue first.

It is hard to beat iPads and iPhones for internet access while traveling, but on the road I leave the 27 inch mac at home and use a windows lap top for photo editing. Simply put the windows photo software is more available and easier to use when we travel.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:08 PM   #38
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Apple has declared my 2011 MacBook pro "Vintage" so they will not reair it at all, at any price. It is broken because of an Apple defect, but they stopped repairing this model at the end of 2016.
Just be aware they can and will declare your systen "vintage" and you then have a brick if it fails. I have 8 Apple systems in the family.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:08 PM   #39
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I buy a Windows laptop every 2 years and then install Ubuntu on my old laptop, it wakes up the old machine tremendously. I take the Ubuntu machine when I just need to check the basics and the Windows machine when I need to stay in touch.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:20 PM   #40
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It depends on what you are running and what you need as well as your computing background. So I'll be a lone PC voice.

While I don't do it for a living, I am a serious photographer so I have high needs in processor, RAM, and storage that most people don't. Apple has pretty much abandoned that market as far as desktop computers. So I build my own PCs, to gaming standards. I have a lot of knowledge invested in PCs and I don't want to learn another platform (I do use IPhones so I respect the usability of Apple products).

When I hit the road I will most likely buy a gaming style laptop. I love the big screens and I love that you can get 64gb of RAM in a gaming PC right now (as far as I know you can't get more than 16gb of RAM in any Apple laptop). I also love that I can get a gaming laptop built in the same way I build my desktops, with a smaller SSD drive as a boot and programs drive, and a larger cheaper spinning HD for data storage. A 2TB SSD drive in a Macbook Pro adds a whopping $1200 to the price.

But then again as a photographer my needs may be atypical.
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