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Old 10-01-2007, 05:15 PM   #21
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Your request is reasonable. Doable might be different

Quote:
Originally Posted by emdubyadee
... I don't want to unhook the subwoofer. I just want it to work correctly.
There are two types of electrical noise that could cause the noise addressed in this thread: radiated, and coupled.

Radiated means that the noise-producing device (usually a motor of some sort) is sending the interference out via radio waves, and the unit's circuitry, whether it be the tuner or regular speakers or subwoofer or all, is not shielded enough to keep from picking it up.

Coupled means that the noise-producing device is dumping a bunch of interference back on the power buss.

Coupled noise is a lot easier to fix than radiated noise. I have had success reducing coupled noise with the addition of additional chokes & capacitors on the power buss. Radiated noise reduction has to be designed into the unit as in-the-field-fixes involve bulky, unattractive shielding.

I suggest you chat with the local, high-powered, car stereo shop about solutions. If those boys roll their eyes & get cocky about simple solutions, then take your Airstream down there and challenge them to eliminate the noise.

Since I think your problem is probably the uncurable radiated noise, challenge them to a double or nothing price on the repair.

Tom
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Old 10-01-2007, 06:08 PM   #22
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Interesting issue here... seems I remember from my studio building days some of the same issue regarding the control room monitors. Problem was two-fold. First being using unshielded wires and circuit and the other being a poor ground. So in this case, I'd look at changing the circuit the stereo is on because it seems that it's picking up interference with whatever else is on that particular circuit and then also check how the stereo is grounded - is it a good ground separate from other grounds. Another issue here may be what other power source is close to the speaker itself. Speakers have a magnet in them and anything that generates a current beside it can create a magnetic field - especially if it is a wound coil.

With live music, the high pitched squeal is usually feedback caused from either the EQ having the high end boosted too much and/or the microphones facing the main speakers which causes a sound loop that gets increasingly amplified until you hear the high pitched squeal... since we don't have mics (unless you're a die-hard karaoke fan) on the stereo, I'd think the EQ was the problem with the squeal. But then again... Airstream makes Airstreams... not stereos...
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Old 10-19-2007, 05:07 PM   #23
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Lightbulb Subwoofer Noise

We just got back from our first trip in our new 2008 Safari SE 27FB. We have the upgraded A/V package. The subwoofer in the 27FB is located in the rear doorside corner of the trailer under the dinette and behind the drawer.

Noticed the constant rumble from the subwoofer anytime we played a DVD. Wasn't noticeable using the FM tuner and not much with CDs. Was so bad a one point, I thought someone in the campground was running a generator. Tried adjusting via the sound system itself with no luck.

With much aid from mirrors, flashlights, and physical contortion, my husband managed to climb under and turn down the knobs on the subwoofer itself until we couldn't hear the rumble. Seems to have fixed the problem.

Have no idea what the knobs are for since it was too hard to read them back in the dark corner and we didn't get a manual or installation instructions with that piece of the system.

Hope this helps.
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:24 PM   #24
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I tried to record the rumbling of our sub woofer... but unfortunately the camera audio wasn't able to record the sound due to the low frequency... oh well.

When we first discovered this problem, we also turned down the subwoofer volume knob... which helps... but it also essentially turns it off. Might as well just unhook the baby at that point since you get no 'subwoofing'. It still rumbles and burps though.

TomW... its not the type of noise you associate with nearby motors or a bad power supply. Its a unique blend of 'random burps and rumbles'. It's certainly an attention getter. Considering the number of people with the same problem, I suspect that Airstream install these multiplayers and speakers and never even turn them on to test them before leaving the factory!

I'm saving up enough dough to fly my stereo shop expert down to the Adirondacks to listen to my rumbling Airstream to find a solution. My latest solution to the problem has been to winterize and store my Bambi which has greatly reduced the rumbling
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Old 10-25-2007, 04:16 PM   #25
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JetSki batteries work great for this type 'sperimentin'

Quote:
Originally Posted by campadk
... TomW... its not the type of noise you associate with nearby motors or a bad power supply. Its a unique blend of 'random burps and rumbles'. It's certainly an attention getter. ...
If I was to have this problem, my next step would be to disassociate the the subwoofer's amp from the Airstream's power buss.

In other words, try hooking just the subwoofer to a separate battery and listen if the noise persists. If it does, then hook both the receiver & subwoofer to the dedicated battery.

Tom
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Old 10-29-2007, 11:20 PM   #26
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Strange noise when the CD seeks

I am also having strange noise issues from the Stereo. I have 2007 16' Bambi and whenever I put an MP3 CD or regular CD when the player seeks for a song you can here a whining through the speakers. I had the stereo replaced by the dealer with no luck. I thought it might be a grounding issue? Any ideas on what to try?
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Old 12-13-2007, 08:54 AM   #27
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2008 30' Classic Sub Woofer Fix

I was happy to find this thread mainly because I thought the factory had really messed up the wiring on our upgraded audio/video package. This is indeed what has happened.

Fasten your seat belts folks, this is going to be long. Unfortunately, words come easily to me.

The sub-woofer "rumble" that everyone describes matches our experience exactly.

We ordered the remote speakers option.

We also ordered a Sirius satellite radio. We were getting lots of hum when the TV sound was being played through the stereo; same when using the sat radio. We found that the sound for the TV and the Sirius radio would play at the same time. Very confusing. If I unplugged the power from the sat radio the hum went away. Must be an electrical problem, eh? Not! Read on.

What to do? Take it to a dealer and let them turn some 19 year old who cannot find his a-- with both hands in high noon sunlight? Not. I agonized over this for two or three nanoseconds and opened up the portion of the cabinet in the overhead where the stereo is located.

But first I got out all the docs on the radio. The Aux In doc provided the most info. It has a very nice diagram of the auxiliary unit that is used to pump four separate inputs into the stereo. It also helped understand how things were supposed to be wired. I realized the TV and sat radio were using the same Aux In channel for one of these inputs - a big aha.

Back to the opened cabinet.

To say that the wiring I found looked like a rats nest is putting it mildly. I spent a morning sorting it all out just so I could see what was what. The only labeling on any of the cables was on the cables exiting the Sony radio. The good news is that this, coupled with the Aux In wiring diagram was enough to get everything sorted. Every cable now is ID'd with labels from our label maker.

The sat radio and TV conflict was easy to resolve. They had both of them plugged into the CDC2 port selector on the Sony Aux IN unit. I moved the sat radio to the empty jacks for the CDC3 port selector and that problem was solved. Now I can watch the TV and listen to the sat radio without the TV sound in the stereo speakers. No more hum either with the sat radio plugged into the power.

Next, I found the sub woofer jack from the Sony unit to be flopping in the breeze. Huh? If this is the case, what on earth is plugged into the sub woofer?

I went on the internet to see if I could locate some info about the sub woofer. Absolutely no docs on it came with the trailer. Found absolutely nothing on the internet either. I did find others posting on forums looking for the same info.

What made this confusing is that there is a small junction box flopping about with many wires from the stereo unit connected to it. This unit is not from Sony. This box is not from the manufacturer of the sub woofer either. This small adjunct box has two interesting items marked on it. One is a jack labeled sub-woofer with a single wire that I discovered is routed to the sub woofer. This wire is the third wire in the plastic harness that also has the battery and ground wires on it at the sub woofer. This adjunct box also has EXT SPEAKERS labeled with only two wires connected to the line out jack. More on this jack later; back to the sub woofer.

I pulled the sub woofer and saw the connection for the RCA jacks and decided that this had to be the input for the sub woofer; I forget what the jacks on the sub woofer were labeled.

Back to the rats nest of wires. Ultimately I discovered that the factory had connected the sub woofer to the rear speaker output from the stereo unit. I got the wires for this moved and now found I actually had some bass sound emitting from the sub woofer. I used one of the "two into one" splitters the factory had used to connect the TV and sat radio to the same input on the Aux In unit to split the single sub woofer out put from the Sony unit into two for input to the sub woofer - all RCA jacks.

But, this is the weakest sub woofer I have ever heard. Part of the problem is that it is under the sofa at the front of the trailer and the sofa just soaks up the sound. I have both dials on the sub woofer turn up to the most advance position on the rotary switches.

I wrote email to the company that manufactured the junction box with the EXT SPEAKERS and sub woofer wire coming of it to get the definitive info as to which wires are for left/right hot/ground for the speakers. They sent me two PDF files that contain the schematics for the electrical box I have been discussing AND the Speaker Select Switch that is above the stereo AND the following:

*****************IMPORTANT INFORMATION********************

"The (2) prints in PDF format should explain the design and function of
the circuit in question. The jack in the face of the switch plate would
not make any sense as to the way it is wired unless you know the history
of the item. I'm not sure who supplied the mono speaker, but the jack is
wired correctly except no ground wire is supplied for its usage at the
time of design. This is because it is a floating ground system and
cannot be directly grounded. The jack was provided for a wireless
headphone system which derived enough of a ground through itself to
function. You could run a separate chassis ground to the jack and use it
for headphones -IF- you isolate the left + and right + by running each
through a 5uf capacitor with the (-) toward the jack and the (+) toward
the 4 pin plug, headphones would work but the speaker never will. If you
don't isolate the positives and IF you use a (-) output from the radio
for ground side, the Radio will typically overheat and destruct. You can
of course use speakers if you observe the (+) & (-) for each pair per
the diagram Ignoring the jack."

*****************IMPORTANT INFORMATION********************

Glad I did not do anything to the wiring prior to getting this info! If anyone is interested in this info PM me and I can email them the PDF files; I have received permission from the manufacturer. This also explains why my headphones would not work. Now I can fix this with a bit of electronics and a soldering iron.

I also learned that the Aux In unit that accepts all the sound input was very interesting. It now has input from the TV, the CD changer, the sat radio (all use RCA connectors) and one more input jack. The 4th jack a USB slot for a computer connection. I plugged a USB cable from my laptop into it with the stereo output set to CDC4 (prior to plugging in the cable) and my computer popped up the "Found New Hardware" dialog. I would only do this with a connection to the internet; this way the computer was able to find the appropriate drives on the internet. Walaa. I now have USB speakers. I brought up my MusicMatch and found that it now showed USB speakers in addition to the audio device built into the computer under the Play tab of the Options window. It took MM a long time to come up when this was first done. Patience. I now can play any of my 65 GB of music on my computer through the stereo system in the trailer.

Now that the rear speaker cables from the radio were available I decided to make use of them. I have a small speaker system from Cambridge Soundworks that operates on110V AC or 12V DC that I have used for 10+ years to play sound from my computer. I installed the cables that will now let me plug it into the rear speaker jacks on the stereo. This will allow us to have surround sound from DVD,s. Cool. I can also use it with the line out jack once I get it rewired, instead of the the built in speakers in the trailer by using the selector switch at the stereo area where the line out jack is to control the trailer speakers and plugging my Cambridge speakers into the line out jack.

FYI, no sound from the stereo rear speaker cables unless there is Dolby sound to be decoded for them as far as I can tell.

Now, having said all this, I continue to get the hum from the sub woofer when a DVD is in the DVD player and the player is not playing. When the DVD is removed I get no hum.

My challenge now is to determine how to route the various cables from the stereo to the areas I want them for use with the computer and the Cambridge speakers. I have not looked at everything in this sub-forum for ideas for routing the cables and am open to ideas and things people have done to solve this issue.


Hope this may be of use to others.

Jim
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Old 12-13-2007, 12:43 PM   #28
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Haunted Stereo System??

After reading about the various, and strange noises, emanating from our new stereo systems.....I'm beginning to think they are possessed.....must be part of the "upgrade."

The most serious problem we have experienced with our new trailer, is the high-pitched noise from the two speakers over the dinette (the speakers over the bed are fine). What is weird is that it only occurs when the water heater is on......so far, our remedy has been to just not listen to the stereo while the heater is on! I've been dreading going into the wiring, etc. to find the source of the problem but know that I've got to do it sooner or later. Hopefully, one of our forum members, with more knowledge that me, will find a solution.

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Old 12-19-2007, 10:26 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by norsea
I was happy to find this thread mainly because ...serious snip...

Hope this may be of use to others.

Jim
Thanks for all this info, norsea...I am going to save it for future reference... when my head stops hurting from having read through it! You are braver than I am, tearing into all that spaghetti wiring!

We have the low purring sound only when we play a DVD and it is not present with all DVDs either... It doesn't bother me much...it's actually sort of endearing. We have a Sirus radio hook-up (factory) but no Sirus account, so we don't use it...wonder if that has something to do with it all...

Haunted by purrs...
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Old 12-20-2007, 09:51 AM   #30
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WARNING: Negative thoughts follow.
I must have somehow missed the start of this thread. Our Interstate has a JVC DVD/Radio/CD player and strange noises, but I always thought it was the program source.
The subwoofer is hidden under a thick cushion, with no direct radiation out into the listening space. After reading this thread, I'm almost convinced that the Airstream factory subcontracts out the installation of audio systems to a school for the deaf. (sorry)
I looked to see if the wiring was as screwed up as reported, and must report that it is. It's going to be FUN to try to fix this, someday.
So my question is: "Why did they bother to do this, anyway?" The Sprinter van has a pretty good radio system. Why spend the bucks and effort to do a shoddy job?
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Old 12-21-2007, 11:42 AM   #31
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Wait Wait - I remember something about this from the '60s. Does it sound like "Paul is dead"?

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Old 12-22-2007, 10:16 PM   #32
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Thanks for all this info...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TBRich
Thanks for all this info, norsea...I am going to save it for future reference... when my head stops hurting from having read through it! You are braver than I am, tearing into all that spaghetti wiring!

We have the low purring sound only when we play a DVD and it is not present with all DVDs either... It doesn't bother me much...it's actually sort of endearing. We have a Sirus radio hook-up (factory) but no Sirus account, so we don't use it...wonder if that has something to do with it all...

Haunted by purrs...
TB
TBRich - I am glad you found it of use.

I too was once terrified of all things electrical. Once I realized that all I need to know in order to read a simple wiring diagram was, "Battery seeks ground.", my life became much simpler. Without the wiring diagram at hand making determinations about how things should be is often times more than difficult.

I have one further problem that I forgot to mention in my somewhat long post, above. When we turn on either of the two spot lights mounted under the cabinet in which the radio is housed we get a humming noise through the speakers that varies in intensity based on the adjustment for the brightness of these lights when the radio is on and any of it capabilities are in use. Today I ordered a noise filter that I will install that should solve this problem. Both of the lights and the stereo are connected to the same wire that feeds the -12V DC from the circuit breaker panel; the filter will be installed in this line in line with the power connection for the radio. The one I have ordered I have used before in motorcycle applications so I know it will be able to withstand the rigors of being in a moving/bouncing vehicle.

I could not agree more with herrgirdner's question as to what the factory was thinking at the time of installation - "Why did they bother to do this, anyway?" Given the price of an Airstream these days sending something out with the sound system as poorly installed as ours is something that Airstream should be ashamed of. Just my not so humble opinion. Anyone in Jackson Center listening? Or, more importantly, care?

Jim
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Old 12-22-2007, 11:02 PM   #33
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Thanks for the additional notes, norsea...

An additional observation from this end...I find it interesting that no two people who have posted about the noise from the subwoofer (or where ever) have noted identical senarios or identical noises or sources of noises...which makes me think that there may not be any consistency behind the bad wiring job, and worst, each AS is probbaly miswired in a different way! YIKES! Imagine the permutations of bad wiring possiblities!

TB
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Old 12-23-2007, 09:36 AM   #34
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At the very least nice access panels and a diagram included with the upgrade would be helpful. Maybe that would justify the high audio/video upgrade expense. We have heard the hum/buzz listening with low volume and between discs although we have not taken the time to isolate the variables or try to troubleshoot yet. Had we wanted to do it ourselves we wouldn't have had to pay for the upgrade which we justified by thinking just have it done and done right and not have to monkey with it and save ourselves the hassles. My friend's new AS with external speakers never worked nor could be fixed by the dealer on her last unit. On her current unit I believe there were DVD/audio issues that the dealer was able to fix. On our last AS the LCD transformer box hung loose after the duct taping let loose and completely disconnected from the wires from the weight of it and the fridge had to be pulled out to allow access and the dealer secured the box with a better fix than tape and also moved it so we could reach it by running an arm up between the fridge and wall from the outside fridge door.

Just have to remind our vintage friends here that just because an AS comes from a showroom doesn't mean it isn't a project.
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Old 12-27-2007, 08:32 PM   #35
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Wiring woes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TBRich
Thanks for the additional notes, norsea...

An additional observation from this end...I find it interesting that no two people who have posted about the noise from the subwoofer (or where ever) have noted identical senarios or identical noises or sources of noises...which makes me think that there may not be any consistency behind the bad wiring job, and worst, each AS is probbaly miswired in a different way! YIKES! Imagine the permutations of bad wiring possiblities!

TB
Ya, but I'm not to convinced that the problems associated with the recent models are not the same.

I have done some more diagnostic work and discovered that the humming noise I am getting when the spot lights under the forward cabinet over the front sofa are turned on is coming only from the sub woofer; none of this noise is coming out of the wall mounted speakers.

This does not surprise me and I have to kick myself in the backside for not really realizing this in the first place. Why you might ask?

Well, the sub woofer is powered independently from the radio.

The Sony radio is fairly high end automotive item and I suspect that they have built in some sort of ignition/noise suppression; while the sub woofer is, IMNSHO, one of the cheapest things that can be found on the market.

When I disconnect the power to the sub woofer no more hum from anything.

I am very excited about hooking up the ignition/noise filter I have somewhere working its way slowly to our mail service. As soon as I can get it installed I will post my findings.

Jim
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Old 12-27-2007, 08:54 PM   #36
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Wiring Diagram

Quote:
Originally Posted by wheel interested
At the very least nice access panels and a diagram included with the upgrade would be helpful. Maybe that would justify the high audio/video upgrade expense. We have heard the hum/buzz listening with low volume and between discs although we have not taken the time to isolate the variables or try to troubleshoot yet. Had we wanted to do it ourselves we wouldn't have had to pay for the upgrade which we justified by thinking just have it done and done right and not have to monkey with it and save ourselves the hassles.

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Yes, the wiring diagram SHOULD be included. Once I get this all sorted and documented I plan on contacting the Airstream home office and trying to find someone to speak with about this. IMNHO it is absolutely inexcusable for a product that is marketed as THE top of the line travel trailer to be sent out of the factory with a sound system in the condition ours (and others based on this thread) was.

Can you imagine a Prevost coach having this kind of issue?

And, the quality of the speakers installed with this unit are very, very poor.

Today I finished with the majority of the work with the installation of my Cambridge Soundworks sound system. I have had this unit for 10+ years. It started out life in my office so I could play CD;s on my computer. When we were working in Europe it was in my garage and connected a portable CD player. Now it is in our Airstream.

It has two small (4" x 4") speakers and a sub woofer. The sub woofer has the option of being powered by 110V AC or 12V DC. At the minute I have it powered by AC. Wonderful sound from the radio on all items: Radio, CD, DVD, TV, input from my MP3 player, input from my computer via a USB cable to the Aux-In master unit. No hmming/buzzing at all. And the sound is soooo much clearer.

Why oh why is Airstream not installing this type of system in the trailers? Cost? Hardly; this is a low end $100 unit. With inflation that might make it $150 today.

Once I receive the ignition/noise filter that I mentioned in previous posts I will use it to filter the power to this equipment and the cheap sub woofer Airstream installed. I expect that that will be the end of my noise problems. The filter, for what it's worth, is a whopping $15.00 item. Why doesn't Airstream install something like this?

It is probably too much to expect that anyone at the factory actually monitors this forum, to say nothing of reading this post, but I am the eternal optimist.

Jim
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Old 12-28-2007, 08:16 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by norsea

Well, the sub woofer is powered independently from the radio.

The Sony radio is fairly high end automotive item and I suspect that they have built in some sort of ignition/noise suppression; while the sub woofer is, IMNSHO, one of the cheapest things that can be found on the market.

When I disconnect the power to the sub woofer no more hum from anything.
Jim
Jim,
I have found that the noise in the stereo gets worse when the Converter kicks in. I wanted to put a choke on the Leads from the converter to stop all the noise in the trailer. The clip on models will probably not work. A Large Capacitor may work. I think the best solotion is putting a choke on the power lead of the stereo and sub woofer. That MAY take care of the problem. If the speaker wires were run with the other DC and AC wires there may be coupling in side the walls.
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Old 12-30-2007, 06:51 PM   #38
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Converter contributing to noise???

Quote:
Originally Posted by thecatsandi
Jim,
I have found that the noise in the stereo gets worse when the Converter kicks in. I wanted to put a choke on the Leads from the converter to stop all the noise in the trailer. The clip on models will probably not work. A Large Capacitor may work. I think the best solotion is putting a choke on the power lead of the stereo and sub woofer. That MAY take care of the problem. If the speaker wires were run with the other DC and AC wires there may be coupling in side the walls.
Right you are about the possibility of induction re; the speaker wires.

I am going to try the filter first at the power lead to the sub woofer. Why? I have now completed the install of my 110AC powered sub woofer and speakers. No more noise in anything. If the radio was the culprit I suspect that I would be getting some noise with this set up.

I hope to have the 12V DC power for this speaker set up (it runs on either 110AC or 12V DC) connected in a day or two. I suspect that I will get some distortion with this but will remain optimistic.

I should have the filter by mid week.

Jim
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Old 01-06-2008, 08:49 AM   #39
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Progress Summary of "Strange Noises from the Stereo"

When starting this thread, I was not expecting such a number of similar complaints!

Based on your comments and actions, I have investigated the spaghetti and generally now understand where everything goes. There are a couple of diagrams in the stereo documentation that helped out.

I put in two Radio Shack noise filters, making the spaghetti worse But it made no difference.

However, after hours of unplugging/plugging, tracing, ground-checking, etc., some preliminary conclusions are:

* Noise from subwoofer is related to the motors in the CD/DVD players. I can stop the noise by turning the system off, then going to FM tuner. However, if I play a CD (either in the 10 CD player or the stereo head) in it starts. Then it continues even when going back to tuner. I can also stop it by unplugging the control cable to the 10 CD player. No difference if I unplug inputs or outputs.

* Noise from stereo (high pitched whine) sounds like a motor noise from inside the stereo head feeding through the amplifier. This only occurs once in a while, but is pervasive when it does. It is related to the internal CD player.

My preliminary conclusion is that it is in the stereo head, not the subwoofer, and not in the wiring. Other than having the subwoofer in the wrong input, the wiring looks ok. (Changin those inputs made no difference). There is a solid ground.

So based on this:

* noise from both players through control cable
* noise can be stopped by leaving players off
* additional motor noise from stereo head

Its back to calling the dealer to investigate the stereo head and its power/ground connections. I hope to get authorization to take it to a
local stereo shop.

But again, I know only a moderate amount about stereo's, so could be
wrong again... But it was fun hanging out in the unit, taking a nap.... Even though it is covered with snow...
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:53 AM   #40
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A little update from one of my other threads. My converter died andwas replace with an intelipower 9600 series. The noise is substancially less.
The converter was most of the problem.
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