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Old 10-23-2020, 12:54 PM   #1
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2019 28' International
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Victron 712 Install

Adding a Victron 712 monitor - no solar but want to better track Amp and Voltage usage.

28' International Rear Twin

2 6V batteries wired in series.

Does it matter where the Shunt is installed as long as it is in a direct line with a Battery Ground?

Specifically, the easiest place to attach it is the Black Ground wire between the Battery and Inverter.

The DC Panel is on the front wall under the couch and I cant fit under the couch, much less access the area without disassembling the couch, I also can't locate the Ground Bus Bar. The line to the Inverter seemed like the next best location.


Mark
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Old 10-23-2020, 01:02 PM   #2
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It needs to be battery -> shunt -> Negative leads for all loads and chassis. There can be only one path from the battery that the shunt is on if you want to measure all in/out on the battery.
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Old 10-23-2020, 01:48 PM   #3
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Thanks for the quick response. I guess my issue is that there are 2 separate entry points into the trailer from the Batteries. 1 Pair (Pos and Neg) goes directly to Inverter and the other Pair (Pos and Neg) go into the trailer and I assume the Pos goes into the DC Panel and Neg goes to the Ground Bus Bar but cant verify that because I don't fit under the couch to get to the panel.

Guess I need a skinny kid to crawl under there.
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Old 10-23-2020, 02:22 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalkcreek View Post
Thanks for the quick response. I guess my issue is that there are 2 separate entry points into the trailer from the Batteries. 1 Pair (Pos and Neg) goes directly to Inverter and the other Pair (Pos and Neg) go into the trailer and I assume the Pos goes into the DC Panel and Neg goes to the Ground Bus Bar but cant verify that because I don't fit under the couch to get to the panel.

Guess I need a skinny kid to crawl under there.
I think quite a few folks try and mount it in the box with the batteries, but the circuit board on the shunt is not at all weatherproof. So if you can find a way to mount all that in something that is weather proof and put the shunt in the battery box you'll be in good shape. For my install, I am doing lithium in the trailer so it's a much easier problem to solve. Perhaps someone on here who has done the install in the battery box can help with an answer.
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Old 10-23-2020, 02:44 PM   #5
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Mark, ALL negative loads must pass through the shunt. Just putting the inverter load through the shunt will not see any other loads from the 12V system.

Here are two ways to do it. Not sure of your layout, but you likely will have to uncover the work area to get at the front left corner of the trailer interior where all the wiring converges, by removing or partially disassembling some furniture to get to everything easily and safely. It's not as intimidating as it might seem once you figure out the right screws to remove. This is not something to have a skinny kid crawling in there to hook up :-)

Option 1. Replace the two wires from the battery box with one new 2 AWG wire to the battery side of the shunt which should be mounted inside (not weather proof). (I presume your current wires are 4awg to the inverter and 6 awg to 12v negative bus. You need to increase the size of the wire if you switch to just one, to carry the load of the 12V and the Inverter at the same time.)

Then reuse the 4AWG wire, hooking it from the load side of the shunt to the inverter fuse, and reuse the 6AWG wire from load side of shunt to negative bus.

This method makes it easy to also add a dedicated battery ON/OFF switch to use when in storage. Just put the switch somewhere inside on the new 2 AWG wire between the battery and the shunt.

Option 2 (Avoids having to pull new wire through the floor from the batteries). Move the 4AWG inverter wire from the batteries that currently goes to the inverter fuse, to the battery side of the shunt. Also move the 6AWG 12v house wire that currently goes to the negative bus, also to the battery side of the shunt.

Then run two new wires from the load side of shunt: a 4AWG wire to inverter fuse and a 6AWG to the 12v neg bus.

Either way you will need to make or purchase new wires with appropriate connectors.

If neither of those are an option, then you *could* figure out a place in the box (if it fits) that you could have both neg wires go through the shunt, but as mentioned it needs to be weatherproof. Also you will need to go through the floor penetration to run the telephone wire from the shunt to the monitor. Unless you tried to put the monitor outside too. My vote is to it right the first time and use option 1 or 2 above.
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:01 PM   #6
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PC, OK I conceded and disassembled the lounge.

So my best bet is to run a 2ga ground from the battery to the inside/behind the lounge. Mount the shunt, connect the new 2ga to the battery side then the original 4ga Inverter ground and 4ga Battery ground to the load side of the shunt.

Correct?
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:02 PM   #7
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:12 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Chalkcreek View Post
So my best bet is to run a 2ga ground from the battery to the inside/behind the lounge. Mount the shunt, connect the new 2ga to the battery side then the original 4ga Inverter ground and 4ga Battery ground to the load side of the shunt.
Correct?
That's correct for option 1. (Though I believe the existing wire to the 12V neg bus is 6 AWG and not 4 AWG. Just be sure before you purchase connectors that you'll be adding to the shunt end of the wires. You will need a crimping tool of some type. A simple 'hammer' type crimper is fine to get this done.

Or at this point, option 2 is fine as well if you want to avoid crawling on your back under the trailer pulling out the old wires to the batteries and reinstalling a new 2AWG wire from the batteries.
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:21 PM   #9
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Yes, battery neg is 6ga (from schematic). Iím thinking through my attack plan. will ask more if I get stuck

Thanks again I really appreciate it
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:28 PM   #10
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on the -ve side,
as close to the battery as possible
large dia copper wire so as not to lose power
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:32 PM   #11
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So on option 2. Itís not a problem having 2 wires connected to the Battery side of the shunt and 2 wires connected to the load side?

Also, when you say house wire Iím assuming you are referring to the ground wire from the Battery to the Neg Bus.
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:53 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Chalkcreek View Post
So on option 2. It’s not a problem having 2 wires connected to the Battery side of the shunt and 2 wires connected to the load side?

Also, when you say house wire I’m assuming you are referring to the ground wire from the Battery to the Neg Bus.
No problem at all. The shunt doesn't know if it's one big wire or two smaller wires. I have put three on the load side (Inverter, House and Solar) using option 1. The only limitation is how many lugs can fit on the bolt.

Yes on question 2.
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Old 10-23-2020, 03:56 PM   #13
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Old 10-23-2020, 04:37 PM   #14
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This dialog was very helpful; thanks!
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Old 10-23-2020, 07:17 PM   #15
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PCSkier youíve been more help than I could have hoped for, thanks again.


Finished up nice and clean, lounge and cubby back together. Surprisingly difficult to find a 6ga cable but after 3 stops did get one.
Bonus - only 3 screws left over

Tomorrow Iíll try to get settings for the app from Lifeline.
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Old 10-23-2020, 09:09 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Chalkcreek View Post
PCSkier youíve been more help than I could have hoped for, thanks again.

Finished up nice and clean, lounge and cubby back together. Surprisingly difficult to find a 6ga cable but after 3 stops did get one.
Bonus - only 3 screws left over

Tomorrow Iíll try to get settings for the app from Lifeline.
You're welcome, nice job. Those three screws were probably there already rolling around from the factory
Check back in when you're ready to add solar. If you added this gear to monitor usage, then it's a foregone conclusion what your next step is going to be. Seeing negative amps when boondocking while the sun is shining will drive you out of your mind. Seeing positive amps all day even while using loads and knowing your batteries are charged or charging will rock your world.
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