Deep Cycle or AGM battery thoughts needed!

[Jtom]

Stay with the deep cell wet....I upgraded to AGM Optima and a year latter they are dead, $500 for two, still under warranty, but went ahead and replace with two wet cell from Walmart, $160.00 for two....My opinion AGM are not worth it. I purchased them because I was told no maintance, not true or worth it if they cant hold a charge.

[tjdonahoe]

Our interstates do just fine..5-6 years

[Ky76Argosy]

I likewise customarily use Argosy like you. Interstate deep cycle flooded battery has worked for me, cheaper cost, And I don’t take care of battery like others profess. Dang just charge and check as believe needs. Remove during winter and use trickle charge. Reinstall.Go.

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by guskmg

Five years ago, I too went with lithiums, solar, and an inverter/charger. Today, I realize that system is by far cheaper and more reliable than either the flooded cell or AGM systems in the long run. Zero worries and complete reliability.
guskmg

Hi

I'm very much on the lithium lovers side of this. However, if you can get a pair of deep cycle flooded cells at Costco for $140 to $180 *and* they last you 5+ years (in your use situation) .... that's really hard to argue with. In 20 years, you will have spend < $700 on batteries.

.... and yes, I do know folks who get 5+ years out of those Costco batteries. Their usage case (almost never on battery) and mine are *very* different ...

Bob

[michaelstano]

I was set to buy 2 Costco 6v batteries until I read the reviews. I'm not sure I have ever seen more negative reviews than those for this product.

[bubba98042]

I just swapped out my AGMs for a 206 amp hour lithium SOK battery. Airstream wanted $4500 plus tax for their setup I did mine for around 1800. It is almost plug-in compatible. Changed the go-power charge controller that connects my solar panels to the batteries so that I could have a lifepo4 charge profile Battery cost me $1050. I also added a Victron smart shunt to give me real time status via a Bluetooth app. Works great. Tried it out on our last outing 4 night 5 day trip. Never saw battery lower than 94%. Pretty pleased so far.
If any one is interested please email me and I would be happy to post pictures and text explaining why I made some of the choices.
Main premise was to make this change with the minimal amount of Airstream wiring change. Which was achieved.

Although my AGMs were under warranty I got tired of take ing it back to the dealership. Did it twice and the AGM would not even run the furnace for 6 hours. Without anything else running. Each time they told me that the battery manufacturer had checked out the batteries and they were fine. Complete hogwash. I think the battery service center was giving me and the airstream service guys a story.
Cheers and safe and happy camping. VK.

[smithcreek]

I'm amazed that the number of responses by people who appear to have actually read your post and considered your circumstances is nearly equal to the number of people who whose response is to recommend the same very expensive solution they used regardless of what your needs are. This might be the first time this has ever happened here at Airforums.

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

I'm very much on the lithium lovers side of this. However, if you can get a pair of deep cycle flooded cells at Costco for $140 to $180 *and* they last you 5+ years (in your use situation) .... that's really hard to argue with. In 20 years, you will have spend < $700 on batteries.

.... and yes, I do know folks who get 5+ years out of those Costco batteries. Their usage case (almost never on battery) and mine are *very* different ...

Bob

Hi

Ok so a bit more confusion. The "cheap" Costco batteries are 12V flooded cells from who knows who. The only big deal is that they do need to be deep cycle rated batteries. The price varies with the price of raw lead (all lead acid prices do the same). In normal times, $70 each is not that uncommon a price ...

Bob

[jcanavera]

My Costco by me sells Interstate batteries for about $87 each. Quite honestly I get about 4-6 years from my batteries and I always camp at sites with electric hookups. The only time they truly come into use is when I'm hitching up and setting up, or when there is an occasional power loss at a campground. No need in my opinion to go for anything better based on the way I use my Airstream.

What I find interesting is that I think most of the "deep cycle" batteries I see at the local stores are truly in my eyes, a hybrid. They are labeled marine/rv but seem to have automotive aspects in their construction and ratings. I think a true deep cycle battery is never used for starting an engine and like many have noted are much like golf cart batteries.

Bottom line the key for the flood cell batteries is proper hydration and keeping them on trickle chargers during the off season.

Jack

[civeng99]

Battle Born makes an absolutely AWESOME lithium product. Tops for boondocking. Set it and forget it.

[gypsydad]

4th AS in 18 years...departed from 12V on currant AS when they gave out after 2 months when new...installed Trojan T105 6V; have 80W portable solar. No issues in 4 years now...very happy with the choice. Love to go LI but need to be mindful of the cold weather and of course, the $$ also!

[BandLAir]

I don't think it's AGM vs Deep Cycle. AGM batteries are generally deep cycle units. It's really lead-acid wet-cell vs AGM (still lead acid) vs LiFePO4. Just be aware that each requires a different charging profile, so you have to make sure your battery charger has a compatible mode, or can be programmed correctly, for the type of battery.

[civeng99]

It is completely impossible to tow with anything “less than” a one ton with a diesel. Haha.

Originally Posted by smithcreek

I'm amazed that the number of responses by people who appear to have actually read your post and considered your circumstances is nearly equal to the number of people who whose response is to recommend the same very expensive solution they used regardless of what your needs are. This might be the first time this has ever happened here at Airforums.

[Peter417]

Originally Posted by civeng99

It is completely impossible to tow with anything “less than” a one ton with a diesel. Haha.

You better check your tongue weight with that. You are going to be over weight and you will murder babies if you try to tow with that one ton.

[Spinonedad]

How do AGM do in freezing weather ?

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by Spinonedad

How do AGM do in freezing weather ?

The same as a flooded lead acid battery. As long as it's charged, it wont freeze in sub arctic temps. Capacity reduces as a function of declining temps, also similar to FLA batteries.

[jimdelane]

Lithium Deep Cycle batteries have better performance in below freezing applications

Temperature - has a direct impact on how much capacity or energy is available to you. Lithium Batteries are less affected by temperature than LA/AGM batteries.
The graph shows the lithium battery higher capacity at lower temps. Combine this with the higher voltage provides a better battery. The cost of usable amp hours lithium vs AGM is getting close to the same with significant longer life and the ability to remain in a partially discharged state indefinitely without damage.

Graph by GWL Power
https://gwl-power.tumblr.com/image/137013474691

The graph shows the test result data for LiFePO4 technology versus AGM lead-acid batteries. With temperatures below 0°C or 32F the capacity of the lead-acid technology is dropping significantly. Also the lead-acid (AGM) technology looses 40% of energy (@20°C) when discharged with higher C-rates (the graph for 1 C is shown).

Both lead acid and lithium batteries are affected by frozen conditions. As a battery discharges the electrolyte binds to the lead plate (sulphation). It dilutes the electrolyte and allows it to freeze which will destroy the battery. If a lithium battery is charged below freezing it will damage the cells. Quality lithium battery BMS have low temp charge protection to prevent this from happening. Both lead acid and lithium batteries can be used in conditions up to -4F.

Sources for quality lithium batteries include:
AMPS Lithium
https://lithiummarinebattery.com/shop

Battle Born Batteries
http://www.battlebornbatteries.com/

LiFeBlue Battery
http://www.lifebluebattery.com

ReLion
https://relionbattery.com/products/lithium

SmartBattery
https://www.lithiumion-batteries.com...-rv-deep-cycle

[waninae39]

best to go with Lion . lower TCO over 10 years

Battle Born Batteries is what we use
http://www.battlebornbatteries.com/

[TKCamper]

I purchased two of the Costco AGM Interstate batteries,I think they were $140 each. The first set last me about 6 months before losing storage capacity the second set only last 4 months before I took them back to Costco. Luckily Costco has a good refund policy as it I did get all my money back. I purchased two Battleborn batteries and I could not be happier.

My AGM batteries were group 24 and only had 70 amp hours of which 35 amp hours are usable ( not even considering the Pukert effect on lead acid batteries). Battleborn batteries are on sale now for $849 with the storage power as almost three of my AGM batteries. It would cost me $420 worth of AGM batteries from Costco to give me the battery storage of 1 lithium battery. Not to mention Lithium batteries will last 15 to 20. The long term cost of lithium will be less than lead acid batteries, the upfront cost is a hard pill to swallow though.

[waninae39]

IMHO, initial cost in not that relevant.

The TCO ( total cost of ownership) over the lifetime/ how many years you will use is the better measure of value.

i.e go to any auto garage and look at the tools they use, snap on, Grey, MAC tools etc are very expensive up front, but come with lifetime warrantee.

what auto mechanic is willing to use cheap tools that break easily while having a busy schedule getting cars fixed.

the same with my AS. why would i buy limited life/capacity and cheaper batteries vs, ones that i don't need to worry about and enjoy my AS life

my 2cents as an engineer