additional post for Lifeline batteries

[bluegrass]

I am going to replace the Interstate batteries in my 2005 AS with Lifeline group 24 batteries (I do not want to move them or alter the battery box for larger batteries). The Lifeline batteries have single posts. Is there an add-on adapter that will give me an additional post for other devices? Perhaps one that will attach to the main posts? My old Interstate batteries had dual posts and I would like to duplicate that connection as best as possible while using the better Lifeline batteries. Thanks in advance.

[Bruce B]

The Group 24 Lifeline that came in our Bambi had screw on posts with a bolt that threaded into that post for extra wires to connect to. I believe that all Lifeline group 24's have this feature. You could check the lifeline website, they have detailed drawings for each battery.
Bruce

[bryanl]

re: "while using the better Lifeline batteries." -- curious as to what measure is being used for this assessment.

Price - about double. Expected lifespan - about 1.5 times as long. Capacity - a bit on the low end of energy density by weight curve. Maintenance free - that's more equipment supporting the battery than the battery itself.

[Bruce B]

Originally Posted by bryanl

re: "while using the better Lifeline batteries." -- curious as to what measure is being used for this assessment.

Price - about double. Expected lifespan - about 1.5 times as long. Capacity - a bit on the low end of energy density by weight curve. Maintenance free - that's more equipment supporting the battery than the battery itself.

Bryani,

I have read some of your previous posts on this subject and I am curious about your exposure to these batteries. Have you ever used them? I ask only because in my experience sailing they far surpass anything else I have tried when subjected to what I call “real life” treatment. Way more than double the life span with more capacity, voltage and actual seasons before needing replacement.
I have personally used Surette's, Gell's, Interstate deep cycle lead acids and by far the best have been my Lifelines. They just flat out refuse to die.
Now before you get upset with me let me be the first to acknowledge that the use on my sailboat is somewhat different than that the Airstream will be seeing and perhaps the advantages will be less apparent in this application. It will be similar enough though that I sprung for them and I am not trying to spend money needlessly.
I also have the ability to purchase them at a substantial discount through my business so I am not paying full price....
Just curious,
Bruce

[ROBERT CROSS]

Price, about double...
Lifespan, about 1.5...
Capacity, a bit low...
Maintenance free, equipment needed...

Now that's a precise measure...even by my sub-standards.

Disclaimer...I too use Lifelines, and appreciate the benefits.

Our's have a top bolt that can be used for aux connections.

Bob

[bluegrass]

Other than mostly positive comments made by people on the forum and the fact that batteries made by the Concorde company are commonly found in both military and civilian aircraft (including the small ones I have flown), I have no basis of comparison directly. But I am comfortable with the higher price regardless. I appreciate all the feedback. I found a photo online that showed the additional connections on the existing posts. I also changed out the converter to a 3-stage model which I have read is better than the single stage models that came with my Safari. Thanks ya'll.

[bryanl]

re: "Bryani, I have read some of your previous posts on this subject and I am curious about your exposure to these batteries"

re: "Now that's a precise measure..."

interesting. instead of responding to the measures, the person is questioned and then the precision of the generalities is questioned.

For cost, I use the local battery store. For expected calendar life, I use the NAWS FAQ. For weight density, I use manufacturer line cards. For maintenance, I use the BICS cause of failure statistics as well as various FAQ's that describe the nature of battery service health.

Precision is also a factor because it needs to match the accuracy of measure. When it comes to batteries, things such as age, temperature, cycle to cycle variances, and use profile can each influence measures by 10% or more.

I also changed out the converter to a 3-stage model which I have read is better than the single stage models

this is likely to do more for your battery service satisfaction than nearly any other equivalent expenditure could do by quite a wide margin.

[Bruce B]

Originally Posted by bryanl

re: "Bryani, I have read some of your previous posts on this subject and I am curious about your exposure to these batteries"

re: "Now that's a precise measure..."

interesting. instead of responding to the measures, the person is questioned and then the precision of the generalities is questioned.

For cost, I use the local battery store. For expected calendar life, I use the NAWS FAQ. For weight density, I use manufacturer line cards. For maintenance, I use the BICS cause of failure statistics as well as various FAQ's that describe the nature of battery service health.

Precision is also a factor because it needs to match the accuracy of measure. When it comes to batteries, things such as age, temperature, cycle to cycle variances, and use profile can each influence measures by 10% or more.



this is likely to do more for your battery service satisfaction than nearly any other equivalent expenditure could do by quite a wide margin.

I am still not sure what your actual experience with Lifeline batteries is....
I am not questioning that you may understand more than I do on this subject but I still wonder if you have used these batteries. I have my own experience and I tend to rely on it. You still have an opportunity to "show me the light" that is exactly why I post my observations. No disrespect intended here....
BTW did you see my post on Parallax's response to the use of a three step charger? That one has me very curious!
Cheers,
Bruce

[ROBERT CROSS]

"Nothing is more discouraging than unappreciated sarcasm."

Bob

[bryanl]

re: "I am still not sure what your actual experience with Lifeline batteries is...." -- usually, it is the facts of the matter that are considered a better standard. Personalities and such things, especially in forums like this, are normally frowned upon. Someone who depends upon their 'experience' or 'expertise' rather than on facts and measure should stimulate skepticism.

re: "I have my own experience and I tend to rely on it." -- the real question is how to fit one's personal experience into the broader reality. Take the points I mentioned, based on real world measurement: does your experience clearly contradict them? If so, the question is why. Exploring that question could be enlightening. (and my experience, going back 15 years with AGM's does not)

re: "Nothing is more discouraging than unappreciated sarcasm." -- sarcasm is another of those things often frowned upon in this media as it is so easily misunderstood. It's use is often an indication of denial or other unpleasant emotional state.

[Bruce B]

Originally Posted by bryanl

re: "I am still not sure what your actual experience with Lifeline batteries is...." -- usually, it is the facts of the matter that are considered a better standard. Personalities and such things, especially in forums like this, are normally frowned upon. Someone who depends upon their 'experience' or 'expertise' rather than on facts and measure should stimulate skepticism.

re: "I have my own experience and I tend to rely on it." -- the real question is how to fit one's personal experience into the broader reality. Take the points I mentioned, based on real world measurement: does your experience clearly contradict them? If so, the question is why. Exploring that question could be enlightening. (and my experience, going back 15 years with AGM's does not)

re: "Nothing is more discouraging than unappreciated sarcasm." -- sarcasm is another of those things often frowned upon in this media as it is so easily misunderstood. It's use is often an indication of denial or other unpleasant emotional state.

In general I understand your reticence to rely on "hearsay". The internet is full of lots of “experts” who do more damage than help. I often have to lead a customer gently away from an idea he or she found on-line…. On the other hand “facts” are often misunderstood or used for arguments with overly simplistic models and this can be equally misleading.
You and I can disagree about AGM batteries and I suspect that in the rather complex model of how we actually use our trailers we may both be correct. I do enjoy the conversation….
Bruce

[ROBERT CROSS]

bryanl,

Lighten up a little....re: -- sarcasm is another of those things often frowned upon in this media as it is so easily misunderstood. It's use is often an indication of denial or other unpleasant emotional state.

You frown, I prefer to smile.



"It's not denial. I'm just selective about the reality I accept."

Bob

[bluegrass]

Thanks to all of you who were so generous with your knowledge, wisdom and experience with the Lifeline Group 24 batteries. They are being delivered next week.

[mok]

I hooked mine up on my AS using bolts that screw into the top of the posts. I did have to have a new connector made because the screws were larger than the holes on my red cable.

[tpi]

I have West Marine AGM, four years old. If for no other reason than they're the first four year old lead acid battery I've owned of any kind which has stayed entirely leak free, I love them. They are perfectly clean and dry. There is no acid splatters, corrosion, maintenance at all in the battery area (!)

Next time I'll go to the Lifelines. Question: Will the late model battery box take anything bigger than 24? Evidently not, but just checking...

[Gene]

tpi,

In our 2008 25', Lifeline Series 27 fit if you cut back the lip under the hinge for the door. The door hinge comes off easily. Cutting back the lip is a bit more work. A Sawzall with a carbide blade would work. Bigger batteries than those may require raising the door.

But all battery brands of a series are not necessarily the same size, so check dimensions of them before you buy them.

Gene

[ROBERT CROSS]

I also have Lifeline 27's in our 04 Classic, in this style box. The HB optional.

Bob

[bluegrass]

I finished installing the Group 24 Lifelines in my 2005 Safari. They fit perfectly and all the connections were inline with the original batteries-no retro fits necessary. As someone said, there are "secondary" connections on the main posts to accommodate the jumpers and the "hot" wire to the trailer systems. It is a perfect match to the 3 stage converter I installed at the end of last season. I used a small piece of metal with a hole drilled in the middle to hold the batteries in place with the retaining bolt between the two batteries (the original wing nut was too large and prevented the compartment from closing)
Thanks for all the help everyone!

[Gene]

I did the same thing as bluegrass did to hold down the batteries properly, except I cut a round piece of plywood. I had scraps, easy to cut and doesn't conduct electricity.

Gene

[tpi]

Gene were you able to use the plastic tray in the bottom with your 27s?