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Old 10-22-2002, 11:49 AM   #21
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Red generator

Smily, thanks anyway. I have checked out the Mayberry's web site and the pictures of the Honda generators show them to be red. The EU 2000 is listed as 20 inches by 11.4 inches by 16.7 inches. I suspect that might fit nicely. Could you tell if they used some type of insulation or how they might have dealt with the exhaust issue?
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Old 10-22-2002, 12:31 PM   #22
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Question I dream of Genny with the lite quiet air

A few questions please.

1.)Is a 'genset' the same thing as a 'generator' ?

2.)Do any of your gens have Briggs engines? Tecumsehs? Clintons?

3.)What and where is Mayberrys?

4.)Where and how do you plug into your trailer circuits?

FrankR. once posted that he pluged into an existing wall outlet. i.e. on the trailer side of the panel. I asked what effect this would have on the panel and its breaker system if there was an overload or a short. He removed his posts and did not answer my question. Any thoughts about hooking up in that manner?
(FrankR. was talking about an inverter, but he said that the 'genny' could be done the same way).

5.) If feeding thru wall outlet...What in tarnation would happen if someone inadvertanly pluged in to 'genny' and shore power at same time?

6.) Where is tarnation anyway?
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Old 10-22-2002, 12:59 PM   #23
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Re: Red generator

Quote:
Originally posted by bhsl8
Smily, thanks anyway. I have checked out the Mayberry's web site and the pictures of the Honda generators show them to be red. The EU 2000 is listed as 20 inches by 11.4 inches by 16.7 inches. I suspect that might fit nicely. Could you tell if they used some type of insulation or how they might have dealt with the exhaust issue?
Brouck
Brouck,
I sure wouldn't cut into the side of my trailer to install a generator in the back side of the credenza, much less have to remove it to fuel it (gravity fed)... it would have to be converted to LP fuel. And even if I did, it would be in a fireproof sound-insulated metal box installed in the credenza that was sealed air tight (read CO tight) to the inside of the trailer. You sure wouldn't see the generator inside in the credenza. The seal from the box to the outside of the trailer would have to be flexible so the box wouldn't transmit vibration to the skin and loosen the rivets.

Check between your LP bottles and the trailer. Keep in mind the Honda is narrower at the top where the trailer gets closer to the bottles. I have a useless (since it isn't lockable nor weathertite) toolbox in the A-frame there a 2000 would sit on nicely. And it's right there with the gas bottles if you were considering converting to LP. Problem is, the 120V breaker box and 23' power cord (where you'd want to mount a transfer switch) is at the other end of the trailer. I'd probably just use my current 30A RV extension cord (you DO have one?) and 30A RV female to 30A twist-lock male adapter to get the power cord up to the tongue so it couldn't be plugged into shore power and the generator at the same time, and not need a transfer switch.

I REALLY like the idea of using a 6 gallon outboard motor tank with a generator. like Bob did. I'm not sure if the LP bottle cover would support it's 40lb weight, but as he noted it has to be higher than the generator. Maybe I'd put the gas tank on the tongue and sit the generator on the ground below it.

Just some thoughts...
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Old 10-22-2002, 01:41 PM   #24
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Re: I dream of Genny with the lite quiet air

Quote:
Originally posted by hex
A few questions please.

1.)Is a 'genset' the same thing as a 'generator' ?
Yes.

Quote:
2.)Do any of your gens have Briggs engines? Tecumsehs? Clintons?
Although these are in a lot of generators, they're generally way too loud for campground use.

Quote:
3.)What and where is Mayberrys?
Mayberry's is a power equipment seller who has good mail-order pricing and free shipping. Click the link to find where they are located.

Quote:
4.)Where and how do you plug into your trailer circuits?
The generators have a 30A twist-lock plug. You get an adapter cord that provides a 30A female RV receptacle and plug your trailer power cord into that.

Quote:
FrankR. once posted that he pluged into an existing wall outlet. i.e. on the trailer side of the panel. I asked what effect this would have on the panel and its breaker system if there was an overload or a short. He removed his posts and did not answer my question. Any thoughts about hooking up in that manner?
(FrankR. was talking about an inverter, but he said that the 'genny' could be done the same way).
To plug the generator into a female outlet on the trailer would require the cord have an exposed male plug that would be hot, and dangerous if it ever fell out while the generator was running.

Quote:
5.) If feeding thru wall outlet...What in tarnation would happen if someone inadvertanly pluged in to 'genny' and shore power at same time?
If you have the generator hooked up to the trailer at the same time as shore power, you have to use something called a transfer switch. It disconnects the shore power line when the generator is running so your generator doesn't electrocute some lineman who's working on what he thinks is a dead line.

Quote:
6.) Where is tarnation anyway?
Dunno... are they touring now? Maybe their tour schedule is at their website.
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Old 10-22-2002, 03:53 PM   #25
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I owned a Coleman generator with a Briggs & Stratton 10 hp engine as a backup power source. It worked great but the noise level was horrible. After getting my trailer I decided I would never subject any camper to the unpleasant experience of having to listen to it. I purchased the Supper Quit EX4500 Honda. It is so much quieter than the old Coleman. I was exercising the Honda one afternoon as a neighbor across the street was mowing his lawn. Standing next to my generator I could hear his lawn mower over my generator. The EX4500 has plenty of electrical capacity but it is big and heavy. It works for me because I have a PU and can leave it in the back. I think going the Honda EU2000 route would be better and cheaper even with purchasing 2 units and the connecting cable.

Larry Ruebel
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Old 10-22-2002, 04:16 PM   #26
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Exclamation Life of Gennys little Engine

The reason I asked about Briggs Engines was this.
Last week I was buying some lawn-mower parts at a big small-engine wholesaler in Houston. The owner was telling me that the majority of Briggs engines were not worth overhauling. He said that the consumer lines were considered to be good for only about 400 hours maximum. And that with excellent care and maintenance under median conditions. (minimal dust and reasonable ambient temps and average homeowner per use time i.e. not commercial hour on end use). He said that thru the 1960's the hour maxs were more like 700+ hours on the consumer models.

He said that Briggs had a better model (Commercial) which I think he called their LS or LG line. He said they could be expected to last at least 1400 hours with care, and were worth rebuilding.
How many hours can the hondas and onans be expected to last? And are they practical to rebuild?

I never thought about the noise levels on gennys but am glad yall alerted me to it. Have you noticed folks using the old loud ones in camps?
And is the quiteness factor a big upcharge watt for watt?
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Old 10-22-2002, 04:32 PM   #27
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Quote:
6.) Where is tarnation anyway?

Dunno... are they touring now? Maybe their tour schedule is at their website.
Ask Paula

Shari
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Old 10-22-2002, 05:01 PM   #28
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hole size

Maurice, you've got me to thinkin'. Do I want to use a sawsall to make the hole in the side of the AS or should I use tin snips? Actually, your point is well taken. I envisioned something hermetically sealed in a case in such a way that CO would not be a factor with the exhaust perhaps going out through the bottom. I had not considered the the hassle of refueling nor had I considered the problem associated with the vibration and the rivets. Perhaps the site on the A-frame makes some sense but someone earlier mentioned the problem with changing the tongue weight. Is that something that needs to be considered? I suppose the simplest approach would just be to set it down on the ground and let it do its thing to charge the battery. If it weighs less than 50 pounds then I can throw around like a 12 pack.
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Old 10-22-2002, 05:30 PM   #29
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"If you have the generator hooked up to the trailer at the same time as shore power, you have to use something called a transfer switch. It disconnects the shore power line when the generator is running so your generator doesn't electrocute some lineman who's working on what he thinks is a dead line. "

us linemen thank you!

john
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Old 10-22-2002, 05:47 PM   #30
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you'll love this!

couple of years ago i went to a dairy farm on a no lights call. the farmer (in his 60's) was running his generator until i got there so he could finish milking.

his generator was a wwII vintage 25kw unit powered by a continental 6 cyl. gas engine, iron flathead.

it was so quiet the he had to tell me it was running, otherwise i would have never known. about the same as a car just off idle. it was running his whole farm and his house.

here is the part that raises hair on the back of my neck to this day. it was a straight 240 V unit, to convert it to 120/240 volt he had it connected to a 25 KVA power pole transformer on the secondary side.

that means that the transformer backfeeds while doing this, he had two bushings with 4160volts exposed where any one could walk up and touch it!

i asked him if he knew this and he said NO. he had this set up for 35 years and never had a second thought about it!

i promptly disconnected the leads inside the transformer for him so he wouldn't have a HUMAN BUG ZAPPER!!!!!!

he thanked me and went back to milking his cows.

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Old 10-22-2002, 07:13 PM   #31
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Brouck,
Not sure how this relates to your trailer but a late model 31' is 7200 lbs empty with a GVWR of 8700 lbs. That's 1500 lbs you can move around inside. You also have some flexibility with tongue weight which should be 10-12% or 720-864 lbs when empty to 870 to 1044 lbs when loaded to the max. Let's call it 55 lbs of added weight, and it's really not all the way up to the coupler. Not a big issue with tongue weight, where getting enough can sometimes be a problem.

I'll probably tote mine in the back of the truck and run 'em on the ground cabled to the trailer wheels... halfway between the bedroom and living room. Two of 'em on the tongue would probably cover the battery compartments.

John,
That's one scary story about the farmer!
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Old 10-23-2002, 05:32 AM   #32
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Maurice, that sounds good. You can tell I have a lot to learn. After all, I am from Wisconsin and you know how we handle electricity up here!
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Old 10-23-2002, 06:04 AM   #33
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onboard generator

I wanted to point out a thing or two about the generator I spoke of yesterday.

The generator was installed in a very expensive AS and it was certainly a professional job. I am certain that all of the safety concerns had been considered and safety devices were implemented.

There was insulation around the generator from the inside.

The fuel line was tapped into the refrigerator LP line, (since the reefer was right next to the credenza)

To prevent backfeed of electricity onto the service lines, one merely disconnects the trailer from the service connection,(hello).

The exhaust was routed to the skin of the trailer and the exhaust port looked just like the furnace exhaust port. ( someone mentioned concerns of a fire causing device within the skin of the trailer, I believe the furnace and the reefer are both within the AS. Hence the Term "self contained").

This was definitely the best solution that I have seen for an onboard generator. It was very aesthetic and out of site. It required no liquid fuel or mess there of. It had a switch for remote start and it was extremely quite.

A thief would never see it unlike a generator mounted on the toungue or some other place in view. A thief will have a master key, ( Bolt cutters) and he will not take very long to remove a generator.

Respectfully,
Smily



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Old 10-23-2002, 07:10 AM   #34
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Smily-

You are 100% right. It is attention to detail that determines the safety and quality of any installation. Nearly every motorhome and a lot of trailers have a generator, and they are within the interior of the vehicle. Properly sealed and mounted they are no more dangerous than the refrigerator running on propane. Both of these have to be treated as 'outside.' One of the biggest items the installation manual stresses is door and operable windows relative to exhaust. Mounting the generator on the tongue is OK for accessibility, but there has been no mention of where the exhaust will go with an open door or window. That is what I would worry about.

John
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Old 10-23-2002, 07:25 AM   #35
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Re: onboard generator

Quote:
Originally posted by smily
I wanted to point out a thing or two about the generator I spoke of yesterday.

To prevent backfeed of electricity onto the service lines, one merely disconnects the trailer from the service connection,(hello).
In most cases, this isn't a problem since you'll disconnect the power cord to plug it into a generator. If you permanently wire a generator into the trailer, with the power cord capable of plugging into shore power, you MUST use a transfer switch. To not do so is both negligent and violation of law.

Quote:
A thief would never see it unlike a generator mounted on the toungue or some other place in view. A thief will have a master key, ( Bolt cutters) and he will not take very long to remove a generator.
We had a relatively new motorhome in for insurance repair back when I worked in RVs. Overnight, the thieves had removed all the appliances, as well as the 7.5kW Onan from its compartment.

If they want it, they'll get it, and they don't care what they destoy in the process (there was a LOT of damage). Sometimes it's better to secure it just enough to stop the snatch and grab, and keep your insurance happy, than to use something like a cable they can't cut with bolt-cutters, and piss 'em off.

I agree a proper installation is just fine. Opening the credenza door and seeing a red generator isn't, IMHO.
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Old 10-23-2002, 09:27 AM   #36
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Alert Alert

Watch out for the camper cops!

I think the camper inspectors sent them............




JUST KIDDING! I couldnt resist.

Negligent maybe but I was not aware of laws concerning electrical generators in campers.

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Old 07-29-2003, 08:13 AM   #37
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Interested in paralleling generators

Quote:
Originally posted by RoadKingMoe


A 135 lb Honda EU3,000 (2,800W and 23.3A continous) will definitely power a 13,500 btu air conditioner which needs 20A (check the breaker to your AC).

One 49 lb Honda EU2000 (1,600W and 13.3A continous) cannot, but two of them can be run in parallel for 26.6A.

[snip]
About the parallel generator arrangement: how does that really work? Are there phasing considerations? How do you hook them up - are there OEM cables already made up? With receptacle, etc?

TIA for any further details you can provide.
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Old 07-29-2003, 10:34 AM   #38
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Yes - Honda makes the paralleling harness, but others have made their own at less cost - search the archives.

The generator's output is rectified to DC then inverted to AC, so the circuitry to keep two generators in-phase is built-in to the inverters.
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Old 07-29-2003, 11:46 AM   #39
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Originally posted by dmac
Yes - Honda makes the paralleling harness, but others have made their own at less cost - search the archives.

The generator's output is rectified to DC then inverted to AC, so the circuitry to keep two generators in-phase is built-in to the inverters.
Thanks. I visited the Mayberry's site, and they have a pretty good intro to the whole area of paralleling outputs from the Honda generators there. I was thinking that folks here were talking about paralleling output from generic generators, and could not see how that would work (in the general case).

At any rate, the Honda solution looks good to me - I like to stay cool in the summer!

BTW - how hard is it to pull start the EU2000? I have bum shoulder and wrist, and yanking on recalcitrant mowers, edgers, generators etc. is one of my least favorite activities...
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Old 07-29-2003, 05:31 PM   #40
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I have one of those 70s trailers with an onan propane generator.It turns over but never started. since I never had a trailer with a generater I didnt miss it .I think it would be nice to have running if it can be safe,and fixable. Never worked on a propane motor .any sugestions or should i just keep her a conversation piece ?
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