Is grounding portable generator necessary

[Rzrbrn]

smsasf, a 2 week wait is not bad considering most CW service departments are booked solid for a month or more. I went in to an AS dealer in...someplace out west, a larger and well known dealership, while traveling. I had ripped off my black waste valve and needed a bit of RV plumbing done. At most a 1 hour job. I know because that is how long it took me to do it after the dealership said, sure, no problem, we are five months back logged and will then schedule you. This after I noted I was traveling. They also did not have the part I needed. So I did it myself in the parking lot of a plumbing supply outlet.

[xyzabe]

Go to this site and read it. It will tell you how to safely ground your inverter with a N-G bond plug. You can make it yourself for about $3. Also you might want to subscribe to the No-Shock-Zone. Mike is recognized at THE authority on RV electric (AC and DC). Too many "experts" on forums know enough to get someone hurt or worse.

http://noshockzone.org/generator-gro...utral-bonding/

[Wazbro]

Originally Posted by MaineStreamer

So, I have learned from this conversation that I should not be putting plastic leveling pads under my stabilizer jacks and the front jack for the trailer, because the jacks serve as ground connections for the trailer. That is news to me.

I read this entire thread and didn't see anything that mentioned you shouldn't put plastic leveling pads under your stabilizer jacks and the front jack for the trailer so they could serve as a ground. It was only stated the stabilizer jacks and the front jack for the trailer had the potential to provide a ground.

[BayouBiker]

Originally Posted by xyzabe

Go to this site and read it. It will tell you how to safely ground your inverter with a N-G bond plug. You can make it yourself for about $3. Also you might want to subscribe to the No-Shock-Zone. Mike is recognized at THE authority on RV electric (AC and DC). Too many "experts" on forums know enough to get someone hurt or worse.

http://noshockzone.org/generator-gro...utral-bonding/

FYI, Ground-Neutral Bonding links ground and neutral but does not actually ground the generator. Travel trailers using generator power are safe without an effective earth ground though by design. There is no harm done by employing a ground but safety is not enhanced by any significant degree with a ground.

[Fair_Enough]

From OSHA:

Grounding Requirements for Portable and Vehicle-mounted Generators
Under the following conditions, OSHA directs (29 CFR 1926.404(f)(3)(i)) that the frame of a portable generator need not be grounded (connected to earth) and that the frame may serve as the ground (in place of the earth):

The generator supplies only equipment mounted on the generator and/or cordand plug-connected equipment through receptacles mounted on the generator, § 1926.404(f)(3)(i)(A), and
The noncurrent-carrying metal parts of equipment (such as the fuel tank, the internal combustion engine, and the generator’s housing) are bonded to the generator frame, and the equipment grounding conductor terminals (of the power receptacles that are a part of [mounted on] the generator) are bonded to the generator frame, § 1926.404(f)(3)(i)(B).
Thus, rather than connect to a grounding electrode system, such as a driven ground rod, the generator’s frame replaces the grounding electrode.

If these conditions do not exist, then a grounding electrode, such as a ground rod, is required.

If the portable generator is providing electric power to a structure (emphasis, mine) by connection via a transfer switch to a structure (home, office, shop, trailer, or similar) it must be connected to a grounding electrode system, such as a driven ground rod. The transfer switch must be approved for the use and installed in accordance with the manufacturer’s installation instructions by a qualified electrician.

Grounding requirements for generators connected via transfer switches are covered by Article 250 of the National Electrical Code (NEC)
WW

[smsasf]

Originally Posted by Rzrbrn

smsasf, a 2 week wait is not bad considering most CW service departments are booked solid for a month or more. I went in to an AS dealer in...someplace out west, a larger and well known dealership, while traveling. I had ripped off my black waste valve and needed a bit of RV plumbing done. At most a 1 hour job. I know because that is how long it took me to do it after the dealership said, sure, no problem, we are five months back logged and will then schedule you. This after I noted I was traveling. They also did not have the part I needed. So I did it myself in the parking lot of a plumbing supply outlet.

Rzrbrn, thanks for sharing the experience. I suppose I should get used to this. Obviously, these service wait periods are part of the down-side of RV ownership that is not clear when researching purchase. Well, I suppose if you dig deep enough you can discover. I suppose it is also a warning to prepare yourself yo become self sufficient. I fear having something major happen and not having access to an expensive RV for months because you cannot get service. And I wonder, what if it is warranty repair, per the new trailer warranty, am I still looking at months on a wait list. If that is the case and I experience having to wait months for warranty repairs I might start to regret having made the purchase.

[BayouBiker]

Just remember a trailer is just a mini home on wheels. Nearly all the major repairs except maybe the aluminum body can be done by automotive, welding, Home HVAC, home appliance. electrical, plumping folks.

This may just be me, but I'm hell bent on not dragging my trailer back to a dealer if I can help it.

[mikeoxlong]

Once again, lightning seeks the earth, power from a generator does not. The current from your generator seeks to return to its source (the generator). You should be safely grounded through your three prong (positive, negative, ground) cord connection. In most cases, a ground rod’s useful purpose is to provide an effective path to earth for lightning.
Grounding is The most misunderstood and debated section of the National electric code, and while I’m not an electrical engineer, I am a licensed Master Electrician. I’m sure someone will disagree with my post anyway, cause that’s what people do here.

[ITSNO60]

Originally Posted by mikeoxlong

Once again, lightning seeks the earth, power from a generator does not. The current from your generator seeks to return to its source (the generator). You should be safely grounded through your three prong (positive, negative, ground) cord connection. In most cases, a ground rod’s useful purpose is to provide an effective path to earth for lightning.
Grounding is The most misunderstood and debated section of the National electric code, and while I’m not an electrical engineer, I am a licensed Master Electrician. I’m sure someone will disagree with my post anyway, cause that’s what people do here.

Very well said, as a licensed electrical contractor myself I have spent countless hours trying to explain this simple fact to laymen and fellow electricians alike, many of whom do not get it. Sometimes I think it's hard for people to grasp a very simple fact because they expect it to be complex.
If current cannot return to it's source it will not flow, there cannot be a circuit if it is not complete back to the source. It will take every available path proportionately to it's conductance and every single electron will return to it's source, none of it "dissipates into the earth" or "gets used up".

[aftermath]

I am a Honda guy and have been using mine without an extra ground. 15 years, two trailers and the same generator sitting on the ground. I find these discussions confusing. It is like the run with the propane on argument. Someone reads something somewhere and they become experts. If the major generator manufacturers don't require grounding, who are we to say that they are ALL wrong? Would they sell millions of generators knowing that you could electrocute yourself if you don't ground them? If they design a fridge to run down the road with the propane on, would they ever do this if they expected it to explode on the highway? AND....where is the actual data to support these supposedly dangerous acts?


The OP was not sure so he asked the question and that was the right thing to do. The answer is simply, no you don't have to ground the generator.

[Mollysdad]

In the real world, you're much more likely to regret pounding a 6' copper rod into a campground space than to do nothing with the generator. Especially when you hit the underground water pipe or power line.
If you're on your own property, and it makes you feel better, pound away.

[markdoane]

In response, a final word on grounding:

A point of great importance would be first to know: what is the capacity of the earth? And what charge does it contain if electrified? Though we have no positive evidence of a charged body existing in space without other oppositely electrified bodies being near, there is a fair probability that the earth is such a body, for by whatever process it was separated from other bodies — and this is the accepted view of its origin — it must have retained a charge, as occurs in all processes of mechanical separation.
-Nikola Tesla

[mefly2]

No grounding with Honda gens for 10 years ... no skin leakage detected.

[Kalashnikov]

The only "grounding" I do with a generator is to connect the ground and neutral wires together on the extension cord I'm using to charge. This is because the surge protector otherwise won't permit charging (it detects an un-grounded condition and the generator output is ignored.)

[ITSNO60]

Originally Posted by Mollysdad

In the real world, you're much more likely to regret pounding a 6' copper rod into a campground space than to do nothing with the generator. Especially when you hit the underground water pipe or power line.
If you're on your own property, and it makes you feel better, pound away.

Make that 8 feet, standard ground rods are 8 feet. Here in Arizona they can sometimes take an hour or more apiece to install using a demolition hammer fitted with a ground rod driving attachment. We never drive them without first getting a Blue Stake.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by ITSNO60

Very well said, as a licensed electrical contractor myself I have spent countless hours trying to explain this simple fact to laymen and fellow electricians alike, many of whom do not get it. Sometimes I think it's hard for people to grasp a very simple fact because they expect it to be complex.
If current cannot return to it's source it will not flow, there cannot be a circuit if it is not complete back to the source. It will take every available path proportionately to it's conductance and every single electron will return to it's source, none of it "dissipates into the earth" or "gets used up".

That is why the lightning ground 'strike' you actually can see is most often the ground reaching up to complete the circuit. ⚡️ 1001, 1002, 1003 boom.

Bob
🇺🇸

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqnQXRaSw28

[smsasf]

As the original poster I recall when we boys wrestled when I was a kid and the boy about to win would force to boy about to be defeated to say “uncle” to give in. I don’t recall why. But I say “uncle”. As an aside, my adult son graduated top of his class in the Navy Aviation Electronics School down in Pensecola, FL some years back and has mostly worked in commercial and residential electrical and power and controllers and such ever since. His cable work into big boxes and controllers is like art. And he seems to be able to built anything. Anyway, he told me early on that I did not need to ground it. But of course, being the older and wiser (?) I felt I needed to ask some sages on the forum. I won’t use a ground even though I bought the rebar and wire. And if I get electrocuted while starting up the generator in a rain storm while barefoot nobody on the forum will be the wiser. Thanks to all, my confidence is raised.