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Old 11-25-2022, 08:20 AM   #1
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2019 23' International
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Generator Trial (and error)

Newbie questions

I'm looking to purchase a generator and have decided on the Champion Dual Fuel 2500. I've read through many posts and am getting mixed messages so I want to ask my questions directly.

RE: 2019 International Serenity 23CB (one AC unit)

1) Will the Champion Dual Fuel 2500 run the AC?
2) If not, will the 2500 & 2000 work together to run the AC? (or two 2000's?)
3) If I'm not sure about what the generator will power can I turn it on and see what happens? Will I blow something up? e.g. the microwave
4) Do I use my AS power cord with a 15amp adapter to plug into the generator?

TIA
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Old 11-25-2022, 08:38 AM   #2
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The 2500 will run the AC. you may need a micro air soft start installed on your AC unit. You can use an adapter on the 30A cord.

You’ll likely need a bonding plug. You can make one or buy it. You cannot operate the AC and the microwave simultaneously with the 2500.

https://www.amazon.com/Southwire-Com...ps%2C76&sr=8-2
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Old 11-25-2022, 08:55 AM   #3
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The 2500 will run the AC if you use the MicroAir soft start with this caution:

The generator will run less efficiently as elevation increases, e.g. in the mountains, so don't count on it for AC in the Rockies. Another limiting factor is the ambient temperature so you may also need more juice in Texas summers.

Most of the time my Honda 2000 does just fine but the above conditions require the companion genny. Both are ten years old.

You can only run one load device at a time so choose between AC or Microwave but not both simultaneously.
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Old 11-25-2022, 08:59 AM   #4
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So can I set up the 2500 and try the AC to see if it works before I install a soft start? In other words, will it damage anything if I try?
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Old 11-25-2022, 09:03 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJBus View Post
So can I set up the 2500 and try the AC to see if it works before I install a soft start? In other words, will it damage anything if I try?
Hi

Without a soft start, the startup surge on the AC will be more than the generator can handle. It may fault out or it might just drop voltage. Neither one is good for you A/C. Things like this add a lot of wear and tear to the compressor and it dies a lot sooner than it should. Is that 3 months or a year or ... there's no way to know.

Bob
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Old 11-25-2022, 09:05 AM   #6
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Sorry, don't own your combo but just adding a think about it comment.

AC Load management.

Other things can be using AC power and tend to be forgotten about. Convertor AC load varies with battery charging, water heater might be on AC and any plug ins etc.
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Old 11-25-2022, 09:17 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlintiaga View Post
The 2500 will run the AC. you may need a micro air soft start installed on your AC unit. You can use an adapter on the 30A cord.

You’ll likely need a bonding plug. You can make one or buy it. You cannot operate the AC and the microwave simultaneously with the 2500.

https://www.amazon.com/Southwire-Com...ps%2C76&sr=8-2
I have never heard of needing a bonding plug. What is the purpose? I have run my Yamaha 2KW generator without one for years.
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Old 11-25-2022, 09:17 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJBus View Post
Newbie questions

I'm looking to purchase a generator and have decided on the Champion Dual Fuel 2500. I've read through many posts and am getting mixed messages so I want to ask my questions directly.

RE: 2019 International Serenity 23CB (one AC unit)

1) Will the Champion Dual Fuel 2500 run the AC?
2) If not, will the 2500 & 2000 work together to run the AC? (or two 2000's?)
3) If I'm not sure about what the generator will power can I turn it on and see what happens? Will I blow something up? e.g. the microwave
4) Do I use my AS power cord with a 15amp adapter to plug into the generator?

TIA
1- Yes, but install an easystart/soft start first.

2- N/A

3- Make sure your AC is off when the genny starts. Power things (but not the AC) on one at a time and then some in combination to see what works as every trailer, setup and component is different.

4- Your Champion (I have 2x of the same that can run together) has a 20A output so use the 20A adapter or use a 30A adapter. Don’t undersize at 15A as you will not have full capacity.

Also make sure you have a grounding neutral plug as well. Something like this:

https://a.co/d/779N3lx
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Old 11-25-2022, 09:17 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJBus View Post
Newbie questions

I'm looking to purchase a generator and have decided on the Champion Dual Fuel 2500. I've read through many posts and am getting mixed messages so I want to ask my questions directly.

RE: 2019 International Serenity 23CB (one AC unit)

1) Will the Champion Dual Fuel 2500 run the AC?
2) If not, will the 2500 & 2000 work together to run the AC? (or two 2000's?)
3) If I'm not sure about what the generator will power can I turn it on and see what happens? Will I blow something up? e.g. the microwave
4) Do I use my AS power cord with a 15amp adapter to plug into the generator?

TIA
Yes, the Champion 2500 Dual Fuel will run your AC on your 23'. My brother in law has been using his over a year now with his 15000AC no problems. Suggest you get an "Easystart" installed to reduce the load, but it will work without. This will also help reduce load on the 15Amp.

I had the Champion 3400 for several years for my 25' and my 28' AS's. Couple years back, I got the Honda 2200 from Genconnex, with the propane conversion. The Honda works great also, but a bit more expensive than the Champion 2500. Had the Champion 2500 been out then, i likely would have got that model.
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Old 11-25-2022, 09:21 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10Smiles View Post
I have never heard of needing a bonding plug. What is the purpose? I have run my Yamaha 2KW generator without one for years.

Is it bonded neutral? Read your owner’s manual or search the internet.
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Old 11-25-2022, 10:28 AM   #11
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soft start

Since the best recommendations are to install a soft start I'm researching options.

I put a call into SoftStartRv to ask about the differences between the in-unit model and the plug-and-play.

There is a $300 difference but if I have to pay for installation it will be about the same. And the plug-and-play seems to provide more protection.

P.S. I cannot send PM's until I become a "trusted member"
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Old 11-25-2022, 10:30 AM   #12
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Generally only need the bonding plug if you had a surge protector/ems installed in your trailer. Otherwise will work without one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JetstreamAS View Post
Is it bonded neutral? Read your owner’s manual or search the internet.
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Old 11-25-2022, 10:52 AM   #13
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Generally only need the bonding plug if you had a surge protector/ems installed in your trailer. Otherwise will work without one.
I assumed he was using a SP on his trailer. Didn’t know if his Yamaha came as a bonded neutral genny or not and that’s why it was stated.
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Old 11-25-2022, 11:11 AM   #14
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We run the Champion 3400 dual on LP - 30amp RV ready runs everything - If they still make it?? why not go that root (rhetorical question)? I'm a 160lb, 5'8", 80 year old and can still lift the genny into the F-150 bed. While we have upgraded to lithium and solar for boondocking we still take the genny for those "hot" days...
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Old 11-25-2022, 12:57 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10Smiles View Post
I have never heard of needing a bonding plug. What is the purpose? I have run my Yamaha 2KW generator without one for years.
The bonded neutral is a "cheat" because generators don't have a ground/neutral connection as your home does or the campground pedestal.
Without one your surge protector will indicate an open ground or neutral.
If you don't use a surge protector you may not need this, not sure how your GFI plugs will respond.
So this simple home device plugs into any other outlet on the generator so it shows a ground and neutral. It's simply a Edison plug with a jumper between ground and neutral. (Your home has this inside the breaker panel.)

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Old 11-25-2022, 01:51 PM   #16
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Is your AC 12,500 or 15,000 btu - makes a difference especially on start. I have been running a 12,500 on a Honda 2000 for 16 years and lately on a Honda 2200 but there are some tricks:

Like others have said, do the start with nothing else powered including the charger. I have an inverter charger with a camp-on feature that allows the generator to borrow current from the inverter for start up. I also have Microair Softstart installed.

Once the AC is running dial down the thermostat so that it does not cycle frequently or plan on using the AC for a single cycle if you are going to run other appliances. Put another way, if you are going to make coffee, operate the TV and some internet or satellite appliances and need charge for the batteries, you probably wont get an AC restart even with a 2500 watt generator and particularly with a Champion which is not known as a precision instrument and certainly whose output will decline over time with wear and tear etc. Every watt counts.
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Old 11-25-2022, 02:21 PM   #17
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My Champion AC solution

One Champion 4500 (gas) with remote start and Easy Start for Dometic 13k Brisk Aire (2007)
1) Why carry two gennies? One 4500 weighs just under 100 lbs and OK to lift if you know how to lift properly. There's many other solutions for this issue so shouldn't be a buying decision.

2) Only 65 dBm +/-

3) Good rolling system with EZ pull handle and wheels

4) Hardened cable and locks (from a Harley) to secure. Best if you'll be in one spot for longer than 14 days.

5) can be had on sale. I got mine last season for $850 new, delivered

6) Champion has good service network (unlike Harbor Freight)


I see no benefit with propane (I had propane 2500). Also, AC only ran 15 mins till 2500 gennie quit (several attempts). Yes it was a lot lighter, but totally useless for my application. Very disappointing.
Just change the oil and other maintenance on the regular and this Honda copy will last forever.

Hope this helps
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Old 11-25-2022, 02:28 PM   #18
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"There is a $300 difference but if I have to pay for installation it will be about the same. And the plug-and-play seems to provide more protection."

I had the local Camping World in San Bernardino install the Easy Start. The tech hadn't done it before, but I was having other maintenance done, so they agreed to do the install. They charged $150, took him about 2 hours to figger it out.
(should be less than 30 mins)

cheers
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Old 11-25-2022, 03:05 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by SouthForkAS View Post
Why carry two gennies? One 4500 weighs just under 100 lbs and OK to lift if you know how to lift properly.

————

I see no benefit with propane (I had propane 2500)
I think only having to carry one 39 pound generator (when you only need 1 for 1 AC unit being used, etc.) or two @ 39 pounds each when needed is a huge advantage over a 100 pound unit. Even 2 people can struggle with a 100 pound unit based upon how high the truck bed/SUV is and other factors.

As far as “no benefit with propane” is concerned there are many reasons why you would want to use a propane generator. Not lugging gasoline around is the obvious one that clearly is a benefit that most people will start with in deciding against gas only. That’s another reason a dual fuel setup is a no brainer vs. gas only.
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Old 11-25-2022, 04:33 PM   #20
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How much are the generators derated when running on propane?
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