Generator / Battery Help in Frozen TX

[BugsyJ]

Hi Everyone. Like many of you, I'm stuck in the mess in central TX with no power and ice everywhere. I'm hoping somebody has ideas for me as I'm having trouble keeping my batteries charged enough to keep my furnace blowing - and I have a generator!

With my generator running, I know I am getting 20 amp as I am able to run my microwave or a small space heater. But, even if I am not drawing any 20 amp power (turn off space heater) I can't get the batteries to read more than 11.7 or so - and nowhere near that high when the blower is running. We assumed our converter must have gone south, but when I plug my tow vehicle in it seems to charge the batteries. Here is my current situation. Generator is running. Nothing plugged into the 20 amp outlets. Furnace blower is running and battery is reading 9.9. Now, I just shut off the furnace and the battery now reads 11.7, the highest it has been since last night. Yet, when I just ran an experiment with the generator off and the trailer plugged into my tow vehicle, the battery read 12.4 with the blower running. (so, 12.4 with tow vehicle and 9.9 with the generator, in both cases with the furnace / blower running).

Any thoughts here would be really appreciated. This morning, we woke up (generator had been off for 10 hours) and the furnace didn't seem to be running well because the battery was so low. We started the generator and got the little space heater running, but the battery seemed to take forever to charge up. It has risen a little throughout the day, but that could also be our solar panels, although there isn't much direct sunlight.

Any thoughts here would be greatly appreciated. As may be obvious, I'm a bit dense when it comes to these electrical systems. One thing we did do is confirm that the two 30 amp fuses feeding the converter are ok. Generator is Genconnex Honda 'Standard' model EU2200i Propane modified generator.

[gypsydad]

Originally Posted by BugsyJ

Hi Everyone. Like many of you, I'm stuck in the mess in central TX with no power and ice everywhere. I'm hoping somebody has ideas for me as I'm having trouble keeping my batteries charged enough to keep my furnace blowing - and I have a generator!

With my generator running, I know I am getting 20 amp as I am able to run my microwave or a small space heater. But, even if I am not drawing any 20 amp power (turn off space heater) I can't get the batteries to read more than 11.7 or so - and nowhere near that high when the blower is running. We assumed our converter must have gone south, but when I plug my tow vehicle in it seems to charge the batteries. Here is my current situation. Generator is running. Nothing plugged into the 20 amp outlets. Furnace blower is running and battery is reading 9.9. Now, I just shut off the furnace and the battery now reads 11.7, the highest it has been since last night. Yet, when I just ran an experiment with the generator off and the trailer plugged into my tow vehicle, the battery read 12.4 with the blower running. (so, 12.4 with tow vehicle and 9.9 with the generator, in both cases with the furnace / blower running).

Any thoughts here would be really appreciated. This morning, we woke up (generator had been off for 10 hours) and the furnace didn't seem to be running well because the battery was so low. We started the generator and got the little space heater running, but the battery seemed to take forever to charge up. It has risen a little throughout the day, but that could also be our solar panels, although there isn't much direct sunlight.

Any thoughts here would be greatly appreciated. As may be obvious, I'm a bit dense when it comes to these electrical systems. One thing we did do is confirm that the two 30 amp fuses feeding the converter are ok. Generator is Genconnex Honda 'Standard' model EU2200i Propane modified generator.

I am no expert here, but sounds like your batteries may be the issue. I would start there. They don't last long once depleted. I would suggest going to Wallmart Sams or Costco and getting a couple new batteries first and see how they do with your converter. You will likely need to replace them anyway, if more than couple years old.

Second, consider replacing your converter with a 4 stage converter unit. Check out Bestconverter.com and call Randy. (he also owns an AS) Most RV shops carry these also, so in your emergency, I would suggest you call around to see if there is a place close by who has in stock. You should also be aware that "pre-2018" year AS's all had single stage converters...notorious for ruining 12v batteries! Good luck and find a place to plug in to shore power if possible!

[pjshier]

I don't know about that model Honda - but have seen gensets where you can connect the AC and simultaneously use the 12volt battery charger feature of the same genset. Not sure how many changes in AC/DC/AC/DC occur when the Honda makes and sends AC to your converter then to your batteries.

Battery temp may be an issue as well. At a lower SOC lead acid batteries can be pretty unhappy about taking a charge. Might want to wrap the battery box or otherwise safely protect it from wind-related heat loss. Mind any fire potential.

Hang in there...

[Wolfe]

if it was me i would hook up and change my ZIP CODE to yuma az ect

[Kawboy01]

With the current weather in TX is it possible that your batteries have frozen? Are the batteries mounted in the box on the tongue? When you plug in your truck you are seeing the power from the truck DC system.
New batteries may be the solution. Although least you still have power and heat.

[BugsyJ]

Thanks, everyone. Batteries are mounted in front and it is possible that they are frozen, but they seem to accept a slow charge via solar. With nothing but lights and water pump running it has been climbing all morning and now sits at 11.0. We have power - for now, at least - in Austin so my friend recommended buying a cheap battery charger from an auto parts store and just keeping it hooked up to the batteries. We are going to try to get a few hours east of Austin today so will look for one of those and maybe some new batteries as well.

[jimdelane]

You might consider switching to lithium batteries when you thaw out. The better lithium batteries like AMPS, BattleBorn and Relion are suited for below freezing applications. The BMS have a low temp charge protection which protects the cells should the battery freeze. They will continue to discharge below freezing. They actually have more available energy at lower temperatures than lead acid/agm, however, like lead acid/agm, the energy will be less than at higher temps. Often a heat pad is used just to keep the batteries above freezing - which is also a good idea for lead acid/agm batteries.
Potential suppliers include:

AMPS Lithium
https://lithiummarinebattery.com

Battleborn
https://battlebornbatteries.com

Dakota Lithium
https://dakotalithium.com/

ReLion
https://relionbattery.com

[JohnTF]

No mention of spec.s for generator ?
Do you have a multimeter ?
Disconnect the batteries , see if the transformer / charger puts out both 12v to trailer and charge at battery connectors [ not connected to batteries ] .
You need to test each & every component independently - so you now what has failed , it may be one item , or multiple .
For testing batteries it's a little more of an issue , 1st off lookup a battery state of charge voltage chart - 11v is a dead battery .
Then to correctly measure batteries , they need a small load on them , like a very small wattage light bulb and then use the multimeter [ for measuring battery state of charge you need a good meter - at least 2 decimal points past 0 = 00.00 at min. because - almost all of the battery's capacity is within .75 / three quarters of a volt - state of charge chart ] .

Next is the furnace will deplete most [ lead based ] batteries in one night .
So use shore power or generator to run furnace , with batteries disconnected or a battery switch to disconnect them to keep from killing batteries .

You can also lookup a battery state of charge freezing point .

Checkout Battery University for learning about batteries .

Lead based batteries need higher amperage to care for FLA = Flooded Lead Acid depending on size but 20-30 amps plus , most of your 2 -10 amp chargers are just maintainers - lead batteries should be charged as fast as possible for proper life - lookup C-Rate for the specific battery from manufacture to get the most out of what you have / or get .

[Hermes]

Originally Posted by jimdelane

Often a heat pad is used just to keep the batteries above freezing - which is also a good idea for lead acid/agm batteries.

At a 40% state of charge, electrolyte in a lead acid battery will freeze if the temperature drops to approximately -16 degrees F. When a battery is fully charged, the electrolyte will not freeze until the temperature drops to approximately -92 degrees F, which basically means that fully charged batteries don't freeze.

So you can determine based on the charge of your batteries and the lowest temperature you have lived through whether your batteries froze. Good luck!

[GammaDog]

I feel your pain! And all of the other people suffering in TX.

Let’s rewind the tape... the voltage meter in your AS does not tell you what (or how) your batteries are doing. It tells you the voltage on your 12 volt system at the moment. If only the batteries are connected, then it tells you how much they are delivering. If the truck or generator are connected it tells you about their contribution to the system.

When your truck is connected and the voltage meter goes up, you are seeing the truck it doing it’s job. 12.4 still seems low, but it’s enough to keep your furnace blower going.

Since the generator runs the microwave, we can assume it’s putting out enough juice to power the converter (but don’t run the converter and microwave at the same time on a 1000 watt generator... although a 2000 watt should handle that).

The first thing I would check is that the 120 volt circuit breaker for the converter has not tripped.

If that’s good, next, if you have a multimeter and know how, you’ll need to follow the black wire from the breaker into the converter below. See if there is 120 volts between the black wire and white wire. If that’s beyond your comfort level, don’t proceed. Post another question. We’ll step you through it.

At the end of this, I’m guessing your batteries are shot. Your converter may be too. Using the truck to power the Airstream may be the best bet until you or Mother Nature brings warmth and time to diagnose and consider your options.

Now or then, advice is available here for free... in some cases, that’s overcharging!

[gypsydad]

Originally Posted by GammaDog

I feel your pain! And all of the other people suffering in TX.

Let’s rewind the tape... the voltage meter in your AS does not tell you what (or how) your batteries are doing. It tells you the voltage on your 12 volt system at the moment. If only the batteries are connected, then it tells you how much they are delivering. If the truck or generator are connected it tells you about their contribution to the system.

When your truck is connected and the voltage meter goes up, you are seeing the truck it doing it’s job. 12.4 still seems low, but it’s enough to keep your furnace blower going.

Since the generator runs the microwave, we can assume it’s putting out enough juice to power the converter (but don’t run the converter and microwave at the same time on a 1000 watt generator... although a 2000 watt should handle that).

The first thing I would check is that the 120 volt circuit breaker for the converter has not tripped.

If that’s good, next, if you have a multimeter and know how, you’ll need to follow the black wire from the breaker into the converter below. See if there is 120 volts between the black wire and white wire. If that’s beyond your comfort level, don’t proceed. Post another question. We’ll step you through it.

At the end of this, I’m guessing your batteries are shot. Your converter may be too. Using the truck to power the Airstream may be the best bet until you or Mother Nature brings warmth and time to diagnose and consider your options.

Now or then, advice is available here for free... in some cases, that’s overcharging!

Yep! Agree...too bad it is so cold outside and limited in finding a place with batteries...still, Wallmart or Home Depot are open in some locations and "should" have batteries in stock...I would call, and keep calling till I got thru; you can purchase battery over the phone then go pick up. Melting on top of frozen snow/ice, not a good time to go out shopping so be careful if you find a location open. Still, the converter may be next on the list for replacment as mentioned.

[delrossa]

I recommend the AGM batteries. They withstand heat and cold. I purchased 2 Duralast AGM’s at Autozone. They have a high amp hour rating.
I installed a waterproof digital voltmeter in the battery compartment so I can monitor the battery voltage just by opening the compartment cover.
These batteries are amazing. In approximately 2 months without a charge they never dropped below 12.7 volts. I keep them disconnected until I need them or they need a charge. 12.7 volts is approximately 85% charge. With the AGM’s the original system works fine.

[BugsyJ]

Yes, thanks for the free advice. It’s been educational. I did confirm that the 120 circuit for the converter has not tripped. And the associated fuses are good as well. I did actually upgrade to the AGM batteries a few years ago and they worked great for a while. I must have just fried them sometime recently. The issue has gotten a little less pressing now as we made our escape from Austin a few hours ago and will stay tonight in Lake Charles, LA, which seems to have reliable power. So, we’ll largely rely on our space heater tonight - it’s not quite as cold - and then will replace the batteries when we head to N.O. tomorrow. I suspect I will also need to replace the converter, but will worry about that at the end of our trip in a few weeks.

To one of your suggestions, I didn’t think the 12V stuff like the furnace blower, lights, etc would run with the battery disconnected.

[GCinSC2]

Originally Posted by GammaDog

I feel your pain! And all of the other people suffering in TX.

Now or then, advice is available here for free... in some cases, that’s overcharging!

GammaDog,

That's a good one.


IF its a convertor failure and a convertor of your choice is not easily available (it happened to me at a week long rally) get a decent battery charger at least 30A + and disconnect the old convertor and connect the new charger. I bet it can be done, somehow I did it.

Run that charger to keep things alive until resolved if its a convertor problem. I carry it for a spare.

Good luck,

Gary

[B. Cole]

Originally Posted by BugsyJ

Thanks, everyone. Batteries are mounted in front and it is possible that they are frozen, but they seem to accept a slow charge via solar. With nothing but lights and water pump running it has been climbing all morning and now sits at 11.0. We have power - for now, at least - in Austin so my friend recommended buying a cheap battery charger from an auto parts store and just keeping it hooked up to the batteries. We are going to try to get a few hours east of Austin today so will look for one of those and maybe some new batteries as well.

With Airstream converters being junky for years, as noted above, I was going to suggest a $29 car battery charger, from Harbor Freight Tools/Walmart/ or any auto parts place.Plug into your generator.
Also, a big deep cycle lead acid boat battery, from Walmart, really take a beating, at all temps.
They are like $99 each.If they do fail, which I've rarely seen,Wal-Mart's everywhere exchange them pro rated, no hassle.

[gypsydad]

Originally Posted by BugsyJ

Yes, thanks for the free advice. It’s been educational. I did confirm that the 120 circuit for the converter has not tripped. And the associated fuses are good as well. I did actually upgrade to the AGM batteries a few years ago and they worked great for a while. I must have just fried them sometime recently. The issue has gotten a little less pressing now as we made our escape from Austin a few hours ago and will stay tonight in Lake Charles, LA, which seems to have reliable power. So, we’ll largely rely on our space heater tonight - it’s not quite as cold - and then will replace the batteries when we head to N.O. tomorrow. I suspect I will also need to replace the converter, but will worry about that at the end of our trip in a few weeks.

To one of your suggestions, I didn’t think the 12V stuff like the furnace blower, lights, etc would run with the battery disconnected.

Thats what the converter does, among other things...converts AC to 12V.

[gypsydad]

Originally Posted by B. Cole

With Airstream converters being junky for years, as noted above, I was going to suggest a $29 car battery charger, from Harbor Freight Tools/Walmart/ or any auto parts place.Plug into your generator.
Also, a big deep cycle lead acid boat battery, from Walmart, really take a beating, at all temps.
They are like $99 each.If they do fail, which I've rarely seen,Wal-Mart's everywhere exchange them pro rated, no hassle.

Good suggestions, but if his battery is over 3 yeears old, (likely) I would start with getting new batteries. Then the converter to a multi-stage new unit with smart charge technology. Bet $$ that would fix the issues and serve him well for years to come! Temps here in Austin area will be above freezing today so chance to make some calls and get new batteries! Also, locate a new converter...lots of RV dealers in the area but you need to call around...IMHO... By the way, it was 17 when I got up hour or so ago...already up to 24! Heat spell a-commin!

By the way, AGM's are fine but pricy. Wetcells will outlast the AGM's if properly maintained...there are several posts on this...I have had both. Wetcell batteries are not a hassle...top off once or twice a year...maybe. Now, thats assuming your not using the "older" single stage type converter...

[kpfate]

Originally Posted by BugsyJ

Thanks, everyone. Batteries are mounted in front and it is possible that they are frozen, but they seem to accept a slow charge via solar. With nothing but lights and water pump running it has been climbing all morning and now sits at 11.0. We have power - for now, at least - in Austin so my friend recommended buying a cheap battery charger from an auto parts store and just keeping it hooked up to the batteries. We are going to try to get a few hours east of Austin today so will look for one of those and maybe some new batteries as well.

First I am so sorry that all of you in Texas are dealing with this tragic weather! I live in Wyoming so we are used to this happening every winter, usually around this same time.

We always keep Trilla's battery hooked up to a trickle charger. Funny as the one we use was one we had purchased for our motorcycles when we had them - never opened up the trickle charger until we got Trilla. It works like a charm!

[robearl733]

Your batteries could be bad but I believe it is your converter. Lights, vent fans, furnace fan, all run always on 12 volt power. Your converter does two things, it charges your batteries and provides 12 v power to the trailer. Even if the batteries are weak the converter will power all 12 v needs as long as you have some form of shore power, or generator. 120 v shore power feeds the converter and it in turn puts out 12v power and charges the batteries. But you don’t even need batteries for 12v power if on shore power or generator. Last October my converter failed while on a month long trip. You can get by by getting a 12v battery charger, hooking it to your battery terminals and plugging the battery charger into the outside 120v outlet on curbside of your AS. This will keep you functional until you can replace the converter. Get a good multistage battery charger, keep as a back up for future problems. When I got home I ordered a new multi stage converter from Bestconverter. Randy pointed me to a video showing how to replace the converter. It was easy enough. And best of all new converter was only $170. Not bad. You only need batteries when not on short power. Before I realized it was the converter I did replace the batteries. That was sort of a waste, as it was of no help with the problem. But batteries were 5 years old so just chalked it up to preventive maintenance. I am fairly sure your problem is a bad converter just like I had. I learned a lot about the electrical system with this problem and would replace the converter while on the road if it happens again. But I will carry the battery charger as back up until I could get a new converter. I have 2016 FCFBT.