Does this make sense as a solar upgrade?

[FilmGuy]

We have a 2018 International 23FB with one factory Zamp Solar 90 watt panel on the roof. There are three connection ports on the roof, and I can buy two more of the Zamp Legacy 90 watt panels for about $800. Does that make sense as a solar upgrade? It seems like quite a simple way to triple the solar charging on the rig.

I understand that there are better solar controllers than the 2018 stock unit, but is the stock unit adequate to handle the three 90 watt panels for the time being?

Are there better upgrade paths I should consider?

[vanderwielen]

Get the model of your solar charger and post it. That will answer your question.

[Tyler2you]

If you don't need the form factor, the Zamp 90w long/skinny legacy panels are an expensive way to go.

If you have the room, you should look at other options. For max efficiency, you should try to match as closely as possible (within 1v is good) the Vmp of your existing panel which is 20.5v

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/03...f?v=1626117061

The Newpowa 100w panels are compact and affordable and have a Vmp of 19.23v

https://www.newpowa.com/100w-monocry...ncyId=1#label1

You probably have an Atkinson PWM controller in your 2018 trailer which I believe was 40 amps (you need to verify). You'd be looking at around 15 amps with 3 panels in parallel, so it should be fine.

[ts8501]

Originally Posted by FilmGuy

We have a 2018 International 23FB with one factory Zamp Solar 90 watt panel on the roof. There are three connection ports on the roof, and I can buy two more of the Zamp Legacy 90 watt panels for about $800. Does that make sense as a solar upgrade? It seems like quite a simple way to triple the solar charging on the rig.



I understand that there are better solar controllers than the 2018 stock unit, but is the stock unit adequate to handle the three 90 watt panels for the time being?



Are there better upgrade paths I should consider?

I think this makes sense from ease of installation and factory wiring perspectives. We added one Zamp 90 to our existing factory 180 on our 2022 International. The plug and play factor was a big driving factor.

[Dennis C]

Your approach makes sense. I had four Zamp 90W panels on the roof of my Airstream, connected through the factory rooftop solar panel port. I bought a splitter for two of the panels from Zamp and my dealer installed it.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Best guess is you have the "old" solar controller. If you are going to spend all that money on panels, spend a fraction of the budget on a Victron controller.

Why?

It's not that crazy hard to swap out the controller. The fine old ones had various issues. I would not trust them with three panels. The efficiency of the Victron is enough more that it alone will give you a noticeable boost in "power delivered".

Bob

[Life is a Highway]

We did this recently as we do not depend on Solar as our main power source it’s a nice input while traveling or in a non shaded environment.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Just to clarify some of the math:

You have one panel and are adding two. Net is 3 panels. 3 x 90 = 270W. Into a dead battery at 10V with no losses, that's 27A. Your controller likely is rated for output current. You would get one that is labeled for 35A or more. (20% margin).

Will you *ever* see 27A out of that setup? Probably not. Best that the controller does not go nuts if you do. Some of them are pretty good at current limiting (Victron). Others maybe not so much ....

Some controllers have a set of mounting requirements that are a bit complicated. If you are installing it for a single 90W panel you can do it this way. If you want to deal with three panels, you install it a different way (more heatsinking). Finding those grubby details .... not easy at all for some outfits.

Bob

[FilmGuy]

Thanks for these notes, Bob. I read a lot of positive things about the Victron controllers, so I'll investigate those further. Using your suggested rating of 35A, would this unit be a good choice? Or do you recommend a different one?

https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-...rtsolar-150-35

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

Just to clarify some of the math:

You have one panel and are adding two. Net is 3 panels. 3 x 90 = 270W. Into a dead battery at 10V with no losses, that's 27A. Your controller likely is rated for output current. You would get one that is labeled for 35A or more. (20% margin).

Will you *ever* see 27A out of that setup? Probably not. Best that the controller does not go nuts if you do. Some of them are pretty good at current limiting (Victron). Others maybe not so much ....

Some controllers have a set of mounting requirements that are a bit complicated. If you are installing it for a single 90W panel you can do it this way. If you want to deal with three panels, you install it a different way (more heatsinking). Finding those grubby details .... not easy at all for some outfits.

Bob

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by FilmGuy

Thanks for these notes, Bob. I read a lot of positive things about the Victron controllers, so I'll investigate those further. Using your suggested rating of 35A, would this unit be a good choice? Or do you recommend a different one?

https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-...rtsolar-150-35

Hi

That's not a bad choice. They have two lines. Both work equally well. One has built in Bluetooth (and costs more). The other has you buy a dongle to replace the display to get Bluetooth. The Smart Solar is the one with Bluetooth. The Blue Solar is (confusingly) the one without Bluetooth.

I'm a big fan of the Bluetooth version that you picked.

Bob

[FilmGuy]

Thank you.

Can this unit simply replace the original controller using the original wiring? (I believe I’ve read comments by you elsewhere saying that the Airstream solar prewire was adequate for this sort of upgrade.) I’m reasonably comfortable with electrical work, so normal wiring is within my capabilities. Does replacing the controller fall into that category, or is it something one really wants an experienced solar installer to do?

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

That's not a bad choice. They have two lines. Both work equally well. One has built in Bluetooth (and costs more). The other has you buy a dongle to replace the display to get Bluetooth. The Smart Solar is the one with Bluetooth. The Blue Solar is (confusingly) the one without Bluetooth.

I'm a big fan of the Bluetooth version that you picked.

Bob

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by FilmGuy

Thank you.

Can this unit simply replace the original controller using the original wiring? (I believe I’ve read comments by you elsewhere saying that the Airstream solar prewire was adequate for this sort of upgrade.) I’m reasonably comfortable with electrical work, so normal wiring is within my capabilities. Does replacing the controller fall into that category, or is it something one really wants an experienced solar installer to do?

Hi

Drop it in and away you go.

The existing display will not work with the Victron so you will have it sitting there after the conversion. The Victron display (if you have one) will need to mount somewhere.

Bob

[FilmGuy]

Thanks!

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

Drop it in and away you go.

The existing display will not work with the Victron so you will have it sitting there after the conversion. The Victron display (if you have one) will need to mount somewhere.

Bob

[FilmGuy]

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

Drop it in and away you go.

The existing display will not work with the Victron so you will have it sitting there after the conversion. The Victron display (if you have one) will need to mount somewhere.

Bob

I have ordered the Victron Smart controller with built-in Bluetooth, but I have a question about monitoring. Is it necessary, or a good idea, to also install a Victron battery monitor like the Victron Battery Monitor BMV-712?

https://www.victronenergy.com/displa.../bmv-712-smart

Or does the charge controller’s Bluetooth provide all the battery monitoring that’s needed?

[LNBright]

Originally Posted by FilmGuy

I have ordered the Victron Smart controller with built-in Bluetooth, but I have a question about monitoring. Is it necessary, or a good idea, to also install a Victron battery monitor like the Victron Battery Monitor BMV-712?

https://www.victronenergy.com/displa.../bmv-712-smart

Or does the charge controller’s Bluetooth provide all the battery monitoring that’s needed?

A well-designed system will have a battery monitor: the BMV-712 is great, it has its own external display, but if you are comfortable foregoing that, you can go with the Smartshunt and use the Victron app on your phone to see what its doing.

The battery monitor will watch the battery bank: if wired correctly, and set up correctly, it will keep accurate tabs on what goes in and out of the battery. The other components (an MPPT controller, a DC-DC charger, etc), can communicate with the system, but they're ‘flying blind’ if you don’t have a battery monitor to check against.

[FilmGuy]

Originally Posted by LNBright

A well-designed system will have a battery monitor: the BMV-712 is great, it has its own external display, but if you are comfortable foregoing that, you can go with the Smartshunt and use the Victron app on your phone to see what its doing.

The battery monitor will watch the battery bank: if wired correctly, and set up correctly, it will keep accurate tabs on what goes in and out of the battery. The other components (an MPPT controller, a DC-DC charger, etc), can communicate with the system, but they're ‘flying blind’ if you don’t have a battery monitor to check against.

Thank you. That’s very helpful. I assume this would be true regardless of the battery type—AGM or lithium. (At this point we’re running AGM batteries, and aren’t planning to convert to lithium for a while.)

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by FilmGuy

I have ordered the Victron Smart controller with built-in Bluetooth, but I have a question about monitoring. Is it necessary, or a good idea, to also install a Victron battery monitor like the Victron Battery Monitor BMV-712?

https://www.victronenergy.com/displa.../bmv-712-smart

Or does the charge controller’s Bluetooth provide all the battery monitoring that’s needed?

Hi

As noted above, the decision about the shunt monitor is independent of all this other stuff. It is not something you "must have". It's an option that can be added to any setup. Solar, lithium, AGM, whatever ... you can add a shunt to them.

To me, the shunt is a really good idea to add to any setup. Without one, you are very much "flying blind" in terms of your batteries. That's true with any type of battery.

Bob

[LNBright]

Correct: Victron’s family of shunts can be set up according to the battery type, so would work for your AGM or future lithiums.

[jeffmc306]

Originally Posted by FilmGuy

I have ordered the Victron Smart controller with built-in Bluetooth, but I have a question about monitoring. Is it necessary, or a good idea, to also install a Victron battery monitor like the Victron Battery Monitor BMV-712?

https://www.victronenergy.com/displa.../bmv-712-smart

Or does the charge controller’s Bluetooth provide all the battery monitoring that’s needed?

FilmGuy, the SmarShunt was released after the BVM-712 and does the same thing minus the head unit. You use the VictronConnect App to see the data.

If you think you’ll ever go “all in” and install a Victron MultiPlus and a Cerbo, go with the BVM-712 which has a VE Direct connection. Otherwise, you’re just fine with the SmartShunt. Just make sure ALL of your negative connections are on the load side of the shunt or it won’t be able to read all the draw.

Think of the Shunt as a gas gauge on your tow vehicle. As gas (DC power) is consumed, the gauge goes down. When you add gas, the gauge goes up. Same with the shunt.

I replaced our factory Atkinson solar controller with a Victron SmartSolar 100|30 unit which also shows up on the VictronConnect App. It’s a great system, highly recommend it.

Good luck with your project!

[Ironsinker]

Originally Posted by FilmGuy

We have a 2018 International 23FB with one factory Zamp Solar 90 watt panel on the roof. There are three connection ports on the roof, and I can buy two more of the Zamp Legacy 90 watt panels for about $800. Does that make sense as a solar upgrade? It seems like quite a simple way to triple the solar charging on the rig.

I understand that there are better solar controllers than the 2018 stock unit, but is the stock unit adequate to handle the three 90 watt panels for the time being?

Are there better upgrade paths I should consider?

Solar makes sense if you are in a place where solar makes sense. I'm in VA where there are trees most places and lots of rain. Plus i'm not retired so I just go to state park to state park close by looking for mountain biking trails. So adding a bunch of solar makes little sense for me at this time.

My 2018 came with a WFCO or Maybe Atkinson solar controller that worked when it wanted to which wasn't often. I do not think it was rated for 300 watts, but slightly less. It should work for you. I switched out with a small victron controller which works all the time as expected. I really like that upgrade. Maybe I'll get more panels closer to retirement, but I doubt it. I'm not the sort to park in a field for weeks. I'd rather spend the money on more batteries and a charging system off my truck.