Retrofit a Home Septic Manhole Cover with RV Dump Hole

[Flostream66]

Dear all, thank you for your suggestions, ideas and cautionary tales. I live in upstate NY where the Board of Health (who oversees septic installs) rules the roost. Because I live on a state-protected lake, the solution needs to be by the book. I did call my septic person first…and was told they had never heard of such a thing. Hmmm. Now that I am armed with the proper vocabulary, I may get further. But first, I want to see if I can locate a clean out in the line. I know where it is inside, but I do not recall seeing one outside or anywhere near the septic manhole cover.

I like Bob and Richard’s idea of seeing if I can install one that is integrated with the existing system. I have a great plumber who will know what is and is not possible and whether it would interfere with the “biology” of my septic holding tank (thank you for that info, Richard). If you could see my property, and the location of the lake, well, you would understand that this needs to be considered and installed carefully.

Again, thanks everyone. I am very grateful for the knowledge base on these forums, and will update this page once I have a viable solution in case there is someone else who would like to retrofit a septic system. Flostream66

[rideair]

Flostream66,

Since you're in the state of New York, you might want to give these guys a try.

https://certifiedcesspool.com/Cesspo...Island-NY.html

Eighty year technology, brought up to todays standards ;-)

Just Saying,

[uncle_bob]

Hi

The "big bunch of rocks in a pit" approach may be legit for gray water. It's not going to be even remotely legal for black water. I have seen folks put in a setup like this to dump the output of their cloths washer into. We looked into it a while back. There didn't seem to be a major issue getting a permit for it.

Even if the pit *was* legal, I'd bet at least a six pack that putting a clean out on the existing setup will be cheaper than digging the pit and doing all that work.

Bob

[rideair]

uncle_bob,

Yes, a "Dry-Well" is one of the best things a person can install at their house if they live on a septic system to help keep the septic system alive and well. Gray water is what kills the standard "septic-tank, drain-field" system, then adding olive-oil when washing dishes (stays suspended in the water, clogging the drain-field) to the mix, and you're done. If you could build your house where the toilet water goes to one system, all gray water (shower/sink/laundry) to another, it would be far better for the environment and waste-systems would last much longer.

Just Saying,

[Thalweg]

Originally Posted by bweybright

HUH? and what part of the boonies are you living (if you follow infection studies you will find it has not been safe for 80 years....)? Not to mention stupid...do you want to pollute your shallow well (from 80 years ago) if you are even thinking this? Oh, wait I get it - you are making a joke and we took your post for being serious.

Groundwater conditions and regulations vary dramatically throughout the country/world. There are many places where where a simple drain field septic system would be perfectly sufficient, safe and legal. Don't assume that the conditions or regulations at your house apply everywhere. I'm a hydrologist and I've designed numerous systems like this.

[BandLAir]

We have plastic covers on our septic tanks. I removed the one closest to where the effluent enters from the house, drilled a hole in it, installed a garden hose fitting (with a plug/cap) and reinstalled the cover. We use a portable macerator pump with a larger diameter garden hose to empty the tanks if we arrive home with anything in them. Obviously (sic) we have different hoses for putting fresh water into the rig.

[PC Conner]

Great discussion.
I'm about to install/have installed a cleanout on a city sewer line.
I found this You Tube video <

[alligatorob]

Originally Posted by rideair

You could always just dig a big round hole in the ground, place a layer of large stone in the bottom of the hole, place a metal 55 gallon drum with many 2" holes drilled in the side (or shot many time with the firearm of your choice), place drum in the hole placing large stones between the drum and the dirt wall, place a 4" pipe in the top of the drum to where it slightly rises above ground level, cover back over with dirt.

Not that the above is right/legal/etc... but it has worked for many years with no problems going back 80 years in the many hollows and hills of the USA. It was a poor mans septic system for the longest time.

Pretty sure it is not legal anymore but used to be common practice in places. And I know of people still doing it, mostly for laundry water disposal. The first "septic tank" I saw put in was in Wyoming 50+ years ago, an old car, the sewer pipe just ran in an open window. Very course gravel soil and it is probably still working today. But, in my opinion, not a very good idea.

[delrossa]

I live in upstate NY on a protected lake also.
I had the company that pumps out my septic tank install a clean out on the line from the house to the tank. Really simple. I dug down to the septic line which should not be too deep. I cleaned out enough dirt so they could cut the pipe and install a tee with a sweeping riser.
It took them about 15 minutes to hook it up.
I purchased a 25 gallon 4 wheel septic cart. I dump my Airstream tanks into the cart and pull the cart to the clean out. The clean out is just like most of the hook ups in rv parks.
This set up works great.

[ITSNO60]

Many homes in Mexico are still built with cesspools under the bathroom. Common practice is to take a section of large diameter concrete pipe like the kind used for culverts and place it vertically in the ground, then build the bathroom right over it. The bottom is not sealed so the liquids can leach into the earth. I have seen them just a stones throw from the beach. (We don't drink the water)

[Flostream66]

PCConnor, thanks for posting the YouTube video. It was instructive, and now I understand why my plumber prepared me for the "big hole" he said he is going to have to dig in my front yard...seems a small price to pay to avoid the long dump lines. So, I remain undeterred.

PC, I wanted to share the video which populated right after the one you shared: https://youtu.be/kzVePooP7BQ. The man in the video, Roger Wakefield, has a whole plumbing channel...oh, and snazzy plumbing background music and a big watch. :/

He used PVC, not ABS, to create an in-line clean out. He did not explain why; only that "its how we do it in North Texas." If you read the comments, it seems that the code on this varies widely, and depends upon whether the project is resi or commercial...just as an FYI for DIY'ers to check local codes.

Note also that the video uses a two-way clean out as opposed to a single port...can anyone explain why? Mr. Wakefield merely said that a two-way is the way to go. Seems like a single clean out might be better for home honeypot purposes. Anyone have a considered view on this? My plumber is coming later this week.

Thanks "y'all." Flostream66

[ITSNO60]

Well since you are using it as a dump it is not just a cleanout now and since you want the flow to be toward the septic I agree that a one way is the way to go as a two way may not start stuff moving in the right direction. BUT There are two ways to make a two way cleanout. there are two way cleanouts that are one piece but there are also two way cleanouts that are created by installing two one ways next to each other facing opposite directions. The one piece would not be desirable in your case but the latter, although more work and a bigger hole, would not affect dumping as long as you choose the downstream one to dump in and it would give you an upstream one if you ever need to clear the line to the house. Since you will be digging it up anyways this is the way I would go unless you already have a cleanout further up that would serve that section.

[Flostream66]

Excellent suggestion, Brian, and I thank you for it. Will update as and when the job begins! Flostream66

[ITSNO60]

Here's a pic of the one piece 2 way and a pic of the two way built from 2 one ways that the plumber in your video built. You may want to mark or color the cap with arrows if you do the 2 piece because the proper one to use will be the one farthest from the septic, which is counter-intuitive to non-professionals.

[Flostream66]

Yes, I would have been "Flo-ing" in the wrong direction...thanks, Brian.

[AlbertF]

I have seen such a thing used on a municipal site, for the convenience of sewage sludge haulers who could dump right into a trunk sanitary sewer. RVers were free to use it too if they knew where it was and wanted to. (There was no water supply nearby for flushing.)

I think a welding shop could modify the manhole cover for you.

[Flostream66]

Hi Albert - I think the issue with dumping from above, as opposed to inline is the one raised above - namely that it might upset the bacteria levels...so for now, I am going to wait on the plumber to do the inspection and digging to unearth the pipeline to the septic...kind of like waiting for the Colonial Pipeline to gin back up!

[AlbertF]

Originally Posted by Flostream66

Hi Albert - I think the issue with dumping from above, as opposed to inline is the one raised above - namely that it might upset the bacteria levels...so for now, I am going to wait on the plumber to do the inspection and digging to unearth the pipeline to the septic...kind of like waiting for the Colonial Pipeline to gin back up!

I didn’t realize that your “manhole covers” were directly above the septic tank. Yes, you don’t want to stir up the sludge in the bottom of the septic tank. If these solids enter the tile field you’ll have a problem. It’s also important to have the tank pumped out before the sludge rises to the level of the effluent pipe.

Actually, I should correct what I wrote. The manhole I described is for septic tank sludge haulers to dump into. The pipe runs directly to the community’s wastewater treatment system.

[DonPayne]

Originally Posted by richandwanda

Septic tanks [...] have baffles so the sewage enters the tank without roiling the contents. Dumping sewage directly through the tank lid may stir up the floating scum layer which could cause solids to get out of the tank and into the drain field.

Thanks for explaining clearly why dumping into the cleanout is preferable over dumping directly into the septic tank!