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roguebrun · 06-08-2009, 01:46 PM

question

I am restoring my trailer and trying to figure all the systems out whenever I use any water the blackwater tank fills up to quickly and backs up into my shower. does anyone know why this would happen

xrvr · 06-08-2009, 02:26 PM

If there is only one tank it is fairly small. If there are two tanks then running water should not fill the black tank. We need a vintage expert here. jim

ts8501 · 06-08-2009, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roguebrun

question

I am restoring my trailer and trying to figure all the systems out whenever I use any water the blackwater tank fills up to quickly and backs up into my shower. does anyone know why this would happen

Before 1974 Airstream did not offer grey tanks on all models. Sounds like your '72 fits with this. My '64 had a grey/black tank that only held 8 gallons! My '90 holds somethng like 35 gallons of black, and 45 gallons of grey. Assuming your '72 holds not much more than 8 gallons, it takes no time to fill it up. It's not an ideal design, as black water in the shower is beyond gross! In my remodel of the '64, there will be separate black and grey tanks, no question.

bilby05 · 06-08-2009, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roguebrun

question

I am restoring my trailer and trying to figure all the systems out whenever I use any water the blackwater tank fills up to quickly and backs up into my shower. does anyone know why this would happen

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
If your AS is like our '69 Sovereign, we only have one tank. Simply put, the black water is held into the tank by the (blade type) waste valve. You pull it up the and black water goes out. The gray water pipe goes into the sewer pipe outside the blackwater valve. So the only thing holding the graywater into the sewer is the cap at the outside end. So...If you leave the blackwater valve closed the shower and sink water can only go as far as the tank, not into the tank.(so once the pipes are full the gray water will back up into the shower.) If you leave the blackwater valve open (but the sewer end cap on) the graywater will back up into the black tank, and then will back up into the shower, when full. Yurk. Been there done that. The only reason I know this is because my blackwater tank drain valve has failed and I have spent the morning out there trying to figure out how to replace it. And that's the way it looks to me. Maybe someone else has pictures(drawings), because as I read my description I realize I would hate to try to understand the system from a verbal description.
cheers, bill b.

bullydogsmom · 06-08-2009, 03:01 PM

We have a 72 Tradewind. In 72 you didn't need a grey tank, you simply opened the valve and allow the water to sidcharge onto the ground, no need for a grey tank.

Now in most areas you can't discharge your grey water onto the ground. We have installed a grey water tank, about 35 gallon size. If you want to see how we did it go to the Tradewind section of the forums and click onto the three titled. "Annette's Folley". Welcome to the forums, this is an invaluable source for information.

Did they make a park model in 75?

Annette

roguebrun · 06-08-2009, 03:12 PM

i just went out there filled it up then pulled valve and it does not even seem like 8 gallon more like 2 gallons could there be anything else that might cause this

roguebrun · 06-08-2009, 04:01 PM

ok i went back out again filled up 7 gallon bucket poured 5 gallons in and it started coming out of shower drain. WOW what a poor design why would they make it so small!!! ugh I guess unless you are hooked up to sewer your best bet is to put another tank in that bugs

bullydogsmom · 06-08-2009, 04:04 PM

I can't beleve that it only holds 5 gallons, you've got to have another problem. Have you dropped the back belly pan to see if you have a tank for grey water? You should, unless they made a park model for 75, then it would have no tank. That sucks.

Annette

bullydogsmom · 06-08-2009, 04:12 PM

What do you have for a trailer? Your profile says, 75, but your title says 72? Which is it? A 72 will not have a grey water tank and the water that you are pouring in is just backing up in all the drain pipes and then backing up into your shower. Then when you open the valve you are draining the backed up water out.

Annette

P.S. Our blackwater tank is about 18 gallons. That's the one that sits on the floor under the toilet.

roguebrun · 06-08-2009, 04:45 PM

it's a 72 tradewind 25ft I thought it was a 75 when I first bought it then looked closer at the title so no grey water only grey and black combined under the toilet

I can see the tank under the toilet when I open the closet, but I poured 5 gallons of water into the toilet as well and it came up through the shower drain again so it does not seem to hold 18 gallons what would cause this. I will take the belly pan off to check etc but I guess I will have to put another tank in eventually for the gray water.

bullydogsmom · 06-08-2009, 05:12 PM

You could have what they call "the blackhills" stuck in there, If you get my drift. They say it get hard as a rock and is almost impossible to get it out. That's what happens if someone didn't empty the poop tank!

If you go to my tjread there is a picture on there somewhere of our new blackwater tank sitting in the corner, so you could get a visual of what the size is. Unless your bath layout is different than ours, and it could be. Is your toilet off to the right in the bath or straight in front of you when you stand in the doorway?

Annette

P.S. Post a picture of what you think is the blackwater tank. I Should be directly under the toilet, not in the closet,

roguebrun · 06-08-2009, 08:09 PM

toilet is off to the right I will take a picture and post it in the morning

thanks for your help

**azflycaster** · 06-08-2009, 08:23 PM

There is only one way that water from the toilet (black tank) can back into the shower.

The drain valve for the black tank is open or leaking (badly) and the drain outlet cap in on. This will cause the water from the black tank to flow down to the outlet cap and then start to back into the grey water lines. Since the black tank is higher then the shower drain, the water will back into the shower before the black tank fills.

easyride · 06-08-2009, 08:27 PM

Close the 3" blade valve,and see how much it will hold ,With the valve open ,all you are doing is filling up the pipes.If you don`t have full hookup you need a blueboy for your gray.Dave

Aage · 06-08-2009, 08:36 PM

roguebrun,

Glad to see you are hard at work making the most of your trailer. I have a suggestion that might make things easier for you: consider buying a Service Manual for 1972. There is only one for every year, and all the models for that year are covered in it, and you wiull find a wealth of information on your trailer.

Not that you can't ask here, but the manula has detail that's hard to find elsewhere: diagrams of the plumbing, electrical, and all your systems, including instructions on removal and replacement, plus tons of diagrams showing how everything works and where things are in your trailer.

I'd be lost without mine

, I use it all the time, it answers a zillion questions really clearly.

Ganglin · 06-08-2009, 08:38 PM

It sounds like your trailer is operating exactly as it was designed. At that time grey water was allowed in most places to drain out on the ground or - you put a cap on the outside drain that has a hose fitting and ran that hose off the site or into a grey water drain line that some campgrounds had.

Your grey water is not intended to be allowed to enter the black tank and should not be unless your somewhere in a pinch and have to do so. Think about how you would then have to empty the system - you would have to close the black valve then pull the outside cap. When you did a mix of black/grey water will be in the lower line and pour out. The original manual shows collecting that in a bucket - then hooking up your sewer drain line and pulling the black valve to fully drain the system. Messy - messy.

So what is happening to you is the black valve is closed (as it should be) and you have the main cap in place. The only place for grey water to go is to build up in the drain line - after a few gallons it backs up into the lowest spot - the tub. This is the same set up we have.

I'm in a campground that has only grey drains (rare these days) so my black tank valve stays closed and grey drains from a hose adaptor into a grey water pit pipe. The campground has what they call the "honey pot" and will come around and drain the black tank for you - or you can hook up and pull the trailer to their black drain and empty it yourself. We only use the black tank for liquids so we generally need to empty the black tank 3 times in a season. In most state campgrounds in Ohio for example - you will have no drain lines and will not be allowed to let the grey water run out on the ground.

Unless you want to rip the belly pan off and cut the grey lines and plumb in a grey tank (I'll pass) - get a hose adaptor and portable grey water tank with a short section of hose. We have a 30 gallon with a tow hook so you can pull it with the tow vehicle to the campgrounds grey water drain and empty it.

According to the 71 owners manual you should have a 14 gallon black tank if your trim level is Land Yacht and 21 gallons if the trim level is an International.

1 Garden Hose Adpater SKU5463 - $21.95 : ODMRV , Out-of-Doors Mart

Thetford SmartTote and SmartTote LX Portable Waste Tanks - Product - Camping World

bullydogsmom · 06-09-2009, 05:53 AM

Yup. what Richard said.

Annette

roguebrun · 06-09-2009, 01:05 PM

thanks for all your help

at this point I am sure it is my black water valve as I remember looking up and seeing it was broken. so I will just have to replumb that valve and maybe think about installing the extra grey water tank at some point . anyway its just a matter of time money and patience

again thanks for all the advice as we are excited about getting her up and going soon

in the meantime check out our interior restoration