Trailer brake problems

[2airishuman]

that blank fuse thing has gotten a lot of folks here, dumb move on ge'em part to NOT use real fuses.

sorry for the confusion in my last post...

the actibrake "controller unit/reservoir" is still in use, it's the brake caliper that's different.

kodiak single piston models were used in 05, but NOW they are using dexter dual piston? calipers, i think.

so terry, your trailer has dexter axles, dexter hubs and dexter brake calipers, right?

cheers
2air'

[WK57ABF]

Terry,

Surprised that your Actibrake has been working off the trailer batteries, our 2007 Classic has B+ (charge lead) pin direct to Actibrake from tow vehicle. According to latest A/S wiring schematic Actibrake does not work off trailer batteries only 7 pin connector.

Our system-Dexter axles & hubs, Dexter fixed caliper 4 pistons per end and new style Actibrake actuator, i.e. not plastic rectangular but alloy base/reservoir and plastic motor/PCB housing on top. Still having problems with drag after release of tow vehicle brakes.

Went for a cruise Sunday on our new Harley Fatboy, 1100 miles on clock, broke down miles from anywhere. Jammed up gearbox. What a year we are having!!

John & Carole

[terryg]

Sorry to hear about the Harley breakdown. My A/S dealer told me today Actibrake is sending a replacement unit. They think it's an issue with the pump's pressure relief system caused by contaminated Hyd. fluid. We'll see. My brake setup, as yours, is all Dexter. Hmmm, my Actibrake setup was working fine for 300+ miles with no power to the B+ pin. I'll post an update when we get the new Actibrake unit installed.

Terry

[terryg]

We just picked up our A/S with the newly replaced (and updated) Actibrake unit. So far it's working fine. The Actibrake tech's seem to think there was a partial blockage in the pressure relief valve on the old unit.

Terry

[WK57ABF]

Hi Terry,
It's good to hear your trailer brakes are fixed and thanks for letting us know the outcome. It's encouraging to know that this problem can be rectified.
We are now 6 months on from original troubles and our third brake actuator but hopefully this system will now work. If it doesn't, we know that the truck will stop the trailer without brakes so long as we keep out of the hills!!

All the best, John & Carole

[HowieE]

Stephenson

I was just reviewing this post and have a question.

All comments so far have had to do with the activator or electrical. Has anyone looked at the calipers themselves to see if they are freely moving to the relaxed position when the brakes are released. They only move a fraction but they have to move enough to release pressure on the brake pads.

To check this you would have to remove the caliper from it's mounting and remove the brake line. With your hands pressing on the center of the caliper piston see if there is a mechanical bind when compressing the caliper. Point the line hole away from you as you will squirt oil. Without the line attached they should move freely. You would only have the resistance of the O ring on the piston against the wall. It might pay to open the calipers and see if there is any sign of a bind on the caliper bore.

Three activator and still having the problems causes me to want to look elsewhere.

[WK57ABF]

HowieE

Many thanks for your concerns - yes I have checked all the mechanical side of the braking system. In fact the calipers were the first thing I looked at when the brakes were dragging on and overheating. The Dexter axles fitted to our Classic have fixed calipers, therefore only the 4 pistons and 2 brake pads per axle end move back into the caliper. The pads were tight on the discs when overheating occurred but released when the hubs and discs cooled down. I went round all four wheels when cold and could move every pad - they were all loose and rattled inside the retaining pin.

On our latest trip two weeks ago (only 70 miles) everything was working ok, although there is still a delay when releasing brake pedal and the actuator motor stopping, but no excessively hot trailer brakes. I have backed off the initial braking from l5 to 10% on our Hayes Genesis brake controller and will see how this goes on our next trip a week on Sunday.

I have lost all confidence in this system and drive as though the trailer has no brakes, i.e. cautiously.

John

[WK57ABF]

More trailer brake problems!!!

Since our third brake actuator was fitted by dealer back in September, we have travelled only 200 miles visiting five campgrounds. Today, Sat 13 (is this significant?) hitched up to set off for Xmas and New Year at campground near Plymouth, southern England and had to travel 40 miles without brakes again. The last actuator had burnt out circuit board. Looks as though this has happened again. Power to everything - no blown fuses - dead actuator no. 3. Is our dealer, Airstream or Actibrake missing something.

Totally pissed off with this braking system. Anyone know if I can fit electric brakes without replacing axles, i.e. backplates and drums to existing stub axles and using our wheels. I'd gladly spend money converting the system to have peace of mind.

The exporting dealer in Florida is totally ignoring our English importing dealer.

Help, John

[HowieE]

To be sure you get the right answer I would contact Dexter directly.

Dexter Axle - Trailer Axles and Running Gear Components - CONTACT US

As a first shot before you contact them look under the trailer at the end of the axle and see how the disc mechanism is attached to the end of the axle. If you see a 5 bolt pattern on the flange at the axle end odds are in your favor because the backer plate for drum brakes have a 5 bolt pattern.

[WK57ABF]

HowieE

Thanks for coming back - drowning my sorrows with 1.99 red wine at the moment. Will look into it tomorrow - forecast is a clear frosty day.

John

[ROBERT CROSS]

Just finished reading through this thread.

Was thinking of an up-grade for the Classic. BUT, reading this and other threads having major second thoughts. After all, what I got works flawlessly. If it ain't broke, fix it til it is?

Can't imagine how frustrating this must be for you. Keep the faith.

Maybe some of this special vintage would help

[WK57ABF]

Cheers Robert Cross,

Sunday evening and opened more red wine - haven't seen Happy Camper on shelves in UK, would love to try it!!

Yes it is frustrating - gonna try brake actuator no. 4. If that fails, blow the expense, these axle ends are coming off and good old fashioned electric drum brakes going on trailer. I can't do with this hassle for our final years of trailering. For us its about living the dream of full timing on the road - sod
electric over hydraulic brakes, they don't work for us!!!

Regards, John

[WK57ABF]

PS Robert Cross

Hope electric oveer hydraulic brakes don't become compulsory on motorcycles.

John

[3Ms75Argosy]

Ok, not to go too much backwards, but I know in Europe they use hydraulic brakes that use a tongue actuator... as in a surge brake. I don't see why you couldn't get a new tongue in the UK with the actuator built in to work with the brakes you have now.

Not exactly US standards, but may be better then the electric drums...
Marc

[HowieE]

Don't ever consider Surge Brakes for anything you may want to stop.

Surge Brakes only work when the combination is traveling in a straight line. When you are in a curve the hitch with respect to the Surge brake assembly is actually extended and thus can not apply any force to the Surge. Having almost lost my TV and T, much lighter than an Airstream, coming off the Sky Line Drive I will tell you you only know you are in trouble when you start to smell the front brakes on the TV.

[WK57ABF]

3Ms75Argosy (Marc)

Yes - thanks. I have seen these on American trailers in the UK, but they have been do-it-yourself efforts operating a master cylinder and not something I would trust with our 870 lbs noseweight. However, I would fit a commerically produced one and have started to search online. If anyone knows of a manufacturer I would appreciate details.

HowieE

Thanks for info - yes back plate is 5 bolt pattern. There are limitations with overrun brakes but that's all we have over here in UK and I have been using this type of system for over 50 years. I am looking into this and would seriously consider this type of coupler if it was heavy enough. At the moment we are awaiting dealer's response - if they replace the faulty actuator it will be number four. Airstream just tell us to contact Active Technology. Not the response I would have expected considering how dangerous and life threatening this issue is. At the moment we are not road legal and our insurance is probably invalidated. So we are looking at all options to finish up with a usable trailer.

A plea to anyone reading this thread, what would you do?

John

[HowieE]

Another thought on surge brakes.

They generally need about 100 lbs of rearward force on the surge brake system to cause the master cylinder to apply force to the trailer brakes. I mentioned that this force is not there while navigating a curve. Additionally this force would be reduced if you are using a "Cam" type of WD hitch because the friction necessary to ride up on both cams as rearward pressure is applied by the TV brakes would decrease the pressure applied to the surge brake master cylinder. The surge brake system reduce the length of the tongue as pressure is applied to it and thus the bars of a cam type WD hitch will be forced up off the saddles reducing the net force available to the master cylinder.

Now I accept the fact that England does not have hills and switch back curves like those I encountered on the Sky Line Drive but I still would question the use of Surge Brakes on a larger trailer.

If you can get drum brakes for the trailer control them with a brake controller rather than a surge system. Less money and a better system.

[Action]

Originally Posted by HowieE

Another thought on surge brakes.

Now I accept the fact that England does not have hills and switch back curves like those I encountered on the Sky Line Drive but I still would question the use of Surge Brakes on a larger trailer.

I have surge brake system on a 4 wheel drum brake set up on my boat-trailer combo that weighes in at 7350 pounds. It works rather well stopping in straight or non-straight braking conditions. I do not have WD bars and a surge brake system needs a special set up if WD bars are used. However it is possible.

Look at most water craft trailers of any size even up to 10,000 + pound rated ones. You will likely be looking at a surge brake system. When set up they work very well!! For a boat trailer that gets submerged in water electric brakes are not a good thing.

Positives about a surge brake system -
no adjusting a controller or anything to do with a controller as there is no controller
much simplier and less expensive system than electric - less parts and less complex parts
no magnets to wear out
no trailer battery needed in an emergency
no wires to get disconnected or crossed or corroded in a 7 pin connector with the TV
the basic system is the same as in your TV

Negatives about a surge brake system -
can not actuate brakes of trailer independantly of TV (there is small exception to this)
stopping in reverse is an issue
need wd bars it is possible for newer systems - in my opinion this sytems isn't the best for WD bars
same issues as in TV system since it is the same set up as your TV

In my opinion, you remove any wiring concerns from the brake controller to the magnets of the trailer and electric brakes become 80% more reliable. This is likely the issue why Europe does not like electric brakes.

>>>>>>>>>>>Action

[Action]

BTW I have towed my boat and trailer up and down to Flagstaff (Lake Powell) from Phoenix on I-17. This route has at least two 6% grades. Starts at a elevation of 2000 feet in Phoenix and ends at 7000 feet in Flagstaff.

My surge brakes have worked well for this tow on my 7350 pound load.

>>>>>>>>>>Action

[SafariSS]

Where in the heck in the UK did you get the F350? I know they sold the f150s over there for a while, did you import it? Also your Classic, it is US spec as well is it not?

Might have been cheaper to move to New Jersey....