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Old 10-22-2003, 09:20 PM   #1
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1977 31' Sovereign
1992 34' Excella
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my '77 land yacht w/o brakes

Hi folks,
I am needing info/help with the braking system on the '77 land yacht I just purchased. After discovering I had no brakes on the trailer(while towing it ), I have since removed the wheel calipers and had them rebuilt. However, Im still without brakes. I assume my problem is with the master cylinder or the vaccuum booster attached to it. Question, can either be rebuilt as the wheel calipers were? I do hear air passing through the vacuum booster but do not know if it is effecting any actuation to the master cylinder attached to it. Could the membrane in the booster be leaking? Could the the master cylinder be bad and allowing fluid to bypass the the pump? I "m needing suggestions on next possible step. Either remove the whole actuator from the tongue of the trailer and replace or have the existing one rebuilt. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
sincerely stuck in Indiana!
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Old 10-22-2003, 09:35 PM   #2
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There's quite a bit on here about the vacuum disc brakes, which are supposed to be like The Best Trailer Brakes Ever. You do have a vacuum line run back to the trailer from your engine, right?

Andy knows all about 'em - I expect he'll pitch in here in a minute.

I've got a couple of shots of the service manual pages for those brakes - can't do it tonite, but maybe I could email you a couple of pages this weekend. PM me if you're interested.

I do think if you're hearing air rushing thru the booster, that the diaphragm might be bad....

-Don
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Old 10-23-2003, 09:37 AM   #3
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laurandwayne.

When you hear air (actually vacuum) noise when parked, with the engine running, it tell you that the "sync" valve is shot.

The sync valve is at the bottom of the booster.

We rebuild the sync valves with same day turn around.

Andy
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Old 10-23-2003, 10:05 AM   #4
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1977 31' Sovereign
1992 34' Excella
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Thanks for the info,
I may have geen a bit unclear before when describing the air or vacuum sound. I do have the vaccuum line connected to the brake booster on my tow vehicle, but I hear air passing through the trailer booster only when I apply the brakes. Also the fluid level fluctuates in the resevoir somewhat as I apply the brakes. After installing the rebuilt calipers, I tried to bleed the lines but could not get enough pressure to do so. I do not get enough hydraulic fluid back to the calipers to operate them. I hope this makes sense as I know just enough about this subject to be confused. And yes any pictures or access to any service manuals would be helpful.

Thanks again
Wayne
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Old 10-23-2003, 10:16 AM   #5
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laurandwayne.

You are again describing a bad "sync" valve.

Replacements are not available, but we do rebuild them.

We suggest that you call Helen Davis at 937-4928885 for a "service manual."

That manual covers many subjects, along with "how to" for many areas including your disc brakes.

Andy
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Old 10-23-2003, 10:31 AM   #6
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1977 31' Sovereign
1992 34' Excella
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Salem , Oregon
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Thanks Andy,

I have already taken your advice and ordered a svc manual from helen in Ohio.. Given what little I know about my "new trailer" I believe it will be the best $75.00 I could spend. Regarding the sync valve, What is my next step.. Do I send the whole booster/ cylinder to you?
Wayne
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Old 10-23-2003, 04:34 PM   #7
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laurandwayne.

If your in a hurry, you can next day just the "sync" valve to us, along with your name, address and phone number.

We will call you for your CC info, overhaul the sync valve and have it on its way back to you the same day.

Or, if time is not a problem, send us just the "sync" valve, along with the other info, and we will overhaul it within a day or two and return it to you via UPS or Airborne ground service.

Andy
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Old 11-06-2003, 09:40 PM   #8
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1977 31' Sovereign
1992 34' Excella
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more hydraulic brake questions

Andy,
perhaps you might know?
Since recieving your advice on my sync valve question, I have removed the booster, master cylinder and sync valve. I found a local fellow heere in Evansville that may know more about hydraulic/vacuum brakes than anyone I know, except you of course. Anyway after describing to him my brake problem, (not getting pressure to the calipers), he couldn't wait to tackle the job. He took the manuel I purchased and proceeded to rebuild the booster, and cylinder. After that he applied vacuum to the system and tested the sync valve to see if it was functioning correctly. Turns out it was. I reinstalled it on the trailer, bled the brakes and took it for a test run. I now have brakes but my question is, how much braking power should I have? When I apply the trailer brakes only I feel the rig slowing down but I do not get maximum braking power. Is there adjustments or is this all I can expect? Any thoughts?

Wayne
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Old 11-07-2003, 10:35 AM   #9
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Wayne.

Still sounds like the sync valve is not functioning correctly.

It governs the amount of braking power.

The other could be that the shop did not bleed the brakes completely.

Andy
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Old 11-08-2003, 06:54 PM   #10
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1977 31' Sovereign
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Unhappy Andy I found my braake problem

Andy
I found the brake problem on the land yacht.
Turns out when I tried to bleed the brakes again according to the svc manuel, I found a leak at on of the fittings near the wheels.
Its at at the T where teh brake tubing splits to the two wheels.

Turns out the fitting is split and I have been every where looking ofr a replacement but no luck. Its a reducing fitting that has a female end on both ends. Any suggestions on parts place that might carry such a fitting? thanks
Wayne
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Old 11-08-2003, 07:44 PM   #11
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Some of the larger brake shops - especially those that work with larger trucks - can fabricate anything you will need for hydraulic brake systems.

Mark
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Old 11-09-2003, 02:16 PM   #12
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Laurandwayne

We do not have that fitting.

You will probably have to resort to having one made, unless you can find someone that has removed the disc brakes and saved the parts.

Andy
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Old 11-09-2003, 04:55 PM   #13
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1977 23' Safari
1976 31' Sovereign
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Brake fitting

Wayne,
If you will describe where the T is located and the approx size of it I may have what you are looking for. Our trailer had the disc brakes at one time but the PO swapped them out for electric brakes. I still have some of the brake lines attached to the frame and maybe I have what you need.
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Old 11-09-2003, 06:23 PM   #14
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1992 34' Excella
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Brake fitting

Mike

The fitting I need is located directly behind the wheels on either side of the trailer. Your can see the fitting by looking in between the 2 tires. The brake line runs along the frame until it splits at the "T" fitting that carries fluid to both discs. I have the "T" fitting but the reducing fitting attached to the "T" fitting is the one that split. You can identify the fitting because it is on the side of the "T" that comes from the master cylinder and has the largest tubing attached to it. I hope this is not too confusing.

Thanks for the reply. Let me know if you find anything.

Wayne
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Old 11-09-2003, 08:42 PM   #15
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Brake line parts

Wayne,
If they are the double female reducers that attach to the male on the T, I do have 2 of the reducers. Let me see if I can get them off tommorrow without any problems. I will let you know if they come off ok. PM me your address and I will send them to you.
Mike B
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Old 11-10-2003, 08:45 PM   #16
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Brake line parts

Wayne,
I pulled the T,s off my trailer today complete with the reducers you need . If you will PM your address I will send them in the mail.
Mike B
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Old 11-19-2003, 03:19 PM   #17
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1992 34' Excella
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Talking brake fittings

Hey Mike

Sorry I haven't responded before now. I received the fittings the other day and have since installed them on the trailer. They are just what I needed. It only took about an hour to install and bleed the lines. Guess what? I've got brakes and great brakes I might add. I can stop the whole rig now by operating the electronic sending unit under the dash. Mike you have been such a resource and so has this site!! Please PM me the costs and I will send you some $$$. Its the least I can do. Now that I have brakes I want to take the trailer somewhere but I will probably start to winterize it instead. We could get the big freeze here in Indiana any day. Anyway thanks for everything....I hope I can repay the favor someday. Back to the brakes....
Question....Are there guidelines for using the electronic sending unit instead of the brakes on the tow vehicle? There is an adjustment on it and how do you know where to set it?
Just wondering. I hope all went well at the docs. let me know.

Thanks again
Wayne
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Old 11-19-2003, 09:12 PM   #18
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Brake fittings

laurandwayne,
I was glad to be able to help out. You dont owe me anything. The parts were not doing me any good so I am glad they were able to fix your problem. Maybe some day I will need something that you have or can find and will return the favor to me or someone else. That is one of the greatest thing about this forum, the people who are willing to help each other deal with our aluminum obsessions.
Now to your Brake controller. I know nothing at all about the disc brake setup. Is the master cylinder vacuum operated or is there a electronic controller which somehow activates the master cylinder? It would probably help if you say what kind or brand of controller you have so someone could give you more info.
Good luck
Mike B
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Old 11-19-2003, 09:54 PM   #19
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another owner of a 1977 airstream

We also own a 1977 31' sovereign land yacht with disc brakes.We live 15 miles east of Owensboro,ky.That is about a 45 minuite drive from Evansville.We bought ours in april of this year.If you have any questions about yours,email me at : owner2037@wmconnect.com. Mechanic
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Old 12-25-2003, 10:02 PM   #20
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Mechanic,
Those disc brakes are awesome aren't they! I replaced wheel bearings/races not long ago and did a close inspection of my caliphers and rotors. Those rotors are sure heavy.
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