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10-10-2017, 05:24 PM
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#1
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1 Rivet Member
Baton Rouge
, Louisiana
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 13
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Electric brakes not working
Silly question. Should I be able to 'hear' the electric brakes being actuated (my ear near the brakes in the trailer wheel well) when my helper depresses the brake pedal in the tow vehicle? Brake lights, blinkers, running lights all function properly, but trailer brakes not working.
Had the brake control module in my F-150 checked by Ford dealership, they claim brake controller is working.
Also hooked up 7 pin to wife's Honda Pilot with functioning brake controller, but can't hitch up to pull and test due to hitch weight restrictions on Pilot.
Any suggestions shy of hooking up to another tow vehicle?
Should I be able to hear brakes on trailer being actuated?
Thanks
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10-10-2017, 05:42 PM
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#2
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1 Rivet Member
ooo
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 17
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Pull the pin on the emergency breakaway module and you should hear a humming noise. If that occurs then the seven pin connector may not be making a connection on the brake contact.
Terry
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10-10-2017, 05:53 PM
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#3
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Figment of My Imagination
2012 Interstate Coach
From All Over
, More Than Anywhere Else
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 10,868
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Quick function test for trailer brakes without moving the trailer:
Jack up a wheel. Spin it by hand. Apply the brakes. Wheel should abruptly stop spinning.
If one brake works, then you have current, and can reasonably assume that all brakes work. But if you still have doubts, repeat the test with the other wheels.
__________________
I thought getting old would take longer!
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10-10-2017, 06:06 PM
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#4
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Dazed and Confused
Currently Looking...
1983 31' Airstream310
Hillsburgh
, Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,805
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Hook up trailer and start down the road; without touching the brakes in the TV apply manual brakes to your trailer via the brake controller; if you start slowing down rapidly, you have working brakes. While doing this, have another person watching the trailer from inside the vehicle; if the trailer starts a subtle swing or jerk to one side or the other (you maybe able to feel this in your steering) then braking will be disproportionate on one side of the trailer and the brakes will have to be adjusted or lubricated.
Note, don't apply hard enough to lock up the trailer brakes as you will flat spot the tires.
Cheers
Tony
__________________
Per Mare, Per Terram and may all your campaigns be successful.
“It’s a recession when your neighbor loses his job; it’s a depression when you lose your own.” "Harry S Truman"
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10-10-2017, 06:08 PM
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#5
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1 Rivet Member
Baton Rouge
, Louisiana
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 13
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tblkfsh, so the brakes should hum if emergency breakaway is pulled? Should that also be the case when pressing TV brakes, if the trailer brakes are functioning correctly?
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10-10-2017, 06:09 PM
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#6
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1 Rivet Member
Baton Rouge
, Louisiana
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 13
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Protagonist, excellent suggestion. Thanks
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10-10-2017, 06:17 PM
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#7
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1 Rivet Member
Baton Rouge
, Louisiana
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isuzusweet
Hook up trailer and start down the road; without touching the brakes in the TV apply manual brakes to your trailer via the brake controller; if you start slowing down rapidly, you have working brakes. While doing this, have another person watching the trailer from inside the vehicle; if the trailer starts a subtle swing or jerk to one side or the other (you maybe able to feel this in your steering) then braking will be disproportionate on one side of the trailer and the brakes will have to be adjusted or lubricated.
Note, don't apply hard enough to lock up the trailer brakes as you will flat spot the tires.
Cheers
Tony
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Thanks Terry. I tried that this past weekend. Controller module in TV, when pinched while rolling,will not slow vehicles.
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10-10-2017, 06:30 PM
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#8
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1 Rivet Member
Baton Rouge
, Louisiana
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 13
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This all started when I accidentally pinched and cut the 7 pin cable due to not raising the jack foot high enough and the WD bars pinched the cable. I lost running lights, backup camera and trailer brakes. I had AS dealership replace electrical cable. Initially, running lights and camera were inoperable but I solved that by replacing a fuse in TV. But still no trailer brakes. Next I took truck to Ford dealership and they reset the brake controller module in truck, but when I hooked up, me trailer brakes.
Was hoping it was a TV issue, so I tried wife's Pilot. All lights work, but no sound near trailer brakes when Pilots brakes actuated.
If pulling emergency pin doesn't work (no humming sound) seems likely to be a AS installation issue when they replaced cable.
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10-10-2017, 06:34 PM
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#9
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1 Rivet Member
ooo
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 17
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If the brakes don't operate with the breakaway pin pulled then the problem is with the trailer. If they do then the problem is forward of the module.
Terry
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10-10-2017, 06:49 PM
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#10
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Rivet Master
2002 30' Classic S/O
Fleming Island
, Florida
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,668
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I don't want to contradict anyone but I have never heard a hum from my brakes, even when testing them with the breakaway switch. The brakes operate on DC. I don't see how 3A of DC current going through a magnet would create a hum. You might hear a click when the magnet pulls up against the face of the drum, but you might not. If you have access to one side of the breakaway switch wiring, open it up and put an ammeter in series. You should see about 3 amps for each wheel, i.e. 12 amps on a tandem trailer. If no ammeter, use a 12V bulb. It should light, but maybe not full brightness.
As an alternative, if you have an ohmmeter, measure between the brake pin on your trailer connector and ground. It should read about 1 ohm for a tandem trailer and 2 ohms for a single axle trailer.
Al
__________________
“You cannot reason someone out of a position they have not been reasoned into"
Al, K5TAN and Missy, N4RGO WBCCI 1322
2002 Classic 30 Slideout -S/OS #004
2013 Dodge 2500 Laramie 4x4 Megacab Cummins
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10-10-2017, 07:41 PM
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#11
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1 Rivet Member
Baton Rouge
, Louisiana
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 13
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Thanks all for the suggestions.
Thomas
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10-10-2017, 08:01 PM
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#12
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Rivet Master
1972 31' Sovereign
1975 31' Excella 500
Currently Looking...
Benton
, Arkansas
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,868
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What I would do initially is to disconnect the cord to the tow vehicle, pull the breakaway pin and with a TEST LIGHT I would probe the brake wires at the wheels. One of each of the two wires entering each drum should light the light.
If not, keep moving forward toward the breakaway switch and the plug.
You are going to have an open circuit.
If you have a light at each wheel, your brakes might just be out of adjustment.
__________________
The fact that I am opinionated does not presuppose that I am wrong......
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10-10-2017, 08:29 PM
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#13
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Half a Rivet Short
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 15,684
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Hi
If you pull the break away cable, try to move the trailer. If it moves with out the wheels dragging, you have a problem. It's not a 7 pin issue at this point. This *assumes* the trailer battery is charged and working ok. The break away is pretty simple. There's not a lot there. It's a switch that puts the trailer battery on the brake magnets. Grab the multimeter, switch works or it does not. If the switch works, power either gets to the brake wires or not. Power to the wires and no brakes, the magnets are likely fried.
If the break away works and the 7 pin does not, you have a 7 pin wiring problem. Multimeter on the brake wire should tell you if you have power out of the TV (may involve putting the TV in gear ...). You can then trace it into the trailer and figure out where it stops. Mr Google will turn up a lot of diagrams of what the 7 pin should look like ....
Lots of Fun
Bob
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10-10-2017, 08:39 PM
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#14
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Rivet Master
2013 25' FB Flying Cloud
Longmont
, Colorado
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,105
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My brakes are sometimes loud enough I can hear them when I am sitting in my TV. Other times they are quiet enough I can't hear them when I am standing next to the trailer axles.
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10-10-2017, 08:46 PM
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#15
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Rivet Master
1972 31' Sovereign
1975 31' Excella 500
Currently Looking...
Benton
, Arkansas
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,868
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Funny thing is, I would isolate the problem in ten minutes if I was there.
I have a test light with a built in voltmeter and a polarity meter, a power probe, and a voltmeter. That is more than enough diagnostic for the primitive systems that a trailer has.
Finding the problem is simple, telling someone else how to do it is more challenging.
__________________
The fact that I am opinionated does not presuppose that I am wrong......
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10-10-2017, 08:51 PM
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#16
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Rivet Master
1972 31' Sovereign
1975 31' Excella 500
Currently Looking...
Benton
, Arkansas
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,868
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. Morgan
Funny thing is, I would isolate the problem in ten minutes if I was there.
I have a test light with a built in voltmeter and a polarity meter, a power probe, and a voltmeter. That is more than enough diagnostic for the primitive systems that a trailer has.
Finding the problem is simple, telling someone else how to do it is more challenging.
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I would energize the system by pulling the breakaway switch, and then get busy with a test light. 99% of the time a GOOD test light is all that is needed.
__________________
The fact that I am opinionated does not presuppose that I am wrong......
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10-11-2017, 07:40 AM
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#17
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Half a Rivet Short
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 15,684
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquared
My brakes are sometimes loud enough I can hear them when I am sitting in my TV. Other times they are quiet enough I can't hear them when I am standing next to the trailer axles.
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Hi
The reason you "hear" your brakes is that the controller in your TV is modulating (switching) the voltage to the brake magnets at an audio frequency. Not all brake controllers do this.
When you pull the breakaway cable, there is no fancy solid state gizmo involved. It's just a dead simple switch. DC goes straight onto the magnets. No fast audio frequency switching involved. No noise ....
If the trailer is moving and the brakes are on, yes, you will hear noise from the shoes. That's not the same thing ...
Bob
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10-11-2017, 09:42 AM
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#18
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ObviouslyKnot
Currently Looking...
KAILUA
, HI
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 862
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCC-1701
tblkfsh, so the brakes should hum if emergency breakaway is pulled? Should that also be the case when pressing TV brakes, if the trailer brakes are functioning correctly?
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There is suspicion by some for some brake controllers, that the controller is inertia sensitive and may not work the same while stationary. Finding the technical basis for this suspicion may be difficult.
The emergency switch is AWN (pulled out) or AWF (plugged in) with no other smarts.
__________________
James Mileur, HY80-2-Al,
2017 Classic Twin, 2016 RAM 3500 Megacab, ProPride hitch
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10-11-2017, 10:13 AM
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#19
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Rivet Master
2012 28' International
Olympia
, Washington
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 773
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al and Missy
I don't want to contradict anyone but I have never heard a hum from my brakes, even when testing them with the breakaway switch. The brakes operate on DC. I don't see how 3A of DC current going through a magnet would create a hum. You might hear a click when the magnet pulls up against the face of the drum, but you might not. If you have access to one side of the breakaway switch wiring, open it up and put an ammeter in series. You should see about 3 amps for each wheel, i.e. 12 amps on a tandem trailer. If no ammeter, use a 12V bulb. It should light, but maybe not full brightness.
As an alternative, if you have an ohmmeter, measure between the brake pin on your trailer connector and ground. It should read about 1 ohm for a tandem trailer and 2 ohms for a single axle trailer.
Al
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My brakes do hum. Do you have disc brakes?
__________________
Dave
2014 Ram 2500 CTD
Pro Pride
Centramatics
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10-11-2017, 11:17 AM
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#20
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Half a Rivet Short
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 15,684
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daveswenson
My brakes do hum. Do you have disc brakes?
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Hi
Do they hum when you pull the breakaway cable with the 7 pin disconnected? The vast majority of AS TT's come with drum brakes, so no controller on the trailer.
Bob
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