Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 08-02-2019, 07:57 PM   #1
2 Rivet Member
 
2018 22' Sport
1972 29' Ambassador
Las Vegas , Nevada
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 83
Brake Controller Issues

Hello everyone, is this the right place to ask questions about brake controller issues?
Ok, my tow vehicle is a 2014 Chevy Silverado with a Primus IQ controller.
A few weeks ago i coming home with the Bambi we noticed that the controller kept losing connection. Normalky i would look down and see a number on it whenever a trailer was hooked up. But this time i noticex it just showed a dot. Manually activating the trailer brakes would only show nc.
Thought itnwas a bad connection in the resr so i wiggled it a few times and then all was good.
Not anymore. Twice i've rowed with different trailers and none were able to connect.
What i've found so far using a light meter at the back of the controller:
- Constant voltage on black wire
- Voltage present on white wire when depressing the brakes
- Voltage present on red wire when i manually operate trailer brakes
At the back of the truck:
- Truck brake lights work when i manually operate the brake controller
- Voltage is sent to brakes
- All trailer lights work the way they are supposed to

Now i mention voltage present, because i am using a light meter. I've yet to actually meassure voltage.
What voltage should i see being sent to the brakes???
__________________

Swrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2019, 11:26 PM   #2
PKI
Rivet Master
 
PKI's Avatar
 
2015 23' FB Flying Cloud
Walnut Creek , California
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 3,802
Over time, the umbilical plug connections may not make good contact. Clean with contact cleaner and add a light coating of dielectric grease. When we picked up the trailer, there was no lighting connection. The umbilical was not making contact. Working it a bit resolved the issue. Going to have to do some cleaning myself. May not be your problem, but worth the effort. Pat
__________________

PKI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2019, 10:56 PM   #3
2 Rivet Member
 
2018 22' Sport
1972 29' Ambassador
Las Vegas , Nevada
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKI View Post
Over time, the umbilical plug connections may not make good contact. Clean with contact cleaner and add a light coating of dielectric grease. When we picked up the trailer, there was no lighting connection. The umbilical was not making contact. Working it a bit resolved the issue. Going to have to do some cleaning myself. May not be your problem, but worth the effort. Pat
Thanks for the advice, i did notice that, but looking ay my truck it doesn't seem like theres any corrosion at the hook up.
Maybe i don't understand how the controller works, but when i manually activate it my brake lights come on and i see voltage at the right pins.
How much voltage should i see being sent to the brakes?
Also, because it shows "nc" could it be an internal fault with the controller?
Swrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2019, 05:16 AM   #4
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,471
If you're thinking about replacing the trucks plug, this might be of interest as a replacement. They have plug and play components, no splicing.

http://www.hopkinstowingsolutions.co...fic/40974.html

Confirm part number, this was a quick look.

I've measured voltage and current on a few drum brake rigs and while I do not consider this all knowing and definitive, the values were in the 9V and 14A range on full brake.

Gary
__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2019, 05:45 AM   #5
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawus"
 
ROBERT CROSS's Avatar

 
2003 25' Classic
Zanadude Nebula , Milky Way
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 14,894
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swrider View Post
Thanks for the advice, i did notice that, but looking ay my truck it doesn't seem like theres any corrosion at the hook up.
Maybe i don't understand how the controller works, but when i manually activate it my brake lights come on and i see voltage at the right pins.
How much voltage should i see being sent to the brakes?
Also, because it shows "nc" could it be an internal fault with the controller?
Go to the 7pin connection first, clean with lectraclean and lube with dielectric grease
.
The controller is not likely the cause.

The voltage supplied depends on the gain setting,(CFG on the TC)

Bob
🇺🇸
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	fullsizeoutput_1b9b.jpg
Views:	21
Size:	99.0 KB
ID:	348845  
__________________
"Any nation that can survive what we have lately in the way of government, is on the high road to permanent glory."
Molly Ivins

"Instead of going to ’Starbucks…I make my own Coffee at home, yell out my name rong, then light a five dollar bill on fire"
Amanamus


Tahawus....🌥
ROBERT CROSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2019, 06:35 AM   #6
Rivet Master
 
gator.bigfoot's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic
KW , Ontario
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swrider View Post
Thought it was a bad connection in the resr so i wiggled it a few times and then all was good.
I think you've already proven it was a bad connection and not the controller. A lot of times it is not your TV, but the trailers umbilical cord connector. Either way it sounds like there is a bad or broken connection.

You can start by ohming out the trailer side. Plug in a connector to the umbilical cord and then check the circuit from there to the inside of the AS at the termination point. It's always good to have some spare connectors.

If your trailer side ohms out then you can start on the TV. But I think you've already indicated that it's ok. Contact cleaner can work wonders on poor connections. But dielectric grease can keep them oxidizing and corroding.

Years ago, when I ran into this issue I made a got a connector and attached a 12 volt halogen light to it. Then I could see the intensity of the light from the brake controller. I actually started by just plugging in the light at the controller end. Once that was working I attached it to the back. I was a good way of proving that my TV was OK. In my case the controller worked manually, but didn't work with the brake pedal. Ended up being a defective rear SAM.

Any cheap ohm meter will do, but if you want a better one then be prepared to pay for it. A good Fluke can set you back https://www.amazon.com/Fluke-115-Com...=bestcont06-20, but there are many other good meters for far less https://www.amazon.com/Fluke-101-Mul...6561&s=gateway. Check Amazon or go to HF for cheapies. I always keep a cheap meter in the trailer. They are good enough for measuring low voltage and ohming things out. Just never use it on high voltage.
gator.bigfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2019, 08:19 AM   #7
Rivet Master
 
Mollysdad's Avatar
 
2017 26' Flying Cloud
Tampa , Florida
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,445
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swrider View Post

What i've found so far using a light meter at the back of the controller:
- Constant voltage on black wire (YEP!)
- Voltage present on white wire when depressing the brakes (NOPE!)
- Voltage present on red wire when i manually operate trailer brakes(YEP!)
At the back of the truck:
- Truck brake lights work when i manually operate the brake controller
- Voltage is sent to brakes
- All trailer lights work the way they are supposed to
That doesn't sound right.
By 'light meter' I assume you mean a probe that lights up with 12v?

Are you using Tekonsha's harness? Did they have a plug and play for your truck?

The red wire is the connection to stop lights
The white wire is the ground.
The black wire is 12v. "Battery"
The brakes should be on a blue wire separate from the brake lights.

My controller let's me know if the connection is bad. To me it's very loose and I need to push it in farther than I'd think. (A notch on the plug engages a prong on the cover flap)
Brake voltage is somewhere around 2-3 v. (Certainly not 12v.) This will not lite a bulb.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	7-pin-trailer-connector.jpg
Views:	19
Size:	54.2 KB
ID:	348850   Click image for larger version

Name:	71BCGQKxDCL._SX425_.jpg
Views:	20
Size:	13.7 KB
ID:	348851  

Mollysdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2019, 08:54 AM   #8
Rivet Master
 
Mollysdad's Avatar
 
2017 26' Flying Cloud
Tampa , Florida
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,445
Blog Entries: 1
BTW Tekonsha sells a pre made wiring harness for your truck 2017 Chevy Silverado (1500?) plug and play
# 316-P
https://www.amazon.com/Tekonsha-3016...e&sr=1-2-fkmr1

You Tube is your friend! (maybe)
Mollysdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2019, 02:09 PM   #9
2 Rivet Member
 
2018 22' Sport
1972 29' Ambassador
Las Vegas , Nevada
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mollysdad View Post
That doesn't sound right.
By 'light meter' I assume you mean a probe that lights up with 12v?
Yes, a simple light meter

Are you using Tekonsha's harness? Did they have a plug and play for your truck?
Yes using a plug and play harness for a 2014 Silverado

The red wire is the connection to stop lights
The white wire is the ground.
The black wire is 12v. "Battery"
The brakes should be on a blue wire separate from the brake lights.

My controller let's me know if the connection is bad. To me it's very loose and I need to push it in farther than I'd think. (A notch on the plug engages a prong on the cover flap)
Brake voltage is somewhere around 2-3 v. (Certainly not 12v.) This will not lite a bulb.
Thanks for all the replies.
To Mollysdad,

Using the light meter i have voltage where i should. It also makes sense that it lights up on the white wire, it its ground then when i hit the brakes, the circuit completes and i should see a voltage on it.
The problem is not on the trailer side, because this happens on three differe t trailers now. Unless i have three bad canles. That would suck.
At this point, im going to concentrate on the connector at the back of the truck.
So.ething there is not making good contact and the controller doesn't see a connection. Thats why i think i receive an "nc" even with the trailer hooked up.
Swrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2019, 11:04 AM   #10
2 Rivet Member
 
2018 22' Sport
1972 29' Ambassador
Las Vegas , Nevada
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 83
OK, so I am looking at the owners manual for my '72 International, just happened to be paying attention and i found something that im not sure if i am seeing right. According to what I see, the layout of the trailer plug has the brake line different than what my truck has.
My Truck has the brake line at the 5oclock position, but this shows it different.
Anyone ever noticed this???
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Trailer Plug .jpg
Views:	18
Size:	130.3 KB
ID:	349116  
Swrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2019, 11:25 AM   #11
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,471
I'm homing in on your comment in post 1

"Twice i've rowed with different trailers and none were able to connect."

The same TV has not connected to multiple different trailers?

Was this TV able to previously connect to any of these three trailers? If yes then the plug wiring (diagram, not physical connections) should not be the concern.

You asked about what voltage, well in this video Tenonsha uses their meter and shows you the controller output test results.

__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2019, 12:19 PM   #12
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawus"
 
ROBERT CROSS's Avatar

 
2003 25' Classic
Zanadude Nebula , Milky Way
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 14,894
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swrider View Post
OK, so I am looking at the owners manual for my '72 International, just happened to be paying attention and i found something that im not sure if i am seeing right. According to what I see, the layout of the trailer plug has the brake line different than what my truck has.
My Truck has the brake line at the 5oclock position, but this shows it different.
Anyone ever noticed this???

I believe the '72 is using the older wiring connector.

Bob
🇺🇸

New style...
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	fullsizeoutput_1c33.jpeg
Views:	18
Size:	50.0 KB
ID:	349124  
__________________
"Any nation that can survive what we have lately in the way of government, is on the high road to permanent glory."
Molly Ivins

"Instead of going to ’Starbucks…I make my own Coffee at home, yell out my name rong, then light a five dollar bill on fire"
Amanamus


Tahawus....🌥
ROBERT CROSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2019, 12:42 PM   #13
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,471
Bob

I to am confused. I’m not sure what trailer he is hooking up to but multiple was stated. So are all of them a different wiring diagram.

But a 2014 would be the current wiring diagram and that tester might be a good place to start and confirm the TV output.

Need more info specifics.

Gary
__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2019, 02:17 PM   #14
2 Rivet Member
 
2018 22' Sport
1972 29' Ambassador
Las Vegas , Nevada
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by GCinSC2 View Post
Bob

I to am confused. I’m not sure what trailer he is hooking up to but multiple was stated. So are all of them a different wiring diagram.

But a 2014 would be the current wiring diagram and that tester might be a good place to start and confirm the TV output.

Need more info specifics.

Gary
Ok, sorry for all the confusion, let me clarify in chronological order.
- The controller worked before while towing an airstream and a utility trailer.
- Noticed that the controller would show "nc" while towing the airstream on a trip back home. Unplugged and replugged multiple times during that trip to make it work.
- Towed the utility trailer and could not get the controller to work. Didn't do any testing.
- Towed the airstream again to the dealership, couldn't get the controller to work.
- Towed a third trailer, my new to me 1972 Ambassador. Couldn't get the controller to work.
- Did a bunch of testing. Using a light probe i verified voltage at the black wire. At the red wire while pressing the brake. At the blue wire while using the manual slide knob. Although the sound and light intensity varied. Kinda makes sense.
- Checked at the back of the TV, same results.
- The diagram posted above comes from the Ambassador's user manual. Not verified that the trailer is wired that way. But really has nothing to do with current issues on the brake controller.

Did i clarify or completely mess it all up?
Swrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2019, 03:44 PM   #15
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,471
I'm suggesting focusing one one trailer, only for this diagnostic.

This one:

"Noticed that the controller would show "nc" while towing the airstream on a trip back home. Unplugged and replugged multiple times during that trip to make it work."

It was working, failed, and reconnecting made it work?

If this was a working rig, factory wiring for 7 way on TV and Airstream wiring matched the TV. Start there.

Leave the other trailers for later until you get a working situation. You may need to rewire other trailer plugs to match if they are yours and do not match the TV.

The video of the Tekonsha tester has merit for a starting point.

Your TV, integrated brake controller?
What year is the Airstream in your comment in blue above?

Gary
__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2019, 05:02 PM   #16
Rivet Master
 
Mollysdad's Avatar
 
2017 26' Flying Cloud
Tampa , Florida
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,445
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swrider View Post
It also makes sense that it lights up on the white wire, it its ground then when i hit the brakes, the circuit completes and i should see a voltage on it.
I must be missing something.
The test light I'm imagining has a clip lead to ground, and a probe with a bulb. So when you touch 12v. the bulb lights. I don't see how touching two grounds passes current.
Mollysdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 06:13 AM   #17
Rivet Master
 
gator.bigfoot's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic
KW , Ontario
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 554
Personally I think you need to start over. Start by checking the TV for the correct response from the wiring. Personally I would update the plug wiring to match current standards. Then re-wire the trailer to match. You need to stick to one standard and to me that is the current one and not one from 1972. But if you do they at least have to match each other, otherwise you won't get anywhere.

One wire needs to be ground in that plug. If the ground wire in the plug is reading 12V then that's messed up. Just drop the plug get your wire snips out and cut the plug off. Then figure out the wiring and wire it right and be done with it.
gator.bigfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 10:51 AM   #18
2 Rivet Member
 
2018 22' Sport
1972 29' Ambassador
Las Vegas , Nevada
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by GCinSC2 View Post
I'm suggesting focusing one one trailer, only for this diagnostic.

This one:

"Noticed that the controller would show "nc" while towing the airstream on a trip back home. Unplugged and replugged multiple times during that trip to make it work."

It was working, failed, and reconnecting made it work?

If this was a working rig, factory wiring for 7 way on TV and Airstream wiring matched the TV. Start there.

Leave the other trailers for later until you get a working situation. You may need to rewire other trailer plugs to match if they are yours and do not match the TV.

The video of the Tekonsha tester has merit for a starting point.

Your TV, integrated brake controller?
What year is the Airstream in your comment in blue above?

Gary
Yes, I will leave other trailers alone until I have a working condition.
The truck is a '14 Silverado using a Tekonsha Primus IQ. The airstream is a "18 Sport 22fb. This setup worked in the past but not anymore. I will continue to troubleshoot this.
Found a video on youtube that uses a lightbulb to simulate a trailer load, and using a 12v power supply you can run tests on the controller.

For anyone interested, here is the link:

Swrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 10:54 AM   #19
2 Rivet Member
 
2018 22' Sport
1972 29' Ambassador
Las Vegas , Nevada
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mollysdad View Post
I must be missing something.
The test light I'm imagining has a clip lead to ground, and a probe with a bulb. So when you touch 12v. the bulb lights. I don't see how touching two grounds passes current.
The test light is something i picked up for cheap in Autozone, looks like a screwdriver with a sharp point at the end, a lightbulb with beeper in the handle and a long lead with a clip for grounding.
Maybe I was confused and measured the wrong wire, or maybe not and having voltage on white means I have a bad ground.
I will recheck all wires again tonight.

Took the controller to a camping supply store and they tested it there. Everything seemed fine, so I guess its now down to the wire harness or the rear TV plug.

Will update with more later tonight...

Thanks for coming along.
Swrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 12:31 PM   #20
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,471
If you are testing at the controller and not at the 7 way, that's leaving a lot of harness untested. Hopefully you can do same at 7 way on TV.

I've never tried this but a friend that was a Chrysler trainer for dealership techs described using a 12VDC fan as a substitute load and the controller could increase or slow down the fan speed.
__________________

__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ford brake controller issues kipper Tow Vehicles 19 10-02-2017 07:15 AM
Brake lights, brake controller not functioning adwriter73 Brakes & Brake Controllers 17 01-16-2014 09:37 AM
Brake controller or trailer brake problem? (newbie alert) jornvango Brakes & Brake Controllers 2 11-01-2012 02:17 PM
New F150 '09 brake controller vs. Prodigy brake controller dukester Brakes & Brake Controllers 17 01-20-2009 10:46 PM
GMC brake controller issues sumsmug Brakes & Brake Controllers 4 03-31-2008 09:24 PM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.