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KYAirstream · 09-08-2015, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m.hony

After 2 ST trailer tire failures, I switched to 16" wheels, load range E LT truck tires, Centramatic balancers, and Dill TPMS.

This upgrade brought me peace of mind.

How much does your trailer weigh when loaded? From looking at 16 inch wheels, I've noticed that the most common load rating seems to be LRE. For my trailer with a loaded weight no more than 7500, I'm wondering if LRE is too much? What do people with lighter trailers do when upgrading to 16s?

Loden · 09-08-2015, 07:30 AM

Just a quick note of thanks to all contributors. I am relatively new to these forums, but even after 30 years of RV experience I keep seeing things I never thought of. This is a GREAT community!

pappy19 · 09-08-2015, 07:59 AM

If you want the best small air compressor set up, then look no further than this one. It isn't cheap, but it will reach all 4 tires on my 31' Classic and is quite fast for such a small compressor.

Product : Extreme Outback

switz · 09-08-2015, 08:41 AM

Our 2014 Classic has a GVW of 10,000 pounds and when loaded for camping there are two tire at 2,050 pounds, one at 1,950 pounds and one at 2,150 pounds. These load weights exceed the derated capacity of 1,983 pounds for the 15" Michelins I used on the 25FB and are using on the 23D. Thus we are using the 16" Michelins at 75 psi and the TPMS says they are happiest at that pressure for our load.

m.hony · 09-08-2015, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KYAirstream

How much does your trailer weigh when loaded? From looking at 16 inch wheels, I've noticed that the most common load rating seems to be LRE. For my trailer with a loaded weight no more than 7500, I'm wondering if LRE is too much? What do people with lighter trailers do when upgrading to 16s?

The wheels have a load rating of 3,850 each.
My trailer weighs 8,800# ready to camp.
I know the wheels are overkill, but are necessary to mount a 16" LT load rage E tire.
If I ever have a flat, I can remove the flat tire and tow with 3 tires on the ground still safely supporting the weight.
I compare it to hi-fi sound equipment- headroom = margin of safety = peace of mind = pleasant, relaxing towing experience for the driver and his DW-

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xrvr · 09-08-2015, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by switz

Our 2014 Classic has a GVW of 10,000 pounds and when loaded for camping there are two tire at 2,050 pounds, one at 1,950 pounds and one at 2,150 pounds. These load weights exceed the derated capacity of 1,983 pounds for the 15" Michelins I used on the 25FB and are using on the 23D. Thus we are using the 16" Michelins at 75 psi and the TPMS says they are happiest at that pressure for our load.

Don't you have to figure tongue weight when checking loads? Are your tire weights with the trailer and WD hooked up? Tongue weight takes weight off the trailer tires, yet using WD adds some back on. Or am I confused, wouldn't be the first time. That's why the axles sometimes aren't rated as high as the gross weight, the tongue weight takes some away.

KYAirstream · 09-08-2015, 07:26 PM

I think most take their weights with WD applied so they know how the trailer is loaded when ready for travel.

The difference of the axle weights of only the TV and the axles weights of the TV with the trailer hitched without WD provides the tongue weight of the trailer.

KYAirstream · 09-08-2015, 07:27 PM

The wheels have a load rating of 3,850 each? That seems like a high load rating. What tires are you running?

KYAirstream · 09-08-2015, 07:29 PM

Also, what PSI are you running for your 8,800lb trailer?

KYAirstream · 09-08-2015, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pappy19

If you want the best small air compressor set up, then look no further than this one. It isn't cheap, but it will reach all 4 tires on my 31' Classic and is quite fast for such a small compressor.

Product : Extreme Outback

Nice setup! You are certainly right about the $$ though.

switz · 09-08-2015, 10:45 PM

I had the Classic up on two sets of four individual wheel weights detached from the truck and with the ProPride attached to the trailer. These numbers are necessary as a baseline to determine what the WD system is actually doing. I know that when parked, where the loads are on my tires and wheels.

Remember GVW also applies when parked in terms of loading the trailer suspension. So if I were to have have six 350 pounders over as guests, I have grossly overloaded the trailer suspension and tires.

WD does not take weight off of the trailer tires. In a perfect world, the total tongue weight would be evenly dived three ways: trailer axles - truck rear axle - truck front axle. So when WD is energized, more weight is transferred back to the trailer axles, not removed.

That 3,850 pound number is the load rating of the SenDel T03-66655T wheel at 80 psi. The Michelin LT225/75R16/E LTX M/S2 tire is rated 2,680 pounds @ 80 psi.

dcasr · 09-09-2015, 07:01 AM

Besides load being over weight limit for a tire, or under inflated, or aged out, tread separation can be caused by poor support when leveling the AS. I used to be somewhat careless with the width of boards I put under my AS when leveling up in a campground, and sometimes only supported the middle half of the tread if I was short on good boards. After I had two tread separations not related to under inflation or over load, I discovered that when we run our tires up on boards or blocks the support needs to provide for equal support across the full width of the tire and be reasonably level as well. It makes me really appreciate level spots to camp.

mbenson1234 · 09-09-2015, 08:06 AM

Hi KYAirstream,
Many members are running the TST TPMS, I would be happy to discuss the system with you. My name is Mike Benson with TST. If you would like to discuss it, you can reach me at 770-889-9102.
Thanks,
Mike Benson
TST

Tireman9 · 09-12-2015, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m.hony

The wheels have a load rating of 3,850 each.
My trailer weighs 8,800# ready to camp.
I know the wheels are overkill, but are necessary to mount a 16" LT load rage E tire.
If I ever have a flat, I can remove the flat tire and tow with 3 tires on the ground still safely supporting the weight.
I compare it to hi-fi sound equipment- headroom = margin of safety = peace of mind = pleasant, relaxing towing experience for the driver and his DW-
Sent from my iPhone using Airstream Forums

I don't understand your math
8,800 /4 =2,200# each tire assuming the unlikely 50/50 axle to axle split plus the unlikely 50/50 side to side split. But even then that means one side i.e. one tire would be loaded to 4,400. What tire are you using with that capacity?

Tireman9 · 09-12-2015, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by switz

snip

Remember GVW also applies when parked in terms of loading the trailer suspension. So if I were to have have six 350 pounders over as guests, I have grossly overloaded the trailer suspension and tires.

snip

.

Sorry you don't really have to worry about GVWR when stationary.
The concern for GVWR is braking and GAWR for highway travel speed on tires. 0 mph tires can carry a lot.

Now maybe your frame may fold up due to your guests but you aren't overloading your tires at zero mph.

m.hony · 09-12-2015, 07:05 PM

It has nothing to do with math or the weight of my trailer.
The wheels are rated to support 3,850 each.
2 of the wheels would be adequate to support a single axle trailer up to 7,700#.
4 of the wheels would support a tandem axle trailer of up 15,400#, or a 14,000# GVW trailer or one with (2) 7,000# axles.
The fact that in my particular scenario, a 10,000# GVW trailer with (2) 5,000# axles, the wheels are complete overkill and have more than enough "headroom"/margin of safety/carrying capacity.
The 3,850# weight carrying capacity per wheel is specified by the manufacturer.
The wheels will support 15,400#, but in my case they only support 8,800#, the weight of my trailer ready to go.
Nothing to do with math, and the wheels are beyond adequate.
The tires also have more weight carrying capacity than I need.
The weight might not be distributed precisely 50/50 front to rear or side to side, but it is fairly close by design of the trailer and weight distribution applied, especially when the rig rides close to dead level.
My rig appears to ride slightly nose down, so one would think there would be more weight/pressure on the front axle, but the worst tread separation was on the rear axle.
Even slightly nose down the weight distribution front to rear or side to side will not be far from equal across the 4 tires/wheels-

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m.hony · 09-12-2015, 07:07 PM

Firestone TransForce HT LT225/75R16

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m.hony · 09-12-2015, 07:12 PM

Each of 4 wheels actually carries + or - 2,200#, but the manufacturer says the wheels will support 3,850# each.
What has math got to do with that?
That just shows, according to the manufacturer, that the wheels can do it, not that I personally have that much weight on them.
I guess as you are traveling the load is constantly changing as you are driving around over bumps and rough surfaces.

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m.hony · 09-12-2015, 07:16 PM

The choice of wheel really had nothing to do with weight carrying capacity, but it's good to know it's there.
It's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.
The reason for getting new wheels was to be able to mount load rage E 10-ply truck tires because I have been burned by ST tires Twice. Why take a chance on a third time around and the possibility of damaging my wheel well or the side of my trailer.
All I was doing was stating the wheel manufacturer's specs.

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switz · 09-13-2015, 08:18 AM

Like a chain that is only as strong as it's weakest link, the 31' Classic suspension's weak link, so to speak, are the tires, especially the original GYM ST225/75R15D tires rated 2,540 pounds @ 65 psi that came on 2014 and earlier models with the GVW of 10,000 pounds.

On average, my Michelin LT225/75R16/E LTX M/S2 trailer tires are carrying 2,050 pounds. But one is carrying 2,150 pounds and one is loaded to 1,950 pounds. Those load numbers might imply that there is adequate "spare" load capacity on the stock GYM tires.

The issue I started reading about here in Airforms in October of 2012 before I even acquired my first Airstream, the 2013 25FB with a GVW of 7,300 pounds, was the absurd number of tires issues that often caused expensive and extensive damage to the Airstream. The culprit tire and model mentioned most of the time was the GYM ST225/75R15D tire.

I had used only Michelin tires on all of my vehicles for over 40 years, so when there were virtually no issues reported during my research with the Michelin LTX (P) 235/75R15 XL tire with a derated capacity of 1,983 pounds for trailer use, I switched to that tire using the stock rims as soon as the trailer was brought home. I had a screw enter the edge of one of the new tires and it had to be replaced under the road hazard warranty. This same model tires mounted on SenDel T03-56545T wheels rated 2,150 pounds at 60psi were also installed at the selling dealership before I took delivery of a 2015 23D International which has a GVW of 6,000 pounds.

The Classic had the Michelin LT225/75R16/E LTX M/S2 tires with the SenDel T03-66655T wheels installed as soon as I got it home and in the storage unit.

For me, the safety priority is safe and reliable tires followed by great brakes. I want to be sure I can safely stop the train whenever necessary.