Bad news - Tire came apart

[Zeppelinium]

I bought a pair of "Trans Rib LT" tires from Firestone 5 months ago and have put about 6200 miles on them. Some really hot days through eastern Oregon, as many of you will recall. Always moderate speed, 65 or so, and never off road. No noticeable damage until this happened at 55 mph in light rain this past weekend. Looks a lot like a retread coming apart. You can see that there is extensive delaminated areas (keys holding the layers apart) still present. The tire retained pressure after losing the tread.

The piece that came off did only minor damage to the inside lip of the wheel well, unlike last time, which required replacement of the banana skin aft of the wheel.



Could this have been anything except a defective tire? I bought these because I had decided that light truck (LT) tires were the way to go and because they had a load rating of 2040 lbs, about 150 lbs more than most LT tires, which gave me about 7% margin on my Caravel.

[Action]

7% is not a huge margin. To me it looks like the tires got hot and the tread shifted away from the carcus. There are a variety of reasons that could cause this.

Load rating of 2040, is that "D"?
So your trailer weighs around 3800 pounds?
What were the tires inflated too?
What is the max pressure these tires are rated for?
What is the date code on the tire?
What does the other tire look like? And bulges? If so where are the bulges?

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[Condoluminum]

I'd want to try for a responsible and thoughtful answer from Firestone, as maker and supplier of the tire.. (And I'd certainly get rid of the other one...).

Given Firestone's history of tire failures that led to takeover and rebranding to Bridgestone for much of product line, I'd think they would want to do more than take a quick look at the tire...

I'd also agree that 7% load margin is slim, especially since max load rating is only at max inflation pressure for tire...

Reluctant to start another volley of tire wars, but curious why you chose LT over TT tire types, in light of other threads stressing manufacturer reasons for putting TT tires on their trailers when new...

John McG

[Action]

As a side note. Bridgestone purchased the Firestone company in 1988. The Firestone tire recall (The latest one of ATX and Wilderness tires) occurred in 2000. There was also the Firestone 500 recall in the 70's. That tire was replaced by the Firestone 721. Both recalls were on passenger rated tires. So Firestone wasn't taken over because of the recall. That happened and the rebranding was ongoing at the time of the recall.

http://www.car-accidents.com/pages/b...re_recall.html

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[Condoluminum]

While the tire failures (and related media coverage) of the 500, 721 and ATX tires were not directly related to the takeover of Firestone by Bridgestone, I continue to believe that Firestone's reputation in the marketplace suffered so badly that retail sales through their dealer network suffered and OEM sales suffered when retail car and SUV buyers demanded tires other than Firestone on new cars. Over 10 million tires were recalled before the merger. People were driving brand new cars to Goodyear and Michelin and other dealers to replace brand new tires, just to avoid risk. Ford terminated their 80 year relationship with Firestone over the ATX tires and allocatoin of blame. The consequence of the early reputation problems led to acquisition of Firestone, and rebranding of many of Firestone tires as Bridgestones after 2000.

John McG

[GlenCoombe]

Well enough of the 'stone side of it all. Glad to hear the AS suffered limited damage and that it didn't cause an accident.
I find it interesting that this happened on a day when tire heat and friction would have been minimized due to the wet conditions.
Having had major damage occur when a sidewall blew out at low speed I can say one thing for certain...."A thrown tread would suit me much better than a blowout."
Let us know how this shakes out in the end please.

[Alumaholic]

If those are Load Range E and you were running less than maximum air pressure to save wear and tear on your Airstream, then they may have overheated.

Those who know trailer tires and those who know Airstreams, recommend against Load Range E for this very reason. Discount Tire here in Albuquerque has been encouraging Load Range E for trailers and telling owners that they can run them at greatly reduced air pressure so they won't ride so rough.
Very bad advice as far as I am concerned.

As for me, I am convinced that Airstreams should have Load Range D "ST" tires, not "LTs."

That's what I buy every ten years whether I need them or not.

[bhayden]

These ries are a bias ply? So much for my theory that using a bias ply eliminates the tread separation so common in steel belted radials. Sure looks like a major screw-up in the stiching process during manufacture.

-Bernie

[Action]

I had a set of bias ply on my dual axle boat trailer. 3 tires did the same as the pic above. One on delivery from Northern Ca and two for me over a 3 year period. I discovered that the tire load rating was marginal at best. Fully loaded I had about 300 to 500 pounds of extra capacity in the tires load rating. Not enough for a 7500 load. I was upset with the no name tire company until I discovered this little gem. After that I was upset with the boat dealer and the boat trailer manufacturer. The tires were really not up for the load. The boat has a 85 gal fuel tank and a 26 gal fresh water tank and a waste tank. If all were full (And I NEVER tow in that condition) this would be close to 1000 pounds of my 7500 pound load. It was no wonder that the tires did as well as they did.

While a picture does tell a story, it may not tell the whole story.

Kinda waiting for Zep's answer to the q's above.

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[Mike Lewis]

Zep---Personally I would never use truck tire even if they have a heaver load rating. The reason being if you go back for warranty or seek damages you can'y deny that you were using them for the WRONG application. That's all the manufacture has to show!!---pieman

[scottanlily]

Any of zeps listed trailers on his avatar there came with 700-15 Lt bias tires.
There were no ST trailer radial then ,thats the right tire if you go by what
airstream originally had on the trailer. So far Im not certain about any tire
really .That tire looks like it got really hot and delaminated as you guys have said ,it certainly looks bad ,those D rated bias tires are 2040 # rated .I
wonder what the trailer weighs loaded .They should be aired up to max pressure and heat probably did kill that tire.All the other tires we have discussed on many threads all seem to have their heat death no matter
what .I don't know ,its really causes some concern ,seems we can't get a
break with tires on our trailers.


Scott

[Alumaholic]

Originally Posted by scottanlily

Any of zeps listed trailers on his avatar there came with 700-15 Lt bias tires.
There were no ST trailer radial then ,thats the right tire if you go by what
airstream originally had on the trailer.

Scott

Scott,
Wouldn't you agree, Airstream only had bias-ply, truck tires on their trailers because that was the best they could get at the time. I surmise that they would have used ST tires if they had been invented! Let's kill the myth that LT tires are somehow better.

[Frank S]

Hi--Been using 7.00-15C LT, the originial size on my 1973 27' Overlander, for 18-years (3-sets, 3 different brands) with no problem. Run them at 45psi, and 65mph on interstates, in all seasons. I can't say that they are better or worse than ST tires, as I have not used ST tires, but I have not experienced any LT tire problems.--Frank S

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by klevan

Let's kill the myth that LT tires are somehow better.

hi ken and others...

i agree completely.

first i'm relieved the inner casing held air and that damage to the trailer was limited...

and that zep, his family or other folks on the road were not hurt...

now...

i agree that the light truck tire mod is so over blown...

st models are the best available product for most travel trailer needs...

and they should be improved with each generation...

touting the improvements is tricky....
because the maker doesn't want to trash their last 'best' effort...

the new marathons are advertized to have more uv protect built in, better polymers and so on...

as for light truck tires....

if this that's the only style available for a given application...
well use them but don't forget the rim limits....
up rated tires on lesser rated rims isn't wise...

light truck tires should handle trailering...which is much easier as tires in motion ...

no acceration, no turning, some brakeing force but mostly just rolling and resisting lateral forces...

but pieman is right...trailering could be used as a reason to deny a claim
really it's not getting one or two replacement tires that matters most...
finding out why...to the extent possible is the goal imo.

it is silly for anyone here to diagnose the problem...tempting as it is.
who here is wise enough to look at a tire picture or 2 and decide what happened? no one

zep, my suggestion is contact a regional/national firestone rep and get the tires to firestone or some other agency that can do a proper autopsy....then hound 'em for details...i'm sure they have forensic tire experts...didn't i see 'em on CSI ?

given how new and how few miles...

just how much heat would it take....
no one following these tire threads can even tell us the 'critical temp'...

so we all just follow the 'hotter than the others' song....i want a better answer...

zep...glad you appear unharmed...thanks for the pix..now insist on a cause of failure investigation...

cheers
2air'

[Darrell Root]

If it was an ST tire it probably would have been a side wall blow out. Sorry about your bad luck. Darrell

[scottanlily]

klevan ,I would say that today the trailer would have radials on it ,yes .
back then the LT bias was the best choice ,heavy duty ,had 8 real plys and
worked really well . I wouldn't necessarily say that the bias are better ,thats the first post I have seen or read about a bias tire coming apart that way .
I ran hercules Bias truck tires on my older service truck ,a 1 1/2 ton chevy stepvan for over ten years and the only problems were an inner tube getting a nail ,never a blow out or the tread coming off like that tire .they might
have been old stock ,not new or recently produced ,would like to know more
about them.

Scott