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Old 06-14-2012, 03:50 PM   #21
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Don't forget the shock absorbers - they axles could be good, but the shocks may have bled out their fluid by now. You' could probably get away with new shocks now, axles later.

Why would anyone let a brand new Airstream sit for 10 years.

Denial or grief.

Know a woman who won't sell "Henry's Airstream". Henry had a stroke 15 years ago and she's been waiting for his recovery so they can go back out camping.

She's just emotionally stuck while her Airstream is slowly decaying.


Paula
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Old 06-14-2012, 04:52 PM   #22
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Shouldn't the upper arms of the Zip Dee awning hook on to the roller bar? In all the other Zip Dees I've seen, the upper bar runs along the side of the awning fabric when the awning is up.

http://cdn.airforums.com/forums/atta...1&d=1339510506

I don't know if the picture will show up, but I thought I'd give it a try.
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Old 06-14-2012, 06:41 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wahoonc View Post
Then you are either over gross or your plate is wrong.

I have been towing things on a personal and professional basis for many years. If a vehicle has a GVWR that is supposed to be a not to exceed rating, and DMV enforcement will be happy to write you plenty of expensive reminders.

The only thing that your swindle sheets tell me is that you have a certain weight on the axles. If your GVWR is 7300# you are over your GVW, pure and simple.

Aaron
Aaron

No kidding...so what exactly are you saying?

That the axle rating's are fine?

It's ok for AS to equip a trailer with 7000lbs worth of axles and give it a 7300lb rating.

What the devil is a swindle sheet?

The yellow one that AS gave me, or the one from the CAT.

Gee..... I'm so dum, glad your not, sorry.

Bob
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Old 06-14-2012, 08:09 PM   #24
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Aaron

No kidding...so what exactly are you saying?

That the axle rating's are fine?

It's ok for AS to equip a trailer with 7000lbs worth of axles and give it a 7300lb rating.

What the devil is a swindle sheet?

The yellow one that AS gave me, or the one from the CAT.

Gee..... I'm so dum, glad your not, sorry.

Bob
What is the gross weight rating of the Airstream in question according to the sticker/tag?

Swindle sheet is a log book/weight ticket, back in the day truckers would "create" them in an attempt to get one over on the DMV officers.

My Airstream (1975 Sovereign) has a GVWR of 7200#, it weighs 5600# or so unloaded. I am pretty sure it has 3500# axles under it.



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Old 06-14-2012, 08:15 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by wahoonc View Post
What is the gross weight rating of the Airstream in question according to the sticker/tag?

Swindle sheet is a log book/weight ticket, back in the day truckers would "create" them in an attempt to get one over on the DMV officers.

My Airstream (1975 Sovereign) has a GVWR of 7200#, it weighs 5600# or so unloaded. I am pretty sure it has 3500# axles under it.



Aaron

Aaron,

Post #14

Bob
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Old 06-14-2012, 08:36 PM   #26
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Aaron,

Post #14

Bob
Then in that case yes the 3500# axles are fine, the 676# of CCC is a bit weak, but that is what AS was doing at that point. Just adding heavier axles may or may not up the load capacity. You have to take into consideration the frame, A-frame, coupler, etc. FWIW my AS has an empty weight almost a 1,000# lighter.

Shame on AS for over loading their trailers without beefing up the necessary components...but not everybody tows with the water tanks full all the time.

In the owner's manual for my 1975 they list all the options and weights as well as if they add or subtract to the tongue weight or the axle weights. Shades of weight and balance like in an aircraft.

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Old 06-14-2012, 08:51 PM   #27
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I'm trying to make sense of Bob and Aaron's dispute. I think Aaron says the tongue weight or part of it can be subtracted from the GVWR. Bob says no. And DOT, he says, agrees with him.

If this is where you guys are, what authority says tongue weight, or part of it (that part shifted to the tow vehicle axles) can be subtracted from the GVWR? I think Bob may be right because I've never seen anything indicating you can subtract tongue wt., but maybe not.

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Old 06-14-2012, 09:03 PM   #28
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Unhappy My Goodness!

I don't believe I have ever seen such a nice looking trailer picked apart to this extent before. How may of you all are planning to sneak in and buy it after you totally discourage him from doing it.

To address the original concern, the axles look fine from the photo.

Ken
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Old 06-14-2012, 09:11 PM   #29
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I'm trying to make sense of Bob and Aaron's dispute. I think Aaron says the tongue weight or part of it can be subtracted from the GVWR. Bob says no. And DOT, he says, agrees with him.

If this is where you guys are, what authority says tongue weight, or part of it (that part shifted to the tow vehicle axles) can be subtracted from the GVWR? I think Bob may be right because I've never seen anything indicating you can subtract tongue wt., but maybe not.

Gene
No, tongue weight is included in the GVWr. But the entire GVW does not ride totally on the axles, so the axles are in spec for a 7300# GVW.

The axles are rated for 3500# each, total GVW is SUPPORTED on the axles AND the tongue. IF a trailer has a GVW of 7300# all 7300# IS NOT supported on the axles. In the case of the weight tickets that were shown the trailer EXCEEDS the GVW there, it is is being towed illegally. Yes a WDH will throw some weight back on the trailer axles.

If you use the basic math of a GVW of 7300# minus a 12% tongue weight of 876# you should have 6424# on the axles, well within the 3500# per axle rating. If you have more than 7300# on the axles you will have something on the tongue too, making the trailer overweight.

FWIW I weigh my trailer using race car scales I can get side to side weights as well as front to back and tongue.

When DMV weighs a vehicle they weigh the axles, trailer weight on the axles, the tongue weight typically will go against the tow vehicle axle weight.

FWIW I have had a truck ticketed where it was under the GCVWR, trailer axle weight was fine, but the weight on the rear axle of the truck was over the limit, due to excessive tongue weight on the trailer as well as a load in the truck bed. By shifting load the rig was made legal. No WDH in that particular case.

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Old 06-15-2012, 05:01 AM   #30
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Aaron you can play with the numbers on a computer screen all you want.
All I know, in the real world those axles are rong. A CCC of 676Lbs on a 25' trailer is rong.
Airstream realized that fact and finally made it rite.......nananananana.

PS....it was fun, Thanx.

Stream Safe

Bob
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Old 06-15-2012, 06:25 AM   #31
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I think Arron is correct on this issue. On the 3 Airstream trailers I have owned (changed axles on 2 of them) the axle rating was between 88% and 95% of the GVWR of the trailer.
I did a quick search and found a link to the trailer manufacturers website FAQ section.
About 3/4 of the way down the page there is a section on GVWR. Here is a quote:
GVW is the “Gross Vehicle Weight”, which is the actual weight of the vehicle. GVWR is the “Gross Vehicle Weight Rating”, and is the maximum allowable weight for the vehicle, which includes the weight of the trailer and the weight of the anticipated cargo. The axles must be able to support the GVWR, less the amount of weight carried by the tow vehicle (the “tongue weight” or the “hitch load”). This means that the GAWR (Gross Axle Weight Rating) may be less than the GVWR. It is generally accepted that this difference may be as high as 15% of the GVWR for bumper pull trailers, and 25% for gooseneck and 5th wheel trailers, although a more conservative approach would have them equal (since you don’t know how the consumer will load the trailer).

Trailer Manufacturers Association - Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ's) - Answered by Dick Klein
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Old 06-15-2012, 07:52 AM   #32
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Aaron you can play with the numbers on a computer screen all you want.
All I know, in the real world those axles are rong. A CCC of 676Lbs on a 25' trailer is rong.
Airstream realized that fact and finally made it rite.......nananananana.

PS....it was fun, Thanx.

Stream Safe

Bob
Hopefully they provided you with an updated GVW plate? DMV enforcement doesn't care what paperwork you have, they will be looking for the manufacturer's plate. However the odds of them looking at RV's in my state is rare unless and accident is involved.

Aaron
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Old 06-15-2012, 05:38 PM   #33
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My axles are rated at 3,800 #, GVWR is 7,300.

So, mine can carry an anvil collection.

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Old 06-15-2012, 06:01 PM   #34
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Have you considered a trailer inspector? Many forums members will do it for just a "thank you". You might even find a professional shop to do it for free for Forums member...
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Old 06-15-2012, 06:02 PM   #35
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My axles are rated at 3,800 #, GVWR is 7,300.

So, mine can carry an anvil collection.

Gene
What a cool hobby, collecting anvils.
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Old 06-15-2012, 06:27 PM   #36
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Saw a special on a guy on TV that collected old tanks. Yes, the armoured type complete with a cannon on the front, not the black or grey ones.
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Old 06-15-2012, 06:37 PM   #37
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Saw a special on a guy on TV that collected old tanks. Yes, the armoured type complete with a cannon on the front, not the black or grey ones.
And they make great tow vehicles too.

Gene
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Old 06-15-2012, 08:40 PM   #38
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dont know about collecting anvils but try a utube search for shooting anvils- now thats some fun!
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Old 06-16-2012, 06:38 PM   #39
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Well, my topic sure went places I hadn't expected (anvil collections!), But I've learned a lot too : )

I won't give the whole story as to why I believe the trailer in question has never been moved or slept in, but in this case I think the story is true. As for someone sneaking in and scooping it...why do you think I Photoshopped the phone numbers from the For Sale signs?

I appreciate the discussion of axles and GVW/GVWR, etc.

I also appreciate the pointer that the awning may be improperly deployed in the photo - neither/ I nor the owner really knew how to operate it - there was also 10 years of crud in the tubes so we decided to stay with what we had until the tubes and supports could be disassembled and lubed.

I'm building a list of things I want to repair/upgrade (my wife hates the upholstery!) and will make an offer based on the that list.

I'll let you know how it turns out.

Chuck
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Old 06-16-2012, 07:57 PM   #40
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Well, my topic sure went places I hadn't expected (anvil collections!), But I've learned a lot too : )
Threads do wander.

When you become a rivet master (500 posts), they you get your commemorative anvil to start your collection. it is spray painted aluminum color. Everybody has a collection. If it gets a little heavy, start throwing out furniture and appliances.

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