Mileage for gas trucks vs diesel trucks?

[mrchinup1]

I have a 2007 silverado with a 5.3l. I was thinking of getting a dodge ram megacab with a diesel 2 wheel drive, 3.73 gears. It is a 2007 with a 5.9 l, i was wondering what kind of mileage i would get when towing and without towing? The price is great, for a brand new slt, it's 28.700, I wonder if i could get better than 11.8 average miles per gallon towing that i get with the silverado. Thanks for the help.

[safari 28]

Well all I can say is trading a 07 in for an 07 is going to be painful indeed. Your only towing a 23, do you plan to go to classic series in the 30 plus range? Its your money, but unless you can really justify the loss on your Silverado, or if you are like me in a lease and can get out by selling for the payoff, then be patient my friend. You may want to follow the thread on diesel cost/gallon these days. In my opinion you need another reason for such a huge increase in tow capacity, saving money on mileage is going to be tough to justify.

[Rebee]

The cost of changing may not be the best finacial move. You have a 23 ft trailer and the V8 gas can do an adaquate job of moving it.
I have a 2007 dodge w/6.7 and pull a 30 ft classic, 8000 lbs dry. I adverage 11 to 12 MPG in stop and go and open road combined, 19 to 20 not towing.
You will get better mpg towing because of the muscle of the diesel but check the price of diesel vs gas.
If you plan to get a larger trailer 28 ft +, the diesel may be good.


dale

[mrchinup1]

I paid 30k for the silverado, it is one year old, my wife totalled our honda accord last Feb and i had to get something to replace it. So at the time there were no rebates, i will only get 16k for the trade that is black book. But it has 27k for miles and needs brakes and tires already, i tow quite a bit and will be going cross country april 15th or so. I know i'll take a beating but it is a great price on the dodge. Most likely we will get a bigger AS to spend winters in FL, nothing is set in stone though.

Rebee, could you tell me what mileage you get while towing? Thanks

By the end of this trip i will have close to 50k miles and it will be worth that much less, i mostly only use it for towing. So i'm figuring i will just get 5 years out of it if i'm lucky, diesels do last much longer. For the extra 13 i'd have a much beter towing machine. It's also a 2500 and my silverado is a 1500.

[2airishuman]

'chinup....

IF you travel a LOT a diesel rig is nice. i sure like mine.

IF planning to go larger with the 'stream eventually, you will be ready too.

there are several MILEAGE, mpg and 'fuel savings' threads here, try reading some of them.

there are also threads on the 'cost' issue of diesel vs petrol. lots of variables like resale value and maintenance are vaguely included.

i like the torque and i love the smell of diesel in the mornings!

exceptional mpg reports are as accurate as big fish stores and smell similar too...

there are so many variables, but frontal air resistance is the most direct factor as SPEED climbs.

so how slow are u willing to drive?

because going SLOWER is how the most significant mpg gains can be realized.

your trailer will be very little work for the cummins sludge burner but fast still kills fuel economy.

WIND is also important, moreso than inclines, because uphill is eventually offset by down...

my powerstroke mpg pulling a 34 at 70 mph varies 2-4 mpg as winds change from heads to tails...

10-13 mpg is typical, and a tad more IF you go 60 mph...

i almost never go that slow and judging from this thread most diesel drivers here don't either...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...lly-36727.html

cheers
2air'

[Glenn G]

I've posted this same info on another thread before.
My rig is very clost to the same as yours. 2001 GMC 5.3 pulling a 2006 23' Safari SE.
At 65 it gets shy of 12 MPG. At 55 (and driving for fuel economy) just under 15 was best. but more normal about 13 or 13 plus. This is as large of a trailor as i'd want with this truck. It handles great and capacity of truck and tow vehicle is 83%. Just right in my opinion. No payments on the truck and easy tow with fair GPM and cheaper than deisel oil, I think not to bad but would love to do better anyway. Im thinking of putting an aluminum boat on top of the shell on the PU. That would take the 18" or so of flat area below the curvature of the AS and break the wind. I'm intrested in hearing if anyone thinks that might help or if the 100 lbs. of so extra weight would be a wash.

[HiHoAgRV]

yeah, what he said, plus one more thing. Right now Diesel is is +$.47 more than regular so it's a penality to run one ($94 to fill up my Ram this afternoon ) It takes a 15% increase in fuel economy over a gasser just to wipe out the price difference!

[Rebee]

The 11 to 12 mpg is what I get towing the Classic. You will do much better with the 23 ft. I try to stay around 60 mph but I drift to 65+ because the cummings is so capable.

dale

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by Glenn G

... Im thinking of putting an aluminum boat on top of the shell on the PU. That would take the 18" or so of flat area below the curvature of the AS and break the wind. I'm intrested in hearing if anyone thinks that might help or if the 100 lbs. of so extra weight would be a wash.

hi glenn

i think u will only know what the boat does after it is UP there....

while the boat does change the frontal profile slightly, it also adds drag from surface area.

i'm certain that adding a camper shell lowered mpg on my truck...

so did BIG mud flaps.

we could do things to improve the aero/fuel economy side of these big trucks,

like lower them, change front facia/bumpers, cover the wheels and underside, change tires, ditch the 4x4, change gearing and so on...

but i'm not sure any of of those trick would help TOWING mpg...

cheers
2air'

[BillTex]

I just posted this on another (3/4 ton) thread. I don't think you NEED diesel for a 23, but would agree that is max for a 1/2 ton.
Glen, my towing data includes multiple water toys on top of the truck FYI; porta-bote and 1 or 2 kayaks, as well as bikes, ob motor, and ? in the bed. So I am not very aerodynamic when towing (to say the least)...

These are based on 1/2 ton 5.3l Suburban (3:73) and the D/A CC.


Unloaded Highway
A tank of diesel, on the high way gets me about 400 miles @ $3.70/gal= $96.20/tank or $96.20/400 miles.

A tank of gas with the Suburban, on the high way got me about 400 miles @ $3.00/gal= $105.00/tank or $105.00/400 miles.

Unloaded In-town
A tank of diesel, in-town gets me about 315 miles @ $3.70/gal= $96.20/tank or $96.20/315 miles.

A tank of gas with the Suburban, in-town got me about 315 miles @ $3.00/gal= $105.00/tank or $105.00/315 miles.

Towing
A tank of diesel, towing gets me about 315 miles (26 gals) @= $96.20/tank or $96.20/315 miles.

A tank of gas with the Suburban, towing got me about 250 miles @ $3.00/gal= $105.00/tank or $105.00/250 miles.

Disclaimers;
I never run the tank to “empty” so neither case represents a “full” tank of fuel (26 gals for the diesel truck, 35 gals for the ½ ton Suburban. i.e. Don’t confuse this analysis with mpg). A “tank is being defined as the point where I typically stop to fill up, I always tank up when I get under ¼. The mileage figures per tank ARE accurate. I am totally anal about setting the odo and re-fueling based on those miles.

Even at the high cost of diesel today (I am sure it is related to heating season and will come down soon) I am still ahead of the fuel cost/mile game driving the diesel, only slightly in day to day driving (8%) , but dramatically (43%) when towing.. I am not saying one is better than the other, but these are real costs, based on my experience for anyone considering a new TV today and concerned about real world fuel costs.


And there is no question which one I would rather tow with.



Bill

[Glenn G]

2air & Bill,

I have the shell so that's part of the calcs.. Thanks for the feedback.

Glenn

[Foiled Again]

Around Thanksgiving I bought a 2008 Silverado 2500 (3/4 ton) - quad cab, long bed and made an initial tow to the Can Opener. I drove 65-75 mph most of the way and got almost 14 mpg towing! Driving highway not towing and keeping it at 55 mpg my mileage has been improving as the engine gets more broken in. Last week not towing I got 18.4 mpg!

My previous vehicle was a 2003 Suburban 3/4 ton, and it got 13 mpg tops. Towing was between 10 and 12 mpg.

I'm impressed.

Paula

[Motoman]

Here is a previous post on our 2005 Dodge with the 5.9l Cummins, mileage with and without a low shell on the back.


We can weigh in on this issue. We have a 2005 Dodge Ram 2500 with the Cummings diesel. In fairness I can't tell the difference in fuel mileage. Towing on level freeway at 55 to 65 and under good conditions we typically average 13.5 to 14.5. Head winds and quarter winds, speed, weather and terrain can cause towing mileage to vary between 10 mpg to an ocasional 17 mpg both with and without the shell. However I pulled out the five trips we did in two subsequent 12 month periods.

We pulled our first Airstream, a 22' CCD and then a 25' CCD for about 11,000 miles in 2005 before we got our cab high LEER shell. Five trips in that time period were:
772 miles, 13.2 mpg (22')
6765 miles, 13.3 mpg (traded 22' for 25' on trip)
1800 miles, 13.9 mpg (25')
622 miles, 12.6 mpg (25')
1037 miles, 13.0 mpg (25'); average for the five trips 13.3.

Once we got our shell we again towed our 25' CCD about 11,000 miles in 2006:
6626 miles; 12.4 mpg
650 miles; 12.9 mpg
2126 miles; 14.9 mpg
806 miles; 13.3 mpg
795 miles; 14.2 mpg; 13.1 mpg average for these five trips.

It looks too close to call for me and no significant difference with the upgrade from the 22' to the 25' CCD. However, the shell does give us more security for our bikes, generator, chairs and other belongings in the back of the pickup.

Regarding non-towing mileage, 13 to 14 in town; 18 to 20 on the road, freeways and the rural southwest. And for information, our factory trip computer is optimistic, reporting 1 to 2 mpg higher than the real math (miles divided by gallons). My numbers reported above are actual mileae, not the trip computer.

[mrchinup1]

Don, do you have a 2 wheel drive or 4 wheel drive? Do you have 3.73 or 4.10? I would expect that the megacab would get the same mileage as you posted. Right now i do 95% of the driving, i think with a bigger truck i would feel safer when i ask my wife to drive. (kinda) lol With such a long trip coming up, i'll be dead tired without a break. Thanks George

[Goin camping]

Seems you could take the hit on tires, brakes and maintenance or go ahead and get the new truck you want.

Since you do a lot of miles and hope to upgrade in a year or two. I'd go get the Dodge. Sure you'll take an initial hit but towing with an oil burner sure is nice. Hills don't matter. More miles between fill ups and I think you can add an engine brake on Dodges so you're brakes will last longer and going down long steep grades will lose it's excitement.

Get what you want and you'll be happy longer.,

[Cracker]

Originally Posted by mrchinup1

I paid 30k for the silverado, it is one year old, my wife totalled our honda accord last Feb and i had to get something to replace it. So at the time there were no rebates, i will only get 16k for the trade that is black book. But it has 27k for miles and needs brakes and tires already, i tow quite a bit and will be going cross country april 15th or so. I know i'll take a beating but it is a great price on the dodge. Most likely we will get a bigger AS to spend winters in FL, nothing is set in stone though.

Rebee, could you tell me what mileage you get while towing? Thanks

By the end of this trip i will have close to 50k miles and it will be worth that much less, i mostly only use it for towing. So i'm figuring i will just get 5 years out of it if i'm lucky, diesels do last much longer. For the extra 13 i'd have a much beter towing machine. It's also a 2500 and my silverado is a 1500.

I'm just curious how you could need brakes at 27K? I've got a '95 Chevy Silverado with 150,000 miles on it and I'm still on the original rear brakes - having replaced the front discs once at about 85,000 miles! I don't use it for towing. My '03 GMC dually has over 50,000 miles on it with no readily noticeable signs of brake wear - and, for the record, the original set of dual tires. I will admit that I'm on my third set of front tires - but that's due to a weird wear pattern characteristic of the dually. The last set of front tires I put on will probably last over 100,000 miles. The dually tows about 50% of the time.

[slowmover]

My six-speed 2WD Quadcab longbed averages:

Solo
17-19 in-town
22+ highway (66-68 mph)

Towing (62-63 mph)
13 towing back roads
15+ on Interstates

(I've never run a full day on the Interstate for fuel mileage without going through major citiies (Dallas, Austin, San Antonio), but I imagine I'd hit 16 on a full day of cruise control.

I haven't seen better than this on a 30+ foot trailer, conventional or fifth wheel though I have seen as high as 18 on a small rig.

A Silver Streak trailer has more frontal area than an Airstream that is "squared".

My truck has a bed topper (truck roof height), and the Hensley Hitch puts the trailer waay back there. The "gap" between truck and trailer is right at five feet. (The rig is a bit over sixty-two feet). That "gap" represents at least one mpg I'm betting.

I always drive for economy, rarely get above 2,100 rpm (maybe three/four times in a typical 900-mile month around town).

I shift progressively (1600 on the one/two, 1700 on the two/three and use 1800 for fourth & fifth, then 1900 when I drop it into OD), downshift through fourth, sometimes third (always trying to keep from stopping, the BIG penalty on city mpg in a four-ton pickup) and only use the throttle to move between the gears as I consider the trans my speed apportioner.

In town, on the highway or anywhere else I keep the engine in the 1600-1900 rpm range exclusively.

The price differential -- on fuel only ($3.60 D vs. $3.00 G) -- means I easily beat my 2001 1/2T Dodge in fuel economy savngs; nearly $90 month at 1,000 miles.

The 2003/2004 CTD is generally regarded as having the best mpg of post 2002 CTD's.

My only change from stock is an Amsoil Eaa air filter, a Rokktech muffler with Aeroturbine resonator. All else is stock.

[mrchinup1]

Originally Posted by Cracker

I'm just curious how you could need brakes at 27K? I've got a '95 Chevy Silverado with 150,000 miles on it and I'm still on the original rear brakes - having replaced the front discs once at about 85,000 miles! I don't use it for towing. My '03 GMC dually has over 50,000 miles on it with no readily noticeable signs of brake wear - and, for the record, the original set of dual tires. I will admit that I'm on my third set of front tires - but that's due to a weird wear pattern characteristic of the dually. The last set of front tires I put on will probably last over 100,000 miles. The dually tows about 50% of the time.

The drum brakes in the back are probably alright, but the front discs need to be done before we go on the trip out west. The brake disc has groves in it, probably some piece of junk made in china. The guy who will do the work told me that the replacements would be better. Also on the 1500 model they use cheap general tires, three flats so far and they don't wear well. I also have a 98 dodge ram 130k miles, it doesn't have the power, but i have only changed the brakes once. I have only had the front end aligned once, the chevy front end is already out of whack. The dodge took much more of a beating and still runs great. On the new 1500 model, i think GM uses cheap break parts and cheap tires. JMO

[gaylejoe]

We have a 2005 Dodge 5.9 Cummings, short wheelbase, 2WD, with camper shell. On the highway, not towing we get 20-23 mpg, in town not towing 17-19 mpg, towing we will average 15-16 mpg. We traveled 13,000 miles last year with the trailer and kept very accurate records. We have friends with 3/4 ton gasoline trucks and our diesel milage is better than theirs. After having towed with a diesel it would be very difficult for me to go back to a gasoline truck.

[Andrew T]

A couple of thoughts for you.

If you change your tires on the Suburban to 245/70R x 17" Load Range "D" Light Truck tires you should pick up 1 mile per gallon both towing and solo. As well handling and performance will both improve.

I would not assume that the 5.3 will have any less durability than a diesel as most gas engines seem to still be running when the rest of the truck has worn out. If your brakes are worn out already you likely have a brake control problem. I have found the brakes on our Diesels do not last as long as the brakes on our gas trucks. This would make sence considering the extra weigth to stop and the lack of engine brakeing.

Another thought is that the current deisel trucks really are somewhat dated and much better engines will be available in soon. In fact the 3.0 Litre in the M class and Jeep Grand Cherokee is available now. If you want better fuel economy that is a better way to go. These are runing in the high teens towing 30-34's and high 20's solo.

Andy