Keep food cold on the road

[Gearheart]

On the ferry from Nova Scotia to Newfoundland, Port aux Basques, it was a ferry requirement that all LPG be turned off while the rigs were in the hold. It was an 8 hour crossing and everything was still cold and frozen when we arrived on Nl.

[Ray Eklund]

Originally Posted by Gearheart

On the ferry from Nova Scotia to Newfoundland, Port aux Basques, it was a ferry requirement that all LPG be turned off while the rigs were in the hold. It was an 8 hour crossing and everything was still cold and frozen when we arrived on Nl.

******

OK... Gearheart understands there are situations that Safety in different situations IS important. This is one in the cargo hold of a ship. Also says a lot about the insulation of the refrigerator.

Here is the test for Everyone following this Thread.

Next time you have access to your trailer, open the lid of your propane tank and turn the propane values to Open/On.

The Regulator will click to Green. Do both sides. Green and Green, FROM Red and Red.

Turn the propane knobs / tanks to OFF. The Regulator will indicate GREEN for both tanks.

Come back 1 hour or 24 hours later. Both Propane cylinders are still OFF... but look at the Regulator. RED. Where did the Propane go? The system must have minute leaks somewhere. Maybe try five hours. Experiment. How do I know this?

ALL three of our Airstreams would do this. It is not dangerous with one in a RV Garage... but not all Trailers have tight propane systems and may leak a lot more than our NEW Airstream.

This explains why in a Gearheart's situation... this is IMPORTANT.

[ROBERT CROSS]

...we camped too long with no refrigeration.
Both our AS's came with working reefer's, both running on LP constantly.
Never had a problem with food spoiling or explosions and the beer is always cold.
I try to ignore problems that others fear and don't exist in our reality, you may have a different reality.
TETO

HB...I believe you forgot to tell everyone to turn them back off...no?

Anywho...mine does the same, I believe that is a function of the regulator, I have never had a tank leak because of it.


Bob
🇺🇸

[Wayne&Sam]

Originally Posted by 5150mike

How so you keep your food cold on the road, I do not want to run the refrigerator on LP going down the road. Will the refrigerator once cold keep food all day until next stop? Do you use an ice chest? We are planning a trip to Grand canyon in June from Texas and Wondering the best way, any help would be appreciated Mike

You paid for the refrigerator and it will work just fine. We leave ours on propane while traveling.

On the Alaskan Marine Highway ferries you have to shut them off. Our freezer was full of frozen salmon and it all came through just fine, as did everything in the refrigerator.

[Ray Eklund]

[QUOTE=Len n Jeanne;2339349]If you boondock in more remote desert areas, saving battery power, and conserving waste water tank space are really smart ideas.

We're probably not in Ray's league, but we'd rather be off desert boondocking than most types of RV experiences we could name.
*****

You give me too much credit. We all learned from experience. I received a real big lesson in 14 inch Marathon tires and why Maxxis and Tow Max worked out very well in comparison. The knowledge cost me hundreds of hard earned dollars. Our first trailer.

That is why the Airforum is a wonderful way to communicate with others. We may not always agree with others, but that is OK. Many of us are retired and obviously learned a lot about self preservation.

When in tunnels in Colorado on I-70 when the tunnels are lit... you are asked to turn on headlights any time of the day. Probably 75% compliance.

Your automobile and 18 wheeler exhaust, depending on wind flow through the tunnel, can get your attention. No one asks for you to shut down and coast through... just getting a vague point across to confuse everyone.

Highways out West will have sections to Turn on Headlights during the DAY. Some may wonder why, since the sun is out in Nevada and the road is flat, straight and in perfect condition. About 80% compliance.

WHY? Because you can see on coming traffic better and not pass someone, not seeing a car in the distance. The speed limit is 70 and you have to pass at 80mph or more to clear them. The oncoming vehicle may be going 100mph... both towing some other Brand.

Airstreams can be seen probably from the Moon and safer towing because of that blinding aluminum...you get the idea. I still will keep my refrigerator on propane until I become educated about how this can cause an explosion or fire while fueling.

[Janet H]

I also travel with fridge on propane. BTW there are a bunch of bluetooth remote thermometers available to monitor fridge temp if you're worried about spoilage. This is just one example: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07PSK7DK9

[skyguyscott]

Yes, you can run the LP fridge while in transit safely as long as you use common sense.

On the other hand, if you can freeze the food beforehand and use the fridge as an ice-box enroute and keep the temp in the safe zone without using any propane, that's great!

Likewise if you use some quality coolers. Purchasing cold foods near your destination is also good.

There are numerous ways to accomplish keeping your food cool so it stays safe.

Obviously, if you turn off the fridge before entering the fuel station, you eliminate any possibility of a spark starting a fire or other unfortunate event. My old 69 Dometic requires manual lighting of a pilot light, so there is no sparker. Most of my long haul trips, I either purchase near final destination, or I have successfully kept the fridge cool with frozen contents enroute without wasting propane, but that's me being cheap frugal, more than concerned about the propane.

[KandM-Travel]

Originally Posted by Justinfinity

... a dedicated high current umbilical from the tow vehicle alternators to the trailer batteries. This latter charge source delivers close to 100A of charge current to the trailer while driving (or even stationary) compared to the 5-7A trickle that comes through the auxiliary power on the 7-way connector. .

Justinfinity, we are also new to Airstream (so new, we haven't yet purchased the trailer or truck -- looking to sell our small motorhome that pulls our small SUV).

Currently researching how to overcome the lack of "native" DC power to run the 2-way refrigerator in our future Flying Cloud 28 (the motorhome has a 3-way fridge with 12V DC power the norm on the road).

Saw elsewhere reference to the trickle charge through the 7-way connector, but wondered if that could be supplemented in some other way from the tow vehicle.

Please share the details on how you did this with the "dedicated high current umbilical" ... wiring, charge controller, inverter, etc.

(We will also have 180W (2x90W) factory-installed solar panels, and will likely have the dealer install another 180W -- but will have only the 2 stock AGM batteries.)

Thanks much!

[Len n Jeanne]

The B.C. ferries also require propane to be turned off during passage. Sometimes the car parking is on the upper deck, so it's not just a concern about lower decks.. In 2007, a propane tank exploded on the Kootenay Lake ferry. In all fairness, it wasn't running anybody's fridge, but was leaking in the back of a trailer.

[aftermath]

Originally Posted by Len n Jeanne

If you boondock in more remote desert areas, saving battery power, and conserving waste water tank space are really smart ideas.

I don't get not filling and using fresh water from the tank, however.

But we always desert-camp with surplus water in jerry cans. This extends our stay in a remote area without surface water, where it's also smart to have an emergency back-up.

I don't know if you've ever been camping with a faulty diagnostic only to find that your waste water tank was overflowing. We have twice, and it was a horrible experience. Better to use facilities if available, as they are in primitive BLM campgrounds, to extend your blackwater tank life.

I get that some people want more urban, resort-style RV parks next to the golf course.

We're probably not in Ray's league, but we'd rather be off desert boondocking than most types of RV experiences we could name.

Hope to see you in the Back of Beyond soon!

Len and Jeanne, I agree with all that you said here. I also respect your choice not to run your fridge while on the road. You have found a workable system to be able to do this safely and that is important. I have boondocked many times and agree with all of your assertions. I always fill the FW tank when boondocking and pack extra water too. I bring extra electricity in the form of my generator. I can't bring extra space for the black tank so we have to be wary. I used to have to pack everything in ice boxes. For a long stay it was quite the challenge. I use my fridge now and it sure is nice. I think my back appreciates it too!

[Len n Jeanne]

Hey, thanks.

[Justinfinity]

After much research, we worked with the folks at AM Solar and, among other things, installed the Alternator kit.

We ran 2/0 welding cable inside wire loom split tubing from the battery posts in the tow vehicle engine bay, along the frame to the rear bumper, terminating in an Anderson 350 connector fastened to the tow hitch bar.

We placed a fuse block between the positive post of the truck battery and the positive cable, like this: https://www.bluesea.com/products/519...k_-_30_to_300A

Then the cable went to to a 200A relay battery isolator, activated by one of the upfitter switches in our 2019 Ford F250. The relay: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

On the trailer side, we made a mated Anderson 350 connector and 2/0 cable that runs along the trailer frame and plugs into the tow vehicle. The cable on the trailer side is connected to one side of the Victron Cyrix Li-Ct device.

https://www.victronenergy.com/batter...tery-combiners

The other side connects through a breaker to the positive bus bar to the lithium battery bank in the trailer. We had to drill through the underside of the front compartment to route the cable up into the area where our electrical upgrade project board lives. For good measure, and even though the 2/0 cable is in the wire loom AND cable tied, I wrapped the whole loomed cable on the trailer side with self-amalgamating tape.

The Victron Cyrix device prevents current from flowing in the "wrong" direction from the trailer to the tow vehicle. However, there is a momentary switch that, when pressed, allows the trailer batteries to be used to start the tow vehicle if, for example, the tow vehicle battery had failed.

It took a couple of tries to figure out how to route the dedicated alternator charging cable so that it didn't interact with the 7-way connector but we eventually figured out a way for them to coexist.

On average, I get about 70A of charge current from the truck to the trailer, which means that my 400A lithium bank is 100% after just 2-3 hours of driving, assuming a 50% discharge. With conventional lead acid or AGM batteries, the declining charge acceptance rate inherent to those chemistries will mean a longer charge time, regardless of the charge source and potential current. With Lithium batteries that have a good BMS, you'll get full charge potential without putting your alternator in danger. However, if you get Lithium batteries that don't have a good BMS (or no BMS), then you'll need a way (such as a DC-DC charger) to manage the current they demand from the alternator, otherwise it will be damaged.

Battleborn is a very popular Lithium battery, but I don't like the Li-BIM current management solution they devised in conjunction with a third party (Precision Circuits) to manage the alternator. So, I went with LifeBlue.

[BigSxyWhtGuy]

8 pages of responses, I don’t think OP has come back or responded yet...... I may be wrong

[Milo1952]

Originally Posted by 5150mike

How so you keep your food cold on the road, I do not want to run the refrigerator on LP going down the road. Will the refrigerator once cold keep food all day until next stop? Do you use an ice chest? We are planning a trip to Grand canyon in June from Texas and Wondering the best way, any help would be appreciated Mike

Yep, his first and only post.

[smithcreek]

Originally Posted by BigSxyWhtGuy

8 pages of responses, I don’t think OP has come back or responded yet...... I may be wrong

Probably because after stating he did not want to use propane and asked if an ice chest would work, which might cost $100 or so, half the responses were "use propane" and the other half were "install a $10K solar/Lithium battery electric system".

[skyguyscott]

Originally Posted by HRTKD

I've gone 8 days boondocking without replenishing resources or draining tanks. That was with three guys during hunting season.

Of course! Try that with women and children and see how long your consumables last.

[Ray Eklund]

Quemado, New Mexico. Fall Elk Season.

Five or so pickup trucks together. One pulling a full sized electric chest freezer on a flat bed. Into the chest freezer went cases of beer and maybe fifty bags of ICE.

Of course they were not hooked to a generator in the Gila National Forest while Elk Hunting. I am sure that the noise would be great for hunting...

Hunters are a bad example of what to do for refrigeration. When we went hunting... we had dry goods. We were not dining on steak and lobster and had a paid chef in tow. Fresh water was great. Hot beer or soda...

The small ice chest was for some canned soft drinks and ice. A BLOCK of ice that you chip away with an ice pick. It lasts a long time.

Before our Airstream... we did not have hot dogs and bologna in the ice chest. We had canned Tuna... sour dough bread, peanut butter/jelly, chips, candy bars, canned vegetables, apples, good stuff... in a cardboard box.

We still do not carry hot dogs or bologna... pure gut bomb food.

What kind of Outdoor experiences do people prepare for today? You listen to this stuff and no wonder an Airstream has a larger refrigerator than some apartment dwellers. RV buses... insanity.

If you have below average IQ like myself, BUT a high Common Sense mental experiences... go with the Common Sense. You can survive with Common Sense. Some of this advice is for the same morons lined up buying toilet paper and bottled water... and for what?

Those poor Oregon Trail travelers in the mid 19th Century... without a propane refer... they must have all died in less than a week traveling.

[HRTKD]

Ray, our hunting menu isn't quite steak and lobster, but we eat good. I'm the quartermaster for our group. I buy supplies based on the amount of refrigerator space available. Frozen items work well as they last longer than non-frozen.

[Ray Eklund]

Hunting Season.

Not in June, July or August when it is hot.

Hmmm. Why use a wood burning stove in a large tent to keep warm? Because in Hunting Season for large game occurs during the COLD months. When hunters talk about freezing their Arses... you need no refer running.

I never hunted with a paid group and guide. We hunted not for antlers, head mounts or a stuffed Moose for the living room. We hunted for the protein to eat. It was less expensive than Beef and lean. Today... hunting is a photo op.

Although I remember my Grandfather's hunting photos with five guys, rifles in their lap, outside a cabin with ten bucks hanging. This was for food.

If we wanted something frozen... leave it in the back of a pickup. Everything FROZE.

If it is hunting in Miami... maybe a freezer or dry ice.

Out west, Colorado included... we never needed ICE, Dry Ice or a refrigerator. We have been fortunate that hunting is no longer necessary for our low standard of living. Today's hunters... I understand. It is now a business. I no longer hunt, although am prepared to hunt anything, if needed.

Ice purchased in October to February in the Rockies... are you NUTS?

We would get all the ICE WE NEEDED out of the Flathead lake from the moment it froze over to Spring for free... as we had no refrigerator. ...lived through it all. Gave me that western attitude when watching City Slickers dressed up like Dudes at a local Bar and then call it hunting the next morning to sober up.

[HRTKD]

When I hunt in archery season it rarely gets below freezing. A couple years back we did third rifle and got dumped on. After four days we had to move off the mountain as we weren't sure the trailers would come out until spring if we didn't move ASAP. This was at 9000' in northern Colorado where a brisk hike would get you across the border into Wyoming.