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01-03-2016, 08:33 AM
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#1
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1 Rivet Member
1971 31' Sovereign
Fribourg
, Fribourg
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 10
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buck rivets vs olympic rivets
Hi Airstream Lovers,
I am starting a full renovation of a 1971 31' sovereign
i need to replace all the left side lower panel ( about 35x200 inches)
would be olympic rivets strong enough for that kind of work or should i use
buck rivet like the original construction.
thanks for your help!
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01-03-2016, 09:02 AM
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#2
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Rivet Master
1986 31' Sovereign
Miami
, Florida
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,137
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If you can use buck rivets, go ahead. A little stronger, lots easier and look like they are supposed to without shaving.
Olympics will certainly work fine (we used a lot of them on aging airframes) but are expensive and require shaving to look like original fasteners. Many assert that they are prone to leakage but I have never seen that problem.
Mike
__________________
Sorta new (usually dirty) Nissan Titan XD (hardly paid for)
Middle-aged Safari SE
Young, lovely bride
Dismissive cat
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01-03-2016, 10:54 AM
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#3
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Rivet Master
1964 22' Safari
modesto
, California
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,097
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If as you say, you are doing a renovation, and the interior skin is removed. I would buck rivet the panel. No reason to use olympics.
When bucking or using olympics use plenty of your favorite urethane sealant, e.g., Trempro, Vulkem, Sikaflex. On the edges of the panel and the rivets. You will not have any leaks.
Here is something you may find useful for your renovation. Probably the most comprehensive thread about sealants on the forum. http://www.airforums.com/forums/f44/...ry-116214.html
Have fun with your reno.
-Dennis
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01-03-2016, 02:36 PM
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#4
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1 Rivet Member
1971 31' Sovereign
Fribourg
, Fribourg
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 10
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the inner skin has been removed, i'll use buck rivets,
Thanks a lot Mike and Dennis for your help!
cheers!
Lionel
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01-03-2016, 07:45 PM
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#5
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3 Rivet Member
Commercial Member
1967 28' Ambassador
1964 19' Globetrotter
1960 24' Tradewind
Edgewood
, Kentucky
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 209
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Make sure you have plenty of beer iced up for your buddy, you'll need one for buck rivets. When driving them make sure your perpendicular as much as possible to prevent the undesirable smile left on the head. It takes practice to get flow going efficiently. It is not about how hard you push either, let the tool do the work, if your tool is jumping off of the head of the rivet try turning the air pressure down to a manageable setting.
__________________
Artisan Airstreams
Custom restorations and renovations
www.artisanairstreams.com
Keeping the Art on the road, one project at a time
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03-10-2016, 08:53 PM
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#6
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2 Rivet Member
1975 Argosy 28
1975 Argosy 22
1978 Argosy Minuet 6.0 Metre
Camrose
, Alberta
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 74
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The olympic rivets have no shear strength. That panel is structural so buck rivets are a must. Olympic rivets are only for patches and small repairs with no load on them. Compare it to screws and nails... bend a screw and it will break right away whereas a nail will take multiple hits.
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03-11-2016, 06:49 AM
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#7
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Rivet Master
2007 30' Classic
Oswego
, Illinois
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 13,669
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlbertaBound
The olympic rivets have no shear strength. That panel is structural so buck rivets are a must. Olympic rivets are only for patches and small repairs with no load on them. Compare it to screws and nails... bend a screw and it will break right away whereas a nail will take multiple hits.
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I believe these statements are an over-reach. Olympics do have shear strength......as much as bucked....probably not. (I can't seem to find specs on line) Clamping force? Probably less than bucked. Given a preference, bucked is better than Olympic, but removing half the interior and inner skins?.....a judgement call.
I had two upper end segments replaced 5 years and about 20k ago with Olympics, by JC, due to a backing accident. No leaks, no popped rivets, no seam fatigue.
__________________
-Rich-
"If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy." - Red Green
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03-13-2016, 11:52 AM
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#8
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2 Rivet Member
1975 Argosy 28
1975 Argosy 22
1978 Argosy Minuet 6.0 Metre
Camrose
, Alberta
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 74
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1/8 solid rivets have 363 lbs shear strength compared to the olympics at 120 lbs. Basically 1/3 the strength. Now since the Airstream used monocoque construction that means the panel holds the weight of the trailer. Your decision...
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03-13-2016, 12:49 PM
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#9
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Rivet Master
2007 30' Classic
Oswego
, Illinois
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 13,669
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And the shear strength of the panel edge?
__________________
-Rich-
"If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy." - Red Green
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03-13-2016, 02:39 PM
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#10
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4 Rivet Member
2016 30' Flying Cloud
Oviedo
, Florida
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlbertaBound
1/8 solid rivets have 363 lbs shear strength compared to the olympics at 120 lbs. Basically 1/3 the strength. Now since the Airstream used monocoque construction that means the panel holds the weight of the trailer. Your decision...
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I'm sorry, but an Airstream is most definitely not monocoque construction - it has a substantial steel frame and an aluminum superstructure frame the panels are riveted to. While the skins provides stiffness and some torsional resistance, the vertical weight bearing structure for most of the trailer is the frame.
While Olympic rivets can have leakage issues (especially when relying on the gaskets without sealant), I don't recall reading about any widespread issues of sheared rivets. The assertion that Olympics will fail and impact the structural integrity of an Airstream is IMHO hyperbole on a similar or higher level than the assertion that using anything other than a Hensley or PP will result in devastation and death.
I realize it's the internet, but lets try to have a little factual evidence or science before scaring the hell out of the folks that actually believe what they read here
__________________
Keith & Barb
2016 30' Flying Cloud
2016 Ram 2500 diesel
Southeastern Camping Unit, WBCCI #1675
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03-13-2016, 02:52 PM
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#11
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Rivet Master
1951 21' Flying Cloud
1960 24' Tradewind
Folsom
, California
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 727
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and hopefully we can "move on" now . . . but probably not.
anyway, make sure who ever is running the "bucking bar" on the inside of the trailer is wearing ear protection - I was typically on the outside, and then one day I taught my adult son to use the rivet gun, and I was on the inside . . . next day I was still a little deaf.
__________________
Aluminumbskull with Led Balloon in Drag
***
Birch Plywood and Aluminum go together like
Peanut Butter and Chocolate
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03-17-2016, 06:34 PM
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#12
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2 Rivet Member
1975 Argosy 28
1975 Argosy 22
1978 Argosy Minuet 6.0 Metre
Camrose
, Alberta
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 74
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One last rant
Quote:
And the shear strength of the panel edge?
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36000 lbs per square inch ... not really an issue
Quote:
I'm sorry, but an Airstream is most definitely not monocoque construction - it has a substantial steel frame and an aluminum superstructure frame the panels are riveted to. While the skins provides stiffness and some torsional resistance, the vertical weight bearing structure for most of the trailer is the frame.
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maybe you should read the sales brochure because they sure use the term "monocoque" ALOT!
Quote:
I realize it's the internet, but lets try to have a little factual evidence or science before scaring the hell out of the folks that actually believe what they read here
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Agreed!
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03-17-2016, 07:26 PM
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#13
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Rivet Master
2016 25' Flying Cloud
Jupiter
, Florida
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,140
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12-15-2021, 03:50 PM
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#14
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2 Rivet Member
1988 25' Excella
louisburg
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 21
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Rivets used in replacing glass in rear window
I broke the glass in the rear window of 73 land yacht. I guess I need too drill out the revits on the window hinge. What revits do I use for reinstalling hinge. Olympic?
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12-15-2021, 07:07 PM
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#15
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Rivet Master
1973 21' Globetrotter
Houston
, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,320
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Don't drill any rivets! The hinge on all the windows will part if you lift the window enough. Remove the window supports, and raise it up until it parts.
good luck!
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12-16-2021, 08:45 AM
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#16
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2 Rivet Member
1988 25' Excella
louisburg
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 21
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Thanks so much
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12-16-2021, 09:45 AM
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#17
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Rivet Master
2013 31' Classic
billings
, Montana
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 3,577
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Olympic rivets are fine..use lots of clecos
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12-17-2021, 03:55 PM
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#18
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2 Rivet Member
1988 25' Excella
louisburg
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 21
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You are my current hero. The window frame came right out like you said. Thanks so much. You saved me a lot of cussing
I've located a window maker that does tempered glass here in Mexico. Do you know if I can get a new frame for the screen.
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