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Old 02-07-2010, 02:40 AM   #221
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It was suggested that I have the compartment widened and have a new compartment door made to fix the cracking of the skin in that area. What do you all think?
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Old 02-07-2010, 02:46 AM   #222
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fix suggestion

I forgot to attach the picture. Jim Parret suggested making the compartment larger.
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Old 02-07-2010, 05:23 AM   #223
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I forgot to attach the picture. Jim Parret suggested making the compartment larger.
I think the problem is the door shape... IMHO, I'd round the door corners. Chamfer them at the least.
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Old 02-07-2010, 07:45 AM   #224
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I forgot to attach the picture. Jim Parret suggested making the compartment larger.
Why arn't others having the same problem?

Widening the door isn't going to solve the source of the problem.

The source, in my opinion, is an excessive rated tow vehicle, and/or excessive rated torsion bars, or torsion bars that don't bend when they should.

Andy
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Old 02-07-2010, 08:31 AM   #225
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I don't understand this post. Julie stated in another thread that she uses a reese with #600 bars purchased on your suggestion. Are you saying that she's now over-hitching her Airstream?

Rich the Viking

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Why arn't others having the same problem?

Widening the door isn't going to solve the source of the problem.

The source, in my opinion, is an excessive rated tow vehicle, and/or excessive rated torsion bars, or torsion bars that don't bend when they should.

Andy
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Old 02-07-2010, 08:55 AM   #226
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I don't understand this post. Julie stated in another thread that she uses a reese with #600 bars purchased on your suggestion. Are you saying that she's now over-hitching her Airstream?

Rich the Viking
Rich.

I didn'y say that.

What I stated is the reasons, or a combination of reasons, that can cause the metal fatigue problem.

The metal doesn't fatigue by itself. It is caused by something else.

Movement, in this case, I think, is the cause.

Now, the question becomes, "movement from what"?

Therefore I outlined the causes, of which anyone could be the culprit.

But, it's very early in the morning in Hawaii, and I should have added "lack of proper running gear balance" could also be the cause.

The cracks are the result of a problem.

The key, is to isolate the problem, and get it corrected.

Andy
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Old 02-07-2010, 09:48 AM   #227
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Originally Posted by jaojamjab View Post
It was suggested that I have the compartment widened and have a new compartment door made to fix the cracking of the skin in that area. What do you all think?
a smaller opening/door with rounded corners MIGHT make a difference, for awhile.

but this was FIXED at the factory once already AND with a hold down plate added?

then recurred after only a few 1000 miles towing?

that stinks.
________

IF planning to keep this trailer long term AND use it much, DITCH the door.

a full lower panel replacement withOUT door is another option for the next repair, consider this.

taking this approach provides the best chance to distribute the skin stresses evenly, and one can still get UNDER the bed from inside.

also they'll have the front OPENED up again and can inspect the effectiveness of the previous repairs...

i suspect things are LOOSER than they realize or the repairs were done poorly.

KEEP an EYE on the 3 section/pano windows and sealant above this area...

look for gaps/shifts/separation of the sealant or window framing or unexplained LEAKS in that region.

but ULTIMATELY no one HERE looking at one small picture can provide the answers to why this happened or HOW to remedy it.

blaming the running gear or tv or hitch IGNORES the inherent, a/s specific reasons for this.

this is like suggesting the toyota issue is related to poor quality control at the gasoline refinery.

it's very frustrating for the many owners who paid for these things with CRACK FREE money...

cheers
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Old 02-07-2010, 11:24 PM   #228
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Hi, 2air beat me to it, but it might be best to just remove this door. These trailers are going to have some flexing no matter what you do and having a square cut opening is in this area [in front, near the hitch] is like scoring glass; The scored glass will not break until flexed. Yes, over hitching, out of balance running gear, and a number of other things may cause it to crack sooner, but having a square cut door opening is asking for problems.
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Old 02-08-2010, 01:35 AM   #229
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Ok how do I go about isolating the problem? The running gear is balanced etc. What would be the next step?
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Old 02-08-2010, 02:03 AM   #230
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Ok how do I go about isolating the problem? The running gear is balanced etc. What would be the next step?
What brand hitch do you have, and what is the rating of the torsion bars?

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Old 02-08-2010, 03:04 AM   #231
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I have weighed my trailer and am well within or under the recommend limits. I understand what your saying about removing the compartment but it would seem difficult to access items from under the bed. I do like the storage space. What about rounding and bracing the corners?
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Old 02-09-2010, 12:40 AM   #232
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I have a reese with 600lb bars
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Old 02-09-2010, 12:49 AM   #233
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I have a reese with 600lb bars
Then I would place the blame on the rating of your tow vehicle.

Please be advised, that the front end can be beefed up, to permanently solve the issue, in spite of your tow vehicle rating, and without using 3/16 pop rivets, that are not sealed as well.

I don't think Airstream did you any favors, but instead passed the buck, along with a below standards repair.

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Old 02-10-2010, 03:41 PM   #234
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I am also proud to be a .01% r. There has still been no written direction for the how to hitch properly and balance the running gear or of the other issues that have been stated here that could cause this problem. The issue with an excessive vehicle suspension is still just hooey. Until you are a big enough company to come out and specify what vehicle you should tow with that is not a valid argument. The argument still stands in my mind as to why every other opening in the skin of this trailer is rounded with no issues such as this and this one squared corner opening has the problem????? hmmmmmm.
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Old 02-10-2010, 03:45 PM   #235
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Until you are williing to publish some facts and figures on "how to" do the proper methods I just can't get behind you on this stuff Airstream and your supporting agents. I want to know how just send me the documents so that I do not damage my investment.
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Old 02-10-2010, 06:01 PM   #236
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Until you are williing to publish some facts and figures on "how to" do the proper methods I just can't get behind you on this stuff Airstream and your supporting agents. I want to know how just send me the documents so that I do not damage my investment.
Construction, construction and construction.

I don't need to publish anything.

Most people who pose a question to someone that's be in most any industry for a long time, accept what they offer. But of course, some demand proofs.

Usually, on this web site, demands rarely receive any answer at all.

We modified a 34 foor Airstream by installing a 2 foot high and 8 foot long door in the side of the trailer, without any problems, in spite of the fact that the trailer has traveled thousands of miles, all over the USA.

That owner didn't demand proof of anything, verbally or in writing.

To modify the front of that trailer, is a piece of cake that would take about 4 to 5 hours to accomplish.

Airstream is very famous for using things over and over again, for many years.

When they get involved with something new, they don't always have the right answers.

With respect to that rectangular front end door, when the factory installs even one 3/16 pop rivet in the frame, and without any noticeable sealer being used, they are guessing that their fix is permanent. Obviously, they are wrong.

When the "lock out" problem surfaced, caused by slamming the entrance door, Airstream's answer for the fix was "DON'T SLAM THE DOOR". How nice.

We came up with a "FREE" kit that fixes that issue, that anyone can request by simply send us a SASE with 2 stamps on it. The kit costs us an outrageous sum of 3 cents, yes, three cents. Of the hundreds of owners that have installed that kit, many of them have said, "how easy and simple" all without one single negative complaint.

Airstream could have done that as well, but they would have to admit, "that a lockout problem exists".

Airstream never really owned up to rear end separation, bad plasticoat, altering the way axles were installed to compensate for the crown in the roads, bad A-frames, leaky double pane windows, the idiotic use of silicone sealers on the exterior, inadequate horizontal stringers, bad wiring, poor model design that had zero tongue weight, and the list can go on and on.

Airstream also said, a "flat rate manual" was impossible for body work. Wow, I wrote that manual in 1970, and it's still in use today. They reluctantly approved it in 1970. But, as a result of that, they had to come up with their own "warranty flat rate manual" that they really didn't want to do.

Most owners recognize that they are responsible for proper PM. But, it's again, their choices. They can ignore them and do anything they may so choose to do. But, when things fail, it's always someone elses fault. I have heard that story for over 40 years. It's the owners responsibilty to protect their investment, or not.

Then you have a few self appointed experts, that quite well have tons of experience with their rigs, but not with overall Airstream owners, other than siding with gripes.

Hope this answers your questions, especially where to seek help.

This Forums, provides a unique source of considerable information.

However, it's still up to the individual owner, to listen to and believe whatever they wish, or to kick it to the curb. It's their sole call.

Back to your request of written proofs. I don't think you will ever find it. It

Coming up with answers that correct some issues with fixes, is not normally difficult. I for one, enjoy helping Airstream owners as I have done for over 43 years.

Andy
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Old 02-10-2010, 07:04 PM   #237
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Andy, I'm not trying to split hairs here, but blaming this on an unsuspecting new Airstream owner is not really constructive. Put yourself in the other persons shoes for a minute. I saw another thread where jaojamjab stated that she purchased the hitch on your recommendation, which I'm sure would have included you asking her what she will be towing with. I'm not blaming you for her problem, I just don't buy into the argument that every Airstream trailer with this kind of problem is due to HD tow vehicles, wrong WD devices and/or out -of-balance runninggear. The fact that there is damage to the trailer is not proof-positive that the owner is abusing it. There is always the possibility of factory mistakes, engineering mistakes, and design mistakes that adds to the equation.
This is a person who needs HELP, not blame, and this thread has been full of blame. Lets get this person some solid information about how to solve the issue of the cracked front skin on her trailer, which is a known recurring problem with many owners. Airstream is responsible for creating this weak, square-cornered opening in an already questionably strong area. Knowing that the TV is too heavy-duty doesn't give a clue as to how to address getting it repaired permanently. She is using #600 bars on a 27' Airstream which seems reasonable(on the light side) without knowing all of the other details of the rigging, and even if you know what someone is using, how can you tell if they are using it properly without asking about the exact details of the rigging adjustment, and some scale weights to see just how much stress you are putting on your set-up?
I, for one, want to know how to come to a conclusion about what works and what doesn't, rather than get little tiny bits of ambiguous information which is immediately contradicted by another poster. How can anyone come to an educated conclusion about what to tow with and what hitch/ wd/ antisway device to buy and use? It seems that a coin toss would be more effective than reading these threads.
I wish some of the individuals here were as concerned about liability as Airstream is. There would probably be a lot less frivilous posting, and plain bad advice about such an important aspect of our safety as towing is. If the answer is NOT out there, lets just stop talking about it and move on to our next contentious debate, maybe about the comparative merits of fiberglass versus polypropolene flamingos(not much chance of a fatal accident there).

Rich the Frustrated Viking

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Then I would place the blame on the rating of your tow vehicle.

Please be advised, that the front end can be beefed up, to permanently solve the issue, in spite of your tow vehicle rating, and without using 3/16 pop rivets, that are not sealed as well.

I don't think Airstream did you any favors, but instead passed the buck, along with a below standards repair.

Andy
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Old 02-10-2010, 07:20 PM   #238
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Andy, I'm not trying to split hairs here, but blaming this on an unsuspecting new Airstream owner is not really constructive. Put yourself in the other persons shoes for a minute. I saw another thread where jaojamjab stated that she purchased the hitch on your recommendation, which I'm sure would have included you asking her what she will be towing with. I'm not blaming you for her problem, I just don't buy into the argument that every Airstream trailer with this kind of problem is due to HD tow vehicles, wrong WD devices and/or out -of-balance runninggear. The fact that there is damage to the trailer is not proof-positive that the owner is abusing it. There is always the possibility of factory mistakes, engineering mistakes, and design mistakes that adds to the equation.
This is a person who needs HELP, not blame, and this thread has been full of blame. Lets get this person some solid information about how to solve the issue of the cracked front skin on her trailer, which is a known recurring problem with many owners. Airstream is responsible for creating this weak, square-cornered opening in an already questionably strong area. Knowing that the TV is too heavy-duty doesn't give a clue as to how to address getting it repaired permanently. She is using #600 bars on a 27' Airstream which seems reasonable(on the light side) without knowing all of the other details of the rigging, and even if you know what someone is using, how can you tell if they are using it properly without asking about the exact details of the rigging adjustment, and some scale weights to see just how much stress you are putting on your set-up?
I, for one, want to know how to come to a conclusion about what works and what doesn't, rather than get little tiny bits of ambiguous information which is immediately contradicted by another poster. How can anyone come to an educated conclusion about what to tow with and what hitch/ wd/ antisway device to buy and use? It seems that a coin toss would be more effective than reading these threads.
I wish some of the individuals here were as concerned about liability as Airstream is. There would probably be a lot less frivilous posting, and plain bad advice about such an important aspect of our safety as towing is. If the answer is NOT out there, lets just stop talking about it and move on to our next contentious debate, maybe about the comparative merits of fiberglass versus polypropolene flamingos(not much chance of a fatal accident there).

Rich the Frustrated Viking
I am not trying to place the blame on any owner, male or female.

My exception was solely being not asked of how to, but a demand of how to.

I don't need to reply to demands of anyone.

If they wish to listen, great. If they don't want to listen, that's great, too.

For someone to demand that I put in writing of how to permanently fix the issue, which would take considerable time, and then more than likely still be ridiculed, because they would still disagree, is not in my cup of tea.

I love helping owners as I have for 43 plus years.

But, I do not have to go to extensive efforts, that would probably take hours, to try to help someone, that at least in my opinion, wants to be argumentive and demanding.

I am in Hawaii, for a short period of time. I can think of many things to do here, but being argumentive, is not one of them.

And besides, this Forums, frowns on arguments, and I am fully supportive of that policy.

Andy
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Old 02-11-2010, 10:28 AM   #239
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I was refering to the posts from jaojamjab, not krazyjohnny. I don't expect much from any conversation you and kj might have.LOL

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Old 02-11-2010, 07:21 PM   #240
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I think that if I were looking for assistance, I'd be real nice about it. No one owes anyone anything here, except common courtesy.

If you don't get the answer you want, figure a way to ask it again so someone can try to help. If you want help, that is.

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