West Stone Age Caveman Boondocking 2021 AD Style

[Ray Eklund]

[QUOTE=Dave-n-Janet;2484623]Reply to THalwg #28:
We camped last summer at Sibley Lake for a week in the Big Horns and drove around a lot. Checked out some of the possible dispersed places we saw on Campendium. Must agree with Thalwg, most looked like KOAs with many camping rigs, most without TVs. Asked ranger about that, said there used to be a Forest Service guy who for decades had responsibility for checking the 2 week camping maximum. But he retired and no replacement for several years. Basically looks like people haul their rigs up then can just drive up for the weekend to spend time in their RVs. Certainly wasn't the kind of boondocking I'm looking for. My fear is this will become the norm in many National Forests/BLM situations...
Dave[/QUOTE
******

Nancy vacuumed the dust and dog hair in the house and I needed the Leaf Blower to clean everything up... outside, of course. I do not want to smothered in my sleep, by some freak accident...

Thalweg wears short pants when he shovels snow in the Big Horns. That is because Connie does it. He is feeding himself and doing his job is his story. He is still among the living if he is able to respond.

Near ANY western town and worse near a city... the NFS has campers that are brought up and parked. Why? You ask. So many others come into the forest and stay for a few days or all summer from all over the USA.

Out of Towners from Wyoming are known by their license plate number. Wyoming, for example has County ONE... Casper. Albany County, Wyoming is County FIVE. The go up to 23 Counties and County 24 is Devils Tower where the Close Encounters of the Third Kind was suppose to happen. Thalweg is looking for a County 24 plate for me... He has connections with the 'Third Kind'.

This will be a fact of Off the Grid camping just outside of town. The best spots are the first to go. You end up camping next to... ME.

Out comes the Growler at 3AM... and we are all by ourselves.

I hope Thalweg is not bashful but he lives next to the Big Horn Mountains. Found this on Bing so you can figure out Wyoming and their Camping Habits.

Chicago, Illinois is NOT a County in Wyoming... just FYI.

Note Laramie County is Cheyenne. And Albany County is Laramie. What? Short story but it all made sense in 1890.

License #
County
County Seat



1
Natrona
Casper
2
Laramie
Cheyenne
3
Sheridan
Sheridan
4
Sweetwater
Green River
5
Albany
Laramie
6
Carbon
Rawlins
7
Goshen
Torrington
8
Platte
Wheatland
9
Big Horn
Basin
10
Fremont
Lander
11
Park
Cody
12
Lincoln
Kemmerer
13
Converse
Douglas
14
Niobrara
Lusk
15
Hot Springs
Thermopolis
16
Johnson
Buffalo
17
Campbell
Gillette
18
Crook
Sundance
19
Uinta
Evanston
20
Washakie
Worland
21
Weston
Newcastle
22
Teton
Jackson
23
Sublette
Pinedale

[Thalweg]

Originally Posted by Dave-n-Janet

Reply to THalwg #28:
We camped last summer at Sibley Lake for a week in the Big Horns and drove around a lot. Checked out some of the possible dispersed places we saw on Campendium. Must agree with Thalwg, most looked like KOAs with many camping rigs, most without TVs. Asked ranger about that, said there used to be a Forest Service guy who for decades had responsibility for checking the 2 week camping maximum. But he retired and no replacement for several years. Basically looks like people haul their rigs up then can just drive up for the weekend to spend time in their RVs. Certainly wasn't the kind of boondocking I'm looking for. My fear is this will become the norm in many National Forests/BLM situations...
Dave

Last year was definitely a "special" year. In order for the rangers to ask someone to move along, they have to document how long they've been there. That means photographs and notes. I think they were just overwhelmed and gave up. Hopefully, with other options opening up, it won't be so bad this year.

"That is Two Days in Wyoming's high country. Ask Thalweg. Snow... is just another form of Rain in Buffalo, Wyoming in June."

We did get snowed on in June, didn't we Ray? But that was near Dubois. The Bighorns are much too civilized for such ridiculousness. However, snow is predicted for tonight (April). I've heard anywhere from 6" to 15". I'm already seeing lots of RV's headed up the mountain. I wonder if they're ready.

I've got to disagree with you Ray about the generator (provisionally). My single battery will run my trailer for a couple of weeks if I don't use the fan or the furnace. My little solar charger won't even keep up with that. I've got a small generator, so it's not worth buying and lugging around big solar panels when a couple of hours on the generator every 2-3 weeks charges the battery fully. Provisionally because my 1962 Tradewind doesn't have all the electric conveniences that newer trailers have. We just use the led lights. We had a TV, but only used it once so we even took it out. Occasionally we'll use the roof fan. That shortens the battery life. We keep little Harbor Freight led lights in the camper, so we actually don't need the battery at all.

[Thalweg]

[QUOTE=Ray Eklund;2484662]

Originally Posted by Dave-n-Janet

Reply to THalwg #28:
We camped last summer at Sibley Lake for a week in the Big Horns and drove around a lot. Checked out some of the possible dispersed places we saw on Campendium. Must agree with Thalwg, most looked like KOAs with many camping rigs, most without TVs. Asked ranger about that, said there used to be a Forest Service guy who for decades had responsibility for checking the 2 week camping maximum. But he retired and no replacement for several years. Basically looks like people haul their rigs up then can just drive up for the weekend to spend time in their RVs. Certainly wasn't the kind of boondocking I'm looking for. My fear is this will become the norm in many National Forests/BLM situations...
Dave[/QUOTE
******

Nancy vacuumed the dust and dog hair in the house and I needed the Leaf Blower to clean everything up... outside, of course. I do not want to smothered in my sleep, by some freak accident...

Thalweg wears short pants when he shovels snow in the Big Horns. That is because Connie does it. He is feeding himself and doing his job is his story. He is still among the living if he is able to respond.

Near ANY western town and worse near a city... the NFS has campers that are brought up and parked. Why? You ask. So many others come into the forest and stay for a few days or all summer from all over the USA.

Out of Towners from Wyoming are known by their license plate number. Wyoming, for example has County ONE... Casper. Albany County, Wyoming is County FIVE. The go up to 23 Counties and County 24 is Devils Tower where the Close Encounters of the Third Kind was suppose to happen. Thalweg is looking for a County 24 plate for me... He has connections with the 'Third Kind'.

This will be a fact of Off the Grid camping just outside of town. The best spots are the first to go. You end up camping next to... ME.

Out comes the Growler at 3AM... and we are all by ourselves.

I hope Thalweg is not bashful but he lives next to the Big Horn Mountains. Found this on Bing so you can figure out Wyoming and their Camping Habits.

Chicago, Illinois is NOT a County in Wyoming... just FYI.

Note Laramie County is Cheyenne. And Albany County is Laramie. What? Short story but it all made sense in 1890.

License #
County
County Seat



1
Natrona
Casper
2
Laramie
Cheyenne
3
Sheridan
Sheridan
4
Sweetwater
Green River
5
Albany
Laramie
6
Carbon
Rawlins
7
Goshen
Torrington
8
Platte
Wheatland
9
Big Horn
Basin
10
Fremont
Lander
11
Park
Cody
12
Lincoln
Kemmerer
13
Converse
Douglas
14
Niobrara
Lusk
15
Hot Springs
Thermopolis
16
Johnson
Buffalo
17
Campbell
Gillette
18
Crook
Sundance
19
Uinta
Evanston
20
Washakie
Worland
21
Weston
Newcastle
22
Teton
Jackson
23
Sublette
Pinedale

I thought County 16 was Durant. I can get you a 24 county plate. Unfortunatly it says: 24-Longmire. They're for sale downtown.

[Ray Eklund]

My idea of a 'Wyoming Generator' is a round Chipmunk Cage with one chipmunk during the day, and Two if you want to run a LED bulb.

Of course, you still have to feed the critters, clean their cage and keep our Blue Heelers nearby. No Blue Heelers near the cage, about 1 chipmunk power. Blue Heelers looking at the chipmunks speeds things up. Thalweg's idea of a Wyoming gasoline "Generator" is about 10X squirrel power.

Barely the energy of one Energizer Bunny per year power... which is One AA battery.

Where are Posters that want to join in? Where are the Questions? Where is the sound advice? Where is the sarcasm? We all have excuses, anyone with solutions to those whiners on other Threads. This is the conversation real OTG Airstream owners talk about... mostly in their their sleep, as bed time for most is just after Sunset.

(Just a motivational speech here. Not us. Them others... )

No one bothers with Boondocking Threads, with any title. This is like being on Pluto, which now is not even considered a planet and no longer of any interest.

We need First Experiences of Bad Situations in or near your Airstream. Even if they are TRUE. Airstream camping Boondocking is not to be taken too seriously. It is only fun once you figure it all out. Otherwise it is a bit taking a look over the edge at Angel's Landing at Zion National Park. You are looking over the edge and you flip flops... slip a bit. (Only those who have done Angel's Landing would understand. I have done it many times and even taking two daughters hanging onto the chain.) Now they fear nothing. Try it someday.

Did any of you know it costs $15.00 to tow your trailer out of Zion at the South Entrance? I found out the hard way. Tell us that story IF YOU discovered this as well and did you pay cash, or charge it?

We can help. H. E. L. PpppP. We are NOT here from the Government to help you... kind of stuff.

None of this is Made Up. It just not well documented.

Much like Thalweg, as long as it sounds logical... write about it, but you had to have done it. He just left out 'squirrels' and substituted... 'generator'.

I not only want a County 24 plate from Buffalo... I also want that County 24 plate from "Close Encounters of the Third Kind". Also a Wyoming County 24 plate. No body but someone who notices these things would know. Insanity is in the opinion of those who understand that Devil's Tower has NO Road to the top. That was not real. But the acting was really convincing.

This was fun. Guests can be fun, but gawkers... they are everywhere. "All men are idiots and my husband is their King." I am #00001

[Thalweg]

I was thinking about your growler. I tried making one but couldn't make it sing like you do. We get oodles of hunters around here every fall. I was sitting at Hardees one day and overheard a conversation from some guys from back east somewhere. They were discussing their activities for the day. One feller said he didn't get anything, but got off a few "sound shots". Essentially he was saying he heard something and shot at the sound. Oiy-vey. Made me wonder about the wisdom of the growlers.

By the way, I traded in the 10 squirrel generator for a five marmot generator. Higher voltage, but lower amperage....more stamina.

[jaybauman]

OK, Ray, I'll bite....

Here's my question. I'd love to learn via trails and tribulations all the ins and outs of OTG camping. However, my lovely little lady is not so game. How do I convince her to give it a try?

[Ray Eklund]

Originally Posted by Thalweg

I was thinking about your growler. I tried making one but couldn't make it sing like you do. We get oodles of hunters around here every fall. I was sitting at Hardees one day and overheard a conversation from some guys from back east somewhere. They were discussing their activities for the day. One feller said he didn't get anything, but got off a few "sound shots". Essentially he was saying he heard something and shot at the sound. Oiy-vey. Made me wonder about the wisdom of the growlers.

By the way, I traded in the 10 squirrel generator for a five marmot generator. Higher voltage, but lower amperage....more stamina.

*****

Thalweg has a great sense of humor. He and Connie are fun to be with. Nancy and I are planning to visit Buffalo, WY, help with a Growler and have another great time.

[Ray Eklund]

Originally Posted by jaybauman

OK, Ray, I'll bite....

Here's my question. I'd love to learn via trails and tribulations all the ins and outs of OTG camping. However, my lovely little lady is not so game. How do I convince her to give it a try?

*****
- Have your Wife make a list of what she likes about RV Parks. They are excellent options and provide all the comforts anyone could ask for. That is a big step if you never spent time traveling and camped in a trailer for vacations.

- Have your Wife make a list of what she does not like about the 'idea' of OTG Boondocking. Not all parts of the USA provide the geography or public land that the Western USA has to offer. Thalweg and I are spoiled and wives that manage to make it interesting.

- Toss these out on the Forum. Start your own Thread. Many others really, really have similar situations. Post on this Thread. You are not alone.

There are many members on the Airforums who have been in the same situation. It is NOT a common desire to get out into the back country and not know what to expect. Many want to know what to... expect. OTG has 25% planning and 75% making it up as you go.

I know people that the sight of a snake will cause them to panic. Just them knowing there could be Bear in an area will also ruin their interest. It is not unusual. I would not push too hard.

The BEST WAY is to find another couple who also would like to try getting some small excursion out, close to home that is one step at a time. Comfort zone changes with experience and confidence. Or someone who is willing to take you out and spend some time, on site OTG, and reach a point of confidence. Then try another time together... eventually going there yourself.

Public camp ground. National Forest no facility, except maybe a dry restroom. Then up the road to a visible open area used by campers. Then... you are pushing into the OTG needing good maps and a compass. Ooooohhhh Weeee Wyoming for you is the next step.

The reward is to OTG and then stay at a RV Park, take a deep breath and toss out the Pros and Cons of the experience. There is no right or wrong. Photography. Read a Novel, while the other fly fishes. Hike. Bike. I am very lucky to have an understanding wife, who enjoys being out with the two Blue Heelers.

I am a lucky one. My wife was a camper in her youth. Her family camped and she enjoyed it in a small travel trailer... all FIVE of them. Hammocks and all.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Ok, generator vs solar vs fire. First vote goes to fire. It's been a caveman's friend for a long time. Keeps you warm at night and heats the coffee in the morning. Your campsite is always surrounded by trees (isn't it ... ) so there is always fuel available.

Hmm .... seems there's a dissenting voice somewhere in the back of the room. They claim that there are parts of the country *not* covered in forest ... weird ... where do you find pine needles and leaves to make a soft bed ??? How do you keep your tent out of the wind ... crazy to camp there ....

The same parts of the world that are nice for campfires can be a challenge for solar. Those nice dense forests block out light. Combine that with rain and overcast ( yes those also exist in some parts of the world) and you can become "solar challenged".

The next layer to this is (as noted earlier) that lead acid batteries are "generator challenged". Topping off lead acid's is a *long* process. You will be listening to that generator for hours and hours on end. Yes, it can be several hours every day or it can be all day every couple days. Is one *really* better than the other?

To the extent you can, don't use power. Use the fire when you can. Live outdoors, that's why you came in the first place ...remember ?? .. Even here at home, we started a "electronics free" couple hours in the evening out in the back yard. Even without the wine it's very relaxing. If it's raining at hurricane strength, read a book (and be glad you aren't in a tent !!) .... If it's just a drizzle, that's why you own rain gear.

We have hauled a generator with us for quite a while. I have yet to fire one up while out and about. They take up space and the ones that will run *everything* are massively heavy. They also gulp gas (or propane) like crazy. Those fuel containers aren't small or light either. Planning on running the great big generator off the trailer propane just makes for a much bigger tank to fill, not quite as often. If there's a cold snap, that fire may indeed be needed to keep you warm

One very non-stone age gizmo that belongs on any rig used off grid is a shunt based battery monitor. Without one, regardless of your battery chemistry, you only have the vaguest of ideas about what's going on with your batteries. If you are new to this, it gives you feedback on what the loads you are using sum up to. Having that can get you headed in the right direction (conservation) much more quickly. If you have been doing this for quite a while, your batteries *will* wear out. Being able to monitor that *is* a good thing ....

I would put the monitor higher on the list than a generator or a lithium upgrade. I'd put it darn near even with solar. Still *much* further down the list than matches. That rubbing sticks stuff is a *really* tiresome way to start the fire in the morning ....

Bob

[Thalweg]

Originally Posted by jaybauman

OK, Ray, I'll bite....

Here's my question. I'd love to learn via trails and tribulations all the ins and outs of OTG camping. However, my lovely little lady is not so game. How do I convince her to give it a try?

Another suggestion; go to a National Forest campground. Typically they are not too far removed from OTG camping. The only amenities you'll likely have are a pit toilet, a flat spot to park, a picnic table, and a fire ring (and neighbors). Hang out there for a couple of days. While you're there go explore the area, looking for good OTG locations. Find some spot with a spectacular view. Then you say "how would you like to wake up to this view Honey?" She may recognize that the only difference between what you've been doing for a couple of days is the pit toilet and the beautiful, peaceful solitude, and the remarkable view. If you're lucky she'll say, "okay, lets move up here tomorrow".

[Ray Eklund]

Those who love a particular place and I have been there... and frequently how fast can I leave there, confuse me. My primitive sense of smell and scenery is confusing.

Greeley, Colorado. You have two choices. Camp downwind from the feedlot. Or upwind from the feedlot. You pick. The view is the same, the cattle do not care one bit if you are nearby. Maybe the town moved, or the Feed Lot. It has been a few decades at the junk yard upwind from the feedlot. Car parts were by the pound or bucket in those days. Santa's choice, I say.

Much like riding along a trail with a guide and ten other pioneers. The Guide, the one without saddle chaffing, is up front and the rest are seeing the same view the entire trip. Biting flies go from Horse Flies to Human Flies, instantly. They prefer your nose to the horse's... well humans are easier picking.

The BEST horse back rides are at Fort Robinson, Nebraska in the panhandle. West of Crawford. You can hold back your frisky horse and get a better view. Kids love it and you will too. I have to admit this is one of those places that if you stay at the well maintained RV Park or Campground or near the Rodeo... this is the place.

Crazy Horse himself came to Fort Robinson. He should have gone somewhere else, but that is another story. The 1870's was not a good decade for some in the West. He is buried somewhere in the area. No one knows where.

Moab, Utah. I will say a few good words. ........... there you go.

My pinch collar has been pulled. Uncle_Bob and Thalweg can fill in.

[Thalweg]

Originally Posted by Ray Eklund

The BEST horse back rides are at Fort Robinson, Nebraska in the panhandle. West of Crawford. You can hold back your frisky horse and get a better view. Kids love it and you will too. I have to admit this is one of those places that if you stay at the well maintained RV Park or Campground or near the Rodeo... this is the place.

I remember those horses! We'd ride them almost every year on our annual family vacation; Valentine NE to the Tetons. You could close your eyes, ride backwards, stand on your head on those horses. They knew the route and never flinch. Occasionally they might look back at you with a look in their eye that says "you're an idiot". That's as excited as they would ever get.

Time to go fire up the snow plow before it gets too deep to push. I'm tired of winter.

[Ray Eklund]

I now understand why there is more interest in FIXING your Airstream than actually USING it. The trailer either needs work or not. Everyone likes to read about others not understanding what a Metric or US Socket can be used for. The video would be even more interesting...

A squeaky sound under the axle when walking around inside takes years to figure out... for some. Cotton balls cure that immediately. The axles are connected to the tires. This 'squeaky sound' is your tennis shoe sticking to the linoleum. Geeez... Your wife noticed it, before you did.

An Airstream Dude's tool box costing $150 contains $14.28 of tape, screw driver and a phillips. Maybe some electrical tape, a box stretcher, saltine crackers, a left handed screw driver and a used gasket for a lawn mower than did not start, since it was out of fuel and but had a fuel tank full of oil.

Much like the ice coolers with 'name brand recognition' versus cheap better ones.

Designer Tools are next to follow. Advertising pays, I say. The less the demonstrater is wearing, the longer the commercial can run.

Boondockers need to be above all of that. Guys need to find a Woman who can whip them into some other time dimension... Twilight Zone kind of stuff. Mamma's boy they would say. They would cry and go play with their dolls.

You NEED Tools owning an Airstream. Lots. Some you will only use once. But did not have it for that one time at Glacial Park, Montana. ...snow shovel? No. But you are thinking. Ask your wife, you are just not catching on to any of this.

My tools weigh a lot. Because when I did not have a... tool... I needed it.

Now I have the tool... I do not need it.

Ranchers do not carry Tools riding around the livestock. Their ATV's are in top shape. Horses... are optional.

Women understand. You need an iron to iron a shirt. But then an Ironing Board. Then a cover for the Ironing Board. Then something to spray water on the item being Ironed. Then a Coat Hanger, shirt hanger or fold your clean but obnoxious looking briefs. Get with it. This is just to Iron your dumb clothes. YOU are the master of your Airstream and don't know how to entice your Wife to go Boondocking with... you?

Hell. I don't want be around you, as well. You probably like...cats, too.

We had someone who wanted to get his wife interested in Boondocking and ignored the advice of thousands of posts on the Forums. The wife would be interested if it involved a Massage in Las Vegas and a $2500 purse at the Caesars Palace. Boondocking problem solved.

Lose the 'Beer Gut', take a shower and trim those nasal hairs is another option. But preaching to the choir, again. Hot Neanderthals, like myself, do not need to convince any Woman to go OTG Boondocking. Harry beast or not... it is all in the packaging. We leave before the end of the month and the rest of you can try to get off the sofa and find a walking stick, a healthy dog and be an Anti Dude.

Go to Greeley, Colorado and hand feed Cattle as a photo-op doing it for your website.

[jaybauman]

Originally Posted by Ray Eklund

*****
- Have your Wife make a list of what she likes about RV Parks. They are excellent options and provide all the comforts anyone could ask for. That is a big step if you never spent time traveling and camped in a trailer for vacations.

- Have your Wife make a list of what she does not like about the 'idea' of OTG Boondocking. Not all parts of the USA provide the geography or public land that the Western USA has to offer. Thalweg and I are spoiled and wives that manage to make it interesting....

My wife loves camping...or, rather, loves taking trips with the Airstream. In our first year and a half of ownership, we managed ~60 nights, even though we both hold down full-time jobs (that cannot be done remotely). Unhooking at the KOA Resort located adjacent to a WalMart SuperCenter allows for all manners of unpreparedness. Is this really camping...Forget something? Credit Card at WalMart. Break something? Credit Card. Lose something? Well, you get the trend.

As far as she can say, her biggest uncertainty while boondocking is the water situation. ~50 gallons doesn't give a lot of shower time. The kids and I don't have a problem with this. In fact, I'm sure they would agree with me that bathing every day is overrated--especially while on "vacation". Who do I need to smell good for, anyway? Oh yeah, I need smell good for the wife. That's who. I say let's just bring some hair ties, lots of perfume (French showers, anyone?) and head out into the wilderness until we break something. But until I get better powers of persuasion, the first thing to break will be my marriage!

Until then, I'm still working on my Jedi mind trick powers....

[Ray Eklund]

Daily showers give Women, especially, wrinkles.

Take Grey Water, filter it through a filter and use it for cooking, it you are concerned about using too much water... not showering saves you that step. If you are in the Wyoming RED Desert and will die without water... Grey water is your best water. Obviously Clean, as well, since you shower all of the time.

Showering removes healthy oil from the skin, crows' feet develop along the eyes, forehead wrinkles and sagging. Un-oiled hair turns gray quicker in the Sun.

Water when OTG is for drinking and using paper plates, eliminates most of the dish washing. If Airstream thought Showers were important, they would have higher quality fixtures.

Much like the Al-a-Mode Airstream 3 ounce hydro flush toilet. It is for looks. Use it if you detest YOUR Germs left at the RV Park's toilet seats. Nobody likes someone else's bacteria. Especially yours.

I use my handkerchief to blow my nose, wear when shopping at the super metro mall in Downtown Fort Saunders as a kind of disguise, wiping off toilet seats at service stations and as a bib when eating in the Airstream.

If you believe all of that, I have a magic bean to sell you, too. But... those that use to know me... know it has more truth than one can imagine.

On the 2016 Wyoming Adventure I knew of, rumors of course, that some had to find dump stations often so the owners could get wrinkles, crows feet taking showers every day. Twice on a windy day. Bad hair days. Flies that like the smell of scented soap. Grizzly Bears in mating season smelling something HOT in the Forest... all kinds of great side effects of showering.

When your Super Batteries are at 5 volts, showering is a good dream, only. Nothing works. That includes getting water out of the faucet. You are holding a nail and using your head as the hammer... kind of situation. Grey water begins to taste... real good, in five days cooking on those hot July afternoons.

Camp some distance from Clean Campers. Something is going to happen sooner than later and the screaming is part of the Clean Package in the Forest. I like Bacon Scented Soap... for my 'special clean friends' to use.

Amateur OTG Stone Age Boondockers change the bed sheets when necessary. Not on a schedule. When was the last time you washed a sleeping bag? The newest coin in it was 1987... and it was uncirculated.

I could also take the side of those who do Shower all of the time. Yes.

They are Fish. They are slippery and oily. Jump in with them and mingle with friends.

[Tim A.]

I'm old enough that it's hard to get more wrinkles and my hair is fully grey. As a result, I feel free to shower all I want. Of course, we almost always have hookups, so feel free to ignore this reply.

Tim

[uncle_bob]

Hi

One thing about starting out in tents .... this whole debate about showers is *not* part of the dialog. If you started off before tents, cavemen (and women) didn't have a hot shower right at the campsite .... ever. Oddly enough, "back in the day" the only way to have a hot bath (forget about a shower) on the farm was to boil a *lot* of water. Before it gets boiled, you have to hand pump it into buckets. I speak of that from. personal experience.

If your recommendation is to go hop in the pond ... that's where the cattle and horses and geese and ... all water down. They get first priority. Indeed they go for multiple "needs" down by the pond. It's not someplace you are likely to get very clean .... (your farm may be different than grandpa's ...).

One *might* think that lack of showers would go with using horses. At least in my case, not so much. The conversion to mechanical devices took place long before I was born. Before there were ATV's folks had amazing collections of "used cars" (putting it politely). At any given time a couple probably where in functional shape. The tractor was *always* up and running. I'll take something with locking front and rear diff's please ...

One of the amazing things one learns (often by having a really cheap car and not a much sense at all) is that you can do a *lot* of off road adventure in a pretty normal vehicle. Low clearance sports cars need not apply. The (original) VW Beetle was quite capable ... left an International Scout (remember them ??) in the dust once upon a time. Rancher out in New Mexico had some pretty crazy stuff he'd show you with his 2WD pickup.

Can you get in trouble? Sure you can. Travel in groups is a really good idea if you are going in further than you can walk out. It's even a good idea just for the company. Maps and a sense of direction are not an optional item in this case. Cavemen most certainly had a sense of direction. No need to wonder which way was back to camp or where the water was. They *knew* ( or they likely didn't live very long ). Indeed it's something you learn.

By far the most interesting places we go and see are completely unintentional. Drive around and look at this or look at that. Wonder what's over there? Go find out !!! Crowds / crazy signs / big admission costs .... forget about it. To be completely truthful, I probably could not tell you where 80% of them are. Unlike the more organized, we don't take notes .... sorry about that. To busy having fun.

Sun rise and sunset over Kansas can be awesome ... where in Kansas? just about anyplace. Big storm front rolling in over Indiana, clear sky to one side and towering clouds to the other. Wall of clouds as far as you can see. Where in Indiana? the flat part ... Waking up to fresh snow on the mountains, wow !! Which mountains? Pretty much all of them. Loons taking off over the flat water at 4AM in Canada with a full moon in the background, memory I'll never forget. Somewhere in north Ontario ....

Would any of that be a "destination item" to go see? Nope. They all "just happen". They have been happening for a *very* long time. My guess is that folks have been enjoying the sights for quite a while. The gotcha, you need to get out and *be* there to see them.

We are every bit as "addicted" to our devices as anybody else. I would bet at least a case of beer ( your choice, delivered ... ) that the house here has more Cisco networking gear in it than yours. I'd also bet that there are more atomic clocks here. That said, getting away from all this "stuff" is very much worth doing. Don't take it all with you. Leave it at home. It will be there when you get back. Do a bit of digital detox, it's good for you.

What if you miss something while you are out? Indeed stuff happens. If there is a death in the family, getting to the funeral is a priority. That's what the cell phone is for. That's also why you have an open travel schedule. (Hint: always pack a set of nice cloths). Past that, just how many things really require a quick response. When you are 800 miles away and the fire alarm goes off, are you actually involved? Nope.

Get out and get away from it all !!!!

Bob

[Ray Eklund]

Uncle Bob Post #58 wrote a masterpiece of Airforum Literature. Maybe someone can put it to drums, add some Stone Age Western Singers and some thick skulled Homo sapiens will figure it all... out.

This is the moment many do not recognize. There are 'normal Human Beans' on this Forum. Normal means good thoughtful people giving excellent tested advice to those who have no clue other than looking for something... and it is right under their nose.

Well done Bob. You are a true Neanderthal. Like Thalweg and some others on the Forum that survived the 2016 Wyoming Adventure. They know who they are, but you never hear much from them.

Owning an Airstream does not make one special, as many believe. It is the Souls and Hearts of the trailer's travelers within, that make the Trailer special.

Many... are sour Apples. I have met some.

[Ray Eklund]

Originally Posted by jaybauman

OK, Ray, I'll bite....

Here's my question. I'd love to learn via trails and tribulations all the ins and outs of OTG camping. However, my lovely little lady is not so game. How do I convince her to give it a try?

******

Post 47, 58 and Post 59 are examples of either one or both individuals interested in Boondocking or one or the other Not. Often the disinterested individual is just not interested. That is why one must have the disinterested party to explain WHY?

The Chimpanzee examining the Human Skull is exactly that question. What and Why is this so? Everyone has a Reason. Discover it and you are on track to make progress.

Not by asking those who do enjoy OTG Boondocking on the Forum. Those who do not Boondock on the Forum are NOT reading the previous posts. They are looking at RV Park sites others enjoy. But it is a start. ASK those who DO NOT Boondock...

WHY? We already have a long list of reasons.

It makes for a sour experience for both. The "Sour Apple". They are the majority of RV and Trailer owners. It is not WHY They wanted a trailer. Each individual has their reason, and often many. Although, not in the trees with the birds and bees... only.

You must even think of that BEFORE you purchase an Airstream or SOB... not afterwards and discover BOTH of YOU do not like trailer camping.

It happens. It goes sour on the FIRST TRIP. The year 2022 will be providing many one year old, unused Airstreams and Campers. Sour Grapes, as well.

You will not see a Caravan of Corvettes driving on a 4 wheel Mountain Road to an OTG camping area. It will make for a lot of unhappy Corvette Club members. They did not have a Corvette to go Tent Camping in the Gila Wilderness. Although, possible.

Being afraid of the unknown and unfamiliar places, is often. Start like said before, slowly from objective A to OTG.

Even camping with an Airstream, among luxuries of a modern Home, it often does not work to entice friends or even a Spouse to participate. We had a neighbor who said his wife's idea of camping was at a Howard Johnson Hotel.

It makes sense when you Talk to Them. Point by point.

When someone like Jay inquire... we wait for a followup. ...and wait. It is a tough situation for him. He make like Boondocking. It does not mean anyone else will. Things sour like hot milk in the Sun. I have seen it.

My Mother, hated camping. My Dad loved the outdoors and fishing. She hated the thought of Fish and Camping. He left alone.

When Nancy and I bought our 2006 Airstream... my Mother ASKED if she could go camping. Asked to go. We took her to a large open Campground south of I-70 and Boonville, Missouri. My brother was there participating at a Flint Knapping get together. Young and old alike. She regretted NOT trying tent camping with my Dad all of those years when my brother and I were young.

So, please. Offer just once to take your 'significant other' out ONCE. Hell or high water event. Just like Mikey, in the commerical.

She, or in some cases HE, may have a change of mind and like it.

So Jay... make a Deal. Just one week and let her have a choice of where. Even if you park at a Costco, WalMart or at Fort Robinson, Nebraksa at their Campsite with all the activities for any AGE. Do it. You have this one chance.

My Mother, who was around 70 at the time... went camping with us in the Badlands for a week. She in the back of the pick up, and Nancy and I in the Tent. This was an old Post on These Forums. Rattlesnake... and all.

[Ray Eklund]

There are a few OTG Airstream owners that I know who have the ability and courage to 'survive Wyoming'. How about Utah and Colorado?

I need HELP, like Thalweg and his maps and ability to talk MAP. I need HELP with those who can socialize the Neanderthals, like myself. If you lack experience with an Airstream in Nowhere, you have to have heart. This is no Dance in the Park for those not able to adapt. For us... second nature and typical OTG.

You must have experience OTG and B. You must be able be able to take directions and understand that some travel is a bit beyond the experience of many. That is the entire bargain you are getting yourself into. You will be living Neanderthal Stone Age... luxury camping. A trailer. A tent. No matter, you need to be prepared for... what comes.

RV Parks, out of the question. Remote campsites without any pit houses, showers, electricity, water and the conveniences of catered meals and car washes. An adventure to turn Sour Apples into sweet Apple Juice.

Eastern Utah and Western Colorado... have extremes in Geology and Elevations. You have to be able to accept thin air, cold evenings and bad weather... if it happens.

July 2021 Utah or Bust.

Find a copy of this Book: Geology of Eastern Iron County, Utah by Herbert E. Gregory printed in 1950. Used copies are on the Internet or were, starting at $9. It comes with a Map.

This is an Off the Grid Boondocking for those who can make a deal with the Devil of the Neanderthal.

If you have time, look back on some previous Boondocking Posts to understand. A group traveling together and explore places not on a Tourist Guide Book.

We are going at elevation to catch the warm days and cool evenings. Plans change with conditions and access to camp sites. This is not for complainers, whiners and sour attitudes about inconvenience... but the payoff for us has always been... 99%.

Nancy may smother me in my sleep... but this is an offer to really experience OTG with only what you brought. Maybe learn some Geology, Paleontology and how to tell an Agate from an Apple. Know a Sink Hole when you are camped upon one.

And Uncle Bob... maybe make this as a Stone Age camper.