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12-21-2011, 06:10 AM
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#61
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Always learning
1972 29' Ambassador
1962 19' Globetrotter
1951 21' Flying Cloud
Central
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,881
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Hey Veg,
To get number bits, you'll need to go to a place that sells specialty tools and fasteners. Places like Fastenal, Grainger, or an independent outfit is even better. Ask Darkspeed where he goes.
See Frank's post number 59 above and read B) good advice from Franks, as always.
__________________
Lance
Work is never done, so take time to play!
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12-21-2011, 06:17 AM
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#62
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Aluminum Falcon Mechanic
1972 31' Sovereign
Wesley chapel
, Florida
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,169
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Well I was getting bits at vintage online and at the local fastenall but the local fastenall just went out of business.
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12-21-2011, 06:40 AM
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#63
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Rivet Master
1973 31' Sovereign
2007 20' Safari SE
Vintage Kin Owner
Wesley Chapel
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 886
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Fastenal
Hi Todd.
I'll be in Tampa again today and closed enough from a Fastenal so I can just get some from them.
Looking online I see that they have 2 of the same #, same brand but diff $, any recommendations?
BTW do you need anything from Fastenal?
__________________
Still One Nation under GOD
2 chronicles 7:14
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12-21-2011, 07:39 AM
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#64
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Aluminum Falcon Mechanic
1972 31' Sovereign
Wesley chapel
, Florida
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeggieBullet
Hi Todd.
I'll be in Tampa again today and closed enough from a Fastenal so I can just get some from them.
Looking online I see that they have 2 of the same #, same brand but diff $, any recommendations?
BTW do you need anything from Fastenal?
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You may find the are different lengths
No I'm good.. My sister says if they sell boyfriends, she needs a new one..
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12-21-2011, 08:15 AM
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#65
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1 Rivet Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Wimberley
, Texas
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
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I have noticed on my 47 Spartan Manor that all of the rivet heads already have a dimple dead center. I am assuming that whatever shank was used to install the rivets created this dimple. That is going to make it much easier to start the drill bit dead center. Does anyone know if these type of shanks are avalible for a 3X rivet gun?
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12-21-2011, 03:31 PM
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#66
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Rivet Master
1973 31' Sovereign
2007 20' Safari SE
Vintage Kin Owner
Wesley Chapel
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 886
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it wasn't that bad at all!
Hi Guys this is not bad at all!
Got the last VV done today and it wasn't that bad. Except for the fact that my rivet gun is not the best so I'm on ebay now looking for something to speed this riveting process.
Can an Air Hydraulic Riveter Gun be used to speed this up?
__________________
Still One Nation under GOD
2 chronicles 7:14
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12-21-2011, 03:48 PM
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#67
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Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
Corona
, California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeggieBullet
Hi Guys this is not bad at all!
Got the last VV done today and it wasn't that bad. Except for the fact that my rivet gun is not the best so I'm on ebay now looking for something to speed this riveting process.
Can an Air Hydraulic Riveter Gun be used to speed this up?
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Sure can, as long as you have an extension cord, a compressor and an air hose.
Andy
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12-21-2011, 03:59 PM
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#68
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Aluminum Falcon Mechanic
1972 31' Sovereign
Wesley chapel
, Florida
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeggieBullet
Hi Guys this is not bad at all!
Got the last VV done today and it wasn't that bad. Except for the fact that my rivet gun is not the best so I'm on ebay now looking for something to speed this riveting process.
Can an Air Hydraulic Riveter Gun be used to speed this up?
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Ya I got one... Think it is still in the box.. lol.. need to borrow it
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12-21-2011, 04:03 PM
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#69
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1950 Flying Cloud 7039
1950 21' Flying Cloud
Allen
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danimal327
I have noticed on my 47 Spartan Manor that all of the rivet heads already have a dimple dead center. I am assuming that whatever shank was used to install the rivets created this dimple. That is going to make it much easier to start the drill bit dead center. Does anyone know if these type of shanks are avalible for a 3X rivet gun?
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Not sure the size of the rivet, but the dimples (MS20470-AD5) still exist in new rivets today. They are not created by the shank.
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12-21-2011, 04:08 PM
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#70
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1950 Flying Cloud 7039
1950 21' Flying Cloud
Allen
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeggieBullet
Hi Guys this is not bad at all!
Got the last VV done today and it wasn't that bad. Except for the fact that my rivet gun is not the best so I'm on ebay now looking for something to speed this riveting process.
Can an Air Hydraulic Riveter Gun be used to speed this up?
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If you are using "pop" rivets, a gun is so much better. I had an air/hydraulic. I ended up buying a straight air gun made by Pop of all people. One of the best tools I have bought. Even for the price.
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12-22-2011, 11:57 AM
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#71
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Rivet Master
1971 21' Globetrotter
Currently Looking...
Currently Looking...
Currently Looking...
Arvada
, Colorado
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 3,527
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danimal327
I have noticed on my 47 Spartan Manor that all of the rivet heads already have a dimple dead center. I am assuming that whatever shank was used to install the rivets created this dimple. That is going to make it much easier to start the drill bit dead center. Does anyone know if these type of shanks are avalible for a 3X rivet gun?
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The rivets you posted a pictured of are AN455AD4-X (#30 drill) which are extremly hard to find anymore and replaced by MS20470AD5-X (#21 drill). Below is AC 43.13 that explains the numbers, Identifiers,alloys, etc
The best drill bits to use are 135 degree split tip in cobalt at around 3000 rpm, more expensive be last 10X longer.
I personally have never used one of those guide tools as they were not available when I started doing aircraft sheet metal way back in 1976
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12-22-2011, 12:42 PM
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#72
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Rivet Master
1991 34' Excella
1963 26' Overlander
1961 26' Overlander
Central
, Mississippi
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,919
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I will add that I used one of those drill guides and found it was very good at STARTING a hole. It is super fast to hit a bunch of rivets and create a very centered shallow hole. I then used a regular bit to finish drilling out the rivet.
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12-22-2011, 01:34 PM
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#73
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Rivet Master
1999 23' Safari
Perrysburg
, Ann Arbor
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 916
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerowood
The best drill bits to use are 135 degree split tip in cobalt at around 3000 rpm, more expensive be last 10X longer.
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Many years ago, I found these for sale in solid carbide, double ended (I think at the EAA airshow back when it was still in Rockford, IL.) ... in a SHORT version - perhaps two inches long. They are terrific, if you can find them - because of their short length and hardness, they don't flex or wander at all, and they have lasted for literally decades and have drilled zillions of rivets and rivet holes. Also, because of their sharpness, and when used at highe speeds, they cut fast and clean. Chuck up one of these in a high speed air drill, and yer' ready to go!
Only drawback is that you need a diamond wheel to sharpen them. Then again, I've never needed to sharpen them!
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12-23-2011, 09:26 AM
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#74
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1 Rivet Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Wimberley
, Texas
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerowood
The rivets you posted a pictured of are AN455AD4-X (#30 drill) which are extremly hard to find anymore and replaced by MS20470AD5-X (#21 drill). Below is AC 43.13 that explains the numbers, Identifiers,alloys, etc
The best drill bits to use are 135 degree split tip in cobalt at around 3000 rpm, more expensive be last 10X longer.
I personally have never used one of those guide tools as they were not available when I started doing aircraft sheet metal way back in 1976
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Just a quick question. I went to the Airparts web site https://www.airpartsinc.com/shopexd.asp?id=189 . They show a ms20470ad4-x. Would that not be an 1/8th inch rivet/ #30 bit? I want to make sure I don't end up buying a 1000 incorect rivets.
Dan
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12-23-2011, 02:07 PM
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#75
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Rivet Master
1971 21' Globetrotter
Currently Looking...
Currently Looking...
Currently Looking...
Arvada
, Colorado
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 3,527
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Let me explain one other thing. AN455AD4-X rivets have a manufactured head of 5/16 diameter. In order to replace then with a MS20470AD rivet you will have to use a 5/32 rivet which has a manufactured head diameter of 5/16.
So if you want the diameter of the replacment rivets to match closely to the exisiting AN455AD4-X rivets, you will have to order MS20470AD5-X rivets.
Also check that Airparts rivets do not have as I call the, "Paragraph on the head", which is a bunch of lettering. I order all of my rivets from here
Genuine Aircraft Hardware Co.
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12-27-2011, 01:44 PM
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#76
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1 Rivet Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Wimberley
, Texas
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
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Thanks Aerowood!
You a truley a rivet master!
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03-22-2022, 08:48 AM
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#77
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2 Rivet Member
2017 19' International
Rosemere
, Quebec
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank's Trailer Works
It can.
I however, drill the original buck rivets with an 1/8 bit. That generally gets rid of the head and shaft. Not always though. The original rivets were 1/8" with the bigger head. We now use 5/32" with smaller heads. I then drill it with a #20. I try my best to drill once, straight in, then once straight out. I do not push the bit in and out as some do. That makes for a sloppy hole. So far this seems to work just fine (for me).
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Do You use a bit stopper? what model?
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