Olympic Rivets

[dblatner]

I need some help. So, last Friday I got a phone call from the dealership where my 2017 Classic 30 was being repaired and it was a call that ruined my day. While pulling my camper into the service bay they hit another camper with mine and damaged it. As you see by the photos it is not that bad. The dealership owned up to it and are taking care of all the repairs. Here is my concern. They want to replace the entire panel and use olympic rivets not the buck rivets. I hear good and bad about these but can not actually find the truth. It appears people are having problems is they are not installed properly. Do I trust the dealership to install them properly or do I try to find a paintless dent removal company and just live with the scratches? My thought is if the Olympic Rivets are so good why wouldn't Airstream use them over the Buck. I don't want to have future problems with leaks. Let me know your thought. Thanks

[richard5933]

To use buck rivets they have to have access to the interior side of all the rivets, and this involves stripping out the interior in that area. To me the added risk of problems from pulling the interior and pulling the inside skin far outweighs the possibility of leaking from using Olympic rivets. It just doesn't make sense to needlessly pull apart a perfectly good interior.

My understanding from reading on this forum is that even Jackson Center uses Olympic rivets if the job calls for them. When installed properly and with the proper sealants around the new panel, you should not have leaks.

[Boxite]

We had two curved back sections replaced on ours and the shop (A&P Vintage Trailers, an Airstream shop) used olympic rivets.

If you didn’t look closely with a magnifying glass you would not notice that olympics were used.

We have had THREE seriously HEAVY rain events while towing…one of them for over 4 hours in blinding rain…. Zero leaks.

The shop used proper sealant at the seams where the skins overlap (cannot be seen to be any different than any other seam done at original build by the factory).

I personally think people, usually people with little or no experience with rivet construction, worry excessively about leaks and strength of olympic rivets compared to “bucked” rivets.

A common rivet “works” when it’s “bucked” by it being flattened/spread until it completely fills the hole it is being placed into. This is accomplished by placing the rivet in the hole, and supporting it on the opposite side of the hole with a heavy bar of steel…called a “bucking-bar”…while the head of the rivet is struck repeatedly by a special air-hammer tool. The result is the rivet is shortened and expanded to fill the hole. (It’s basically just “mashed” to fill the void.)

An olympic or other “blind” rivet (so-called because it can be used in a hole in which the other (backside) of the hole is inaccessible and therefore cannot be “bucked”)…. a blind rivet has a central mandrel which is “pulled” thru the center…while the body of the rivet is held in-place… the mandrel expands the rivet-body firmly to fill the void…..the advantage being they can be installed without access from the back side.

There is a common rumor that blind rivets are not as strong as bucked rivets. This is NOT always true…. It may be true in what is commonly known as “pop rivets”…as they are a very lightweight design NOT intended for structural repairs. But “cherry-max” “huck” and others, (including olympics) are suitable for this type repair.

Some types of blind rivets are as strong as bucked rivets and some are even exceed the strength of common aluminum bucked rivets because they are made of harder alloy (they don’t have to be upset and expanded by hammering) … they have a hard mandrel which applies considerable expansion-pressure which exceed what soft rivets can achieve.

So, in my opinion, and in my personal experience, I would not discount Olympic rivets for Airstream repair.

Also, PDR was originally concieved for steel and does not always work well on aluminum. If it were my choice, I’d either accept a financial payment or store-credit in the amount similar to what it would cost retail to replace those panels…. OR ..I’d let the shop replace them using Olympic rivets.

Hope this helps.

[pcskier]

The factory repairs with Olympic rivets .I had a dealer replace a panel as well. Absolutely could not tell and never a problem.

[dznf0g]

I have had two factory repairs done with olympic rivets with no issues. In addition I have done some repairs and maintenance with Olympics with no issues.

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[Kevin245]

The street side wing window on our 76 Sovereign was long ago replaced using Olympic rivets. We owned the trailer for many years before we noticed. As such, I’d be good with them for a panel replacement.

[n2916s]

The main reason that Airstream (and, for that matter, aircraft manufacturers) use buck rivets vice Olympic rivets is cost. Individual buck rivets are much cheaper. If you watch a good buck riveting team in action, it is a quick and efficient process as well.

While Olympic riveting only requires a single technician, it is a two step process so there is no labor saving aspect.

I would have no problem having them on my rig.

[uraljohn]

We are scheduled to have 7 panels replaced due to hail damage. About 700 Olympic rivets will be needed. After talking to the repairing dealer, the Jackson Center Service Center and the Insurance Adjuster (very versed in Airstream repairs) we feel fine with using them for repair. The whole back end of the trailer interior would have to be removed to use buck rivets. Serious major surgery. Hopefully, all will go well and there will be no issues.

[Glenritas]

The entire lower street side from end cap to end cap was replaced sometime in the last 53 years with Olympic rivets and no leaks .

However the lower rear curb corner was replaced with Olympic rivets , and whoever did the work didn’t get the tail light assembly sealed to the panel and it leaked .
At a later date someone wrinkled the panel again .

When I got the trailer I had to replace the last 4 feet of the floor because of collision damage and poor repairs, the results of previous poor repairs .
While the interior was out I had a body shop hammer and dolly the crease out of the panel.
I Olympic riveted the inner brace back onto the panel and added stick on sound deadening to keep the panel from oil canning . I resealed the tail light housing and checked for leaks , found most of the rivets leaking . I replaced just about all of them with Olympic rivets . I put a bit of sealant under the head of the rivets before installing them the result no leaks since the repair back in 2013 . I borrowed an Olympic shaving tool and trimmed all the new rivets .

[Boxite]

Originally Posted by Glenritas

The entire lower street side from end cap to end cap was replaced sometime in the last 53 years with Olympic rivets and no leaks .

However the lower rear curb corner was replaced with Olympic rivets , and whoever did the work didn’t get the tail light assembly sealed to the panel and it leaked .
At a later date someone wrinkled the panel again .

When I got the trailer I had to replace the last 4 feet of the floor because of collision damage and poor repairs, the results of previous poor repairs .
While the interior was out I had a body shop hammer and dolly the crease out of the panel.
I Olympic riveted the inner brace back onto the panel and added stick on sound deadening to keep the panel from oil canning . I resealed the tail light housing and checked for leaks , found most of the rivets leaking . I replaced just about all of them with Olympic rivets . I put a bit of sealant under the head of the rivets before installing them the result no leaks since the repair back in 2013 . I borrowed an Olympic shaving tool and trimmed all the new rivets .

Trying to decipher your msg…. The leaking rivets were bucked rivets…which you replaced with olympics?

[Glenritas]

Boxite to clear this up the panel was replaced with Olympic rivets and later damaged , the repair wasn’t done very well and the tail light housing misinstalled and leaked also . I suspect the Olympic rivets were jarred when the panel was damaged later causing them to leak .

I think when using Olympic rivets a good practice is to put a small bead of sealant under the head of the rivet . Olympic also is available with an ‘O’ ring but over time they can split and leak .

[76streaker]

I used some Olympic rivets from VTS on my window on my Streamline. I wasn't that impressed by them. Looking at the picture I would settle for a cash payment for the damages and live with it. As it would likely be the best way to not have sealing issues. Cherry max was mentioned. Being in Army Aviation I know Cherry max are good. Not as pretty, but close as you can get to solids in my mind. Sucks being put in your position by them.

[dblatner]

Thank you everyone for your input. I feel at much better about having the panel replaced. The work will be completed by and Airstream dealer and I am sure I am not the first one they completed.

[franklyfrank]

Originally Posted by dblatner

I need some help. So, last Friday I got a phone call from the dealership where my 2017 Classic 30 was being repaired and it was a call that ruined my day. While pulling my camper into the service bay they hit another camper with mine and damaged it. As you see by the photos it is not that bad. The dealership owned up to it and are taking care of all the repairs. Here is my concern. They want to replace the entire panel and use olympic rivets not the buck rivets. I hear good and bad about these but can not actually find the truth. It appears people are having problems is they are not installed properly. Do I trust the dealership to install them properly or do I try to find a paintless dent removal company and just live with the scratches? My thought is if the Olympic Rivets are so good why wouldn't Airstream use them over the Buck. I don't want to have future problems with leaks. Let me know your thought. Thanks

This issue keeps coming up just like the frame separation.
I have the same Trailer exactly and had two panel replacements at JC using the Olympic rivets. No problem whatsoever.
I was given the option however as noted by others the last thing I wanted was the interior ripped apart just to have the original rivets installed.

[ethorntone]

We're in a similar situation in that we incurred hail damage to our trailer with an estimated 40K in repair to both top-end caps and the entire roof. Also had damage to the top side panel on the driver's side. The dealership sales/finance guy said I'd take a 16K depreciation for having the repairs as Airstreamers don't like Olympic rivets even if the repairs are good. Jackson Center confirmed their use of Olympic rivets too, so apparently we have no choice but to take the loss unless the insurance company totals the unit. I figure the repairs are about 55%-60% of the retail value of the unit and have been told the repair would have to be close to 95% of the value in order for them to total the unit. We're not happy about the loss, but hopefully if repaired she'll look fine.

[Boxite]

Originally Posted by ethorntone

We're in a similar situation in that we incurred hail damage to our trailer with an estimated 40K in repair to both top-end caps and the entire roof. Also had damage to the top side panel on the driver's side. The dealership sales/finance guy said I'd take a 16K depreciation for having the repairs as Airstreamers don't like Olympic rivets even if the repairs are good. Jackson Center confirmed their use of Olympic rivets too, so apparently we have no choice but to take the loss unless the insurance company totals the unit. I figure the repairs are about 55%-60% of the retail value of the unit and have been told the repair would have to be close to 95% of the value in order for them to total the unit. We're not happy about the loss, but hopefully if repaired she'll look fine.

Soooo…..is your insurance also going to reimburse you for the $16K loss-of-value…?? (If that were true…..and you can get the Airstream/dealer/finance-guy to put that in writing…you’ll have a good case for additional payment from your ins)……

….otherwise he’s full of himself.

[richard5933]

Depending on the state you're in, the insurance company might be obligated to reimburse you for diminished value.

I know there is case law in Wisconsin which supports this, and while it was a heavy lift I did collect for diminished value when my car was rear ended a few years ago.

Read your state laws and case law carefully and see if this works for you.

[ethorntone]

Originally Posted by Boxite

Soooo…..is your insurance also going to reimburse you for the $16K loss-of-value…?? (If that were true…..and you can get the Airstream/dealer/finance-guy to put that in writing…you’ll have a good case for additional payment from your ins)……

….otherwise he’s full of himself.

No, I checked our policy with the Insurance company. The sales guy is saying what they would deduct from a trade-in because of the use of olymipic rivets because Airstreamer's look down on olymipic rivet repairs and it would make it harder to sell the trailer. I don't see how, reading the comments here. It appears a well repaired unit may be hard to distinguish from a unit that hasn't had a repair.

[Eagle & Bear]

I had an opportunity to look at two recently salvaged Airstreams that had been involved in a "crash" significant enough to open large holes in the skins. Both less than 10 years old. Both carcasses had the interior skin peeled back so the ribs and inside of the exterior panels were visible. I could see where Airstream used double sided tape between the ribs and both the exterior and interior skins. It might be plausible to suggest that the tape is used to temporarily attach the skins to the ribs before the rivets were installed but the area I saw had only a few "Pop" rivets securing the interior skin to the ribs.

[Dingo Girl]

When I first got on this forum, more than a decade ago,Olympic rivets were only recommended for patches and such. NEVER for structural repairs.
I'm not sure what changed since the Olympic rivets have not changed.
I would NOT use them for a structural repair.
Maybe read some old Olympic posts.