brand new 2008 International with "glitches"

[TIMEMACHINE]

richg,

Sorry you have had so much bad luck with your Airstreams. I don't doubt for a minute that one can get a real bad example of a good product, and that sometimes is more a matter of luck than overall quality of a brand.

Although many of us on the forum have had problems with our new Airstream, most of us still are happy with our decision to buy. I think all would agree, in todays fast paced world, we just don't get as much for our moneys worth. And even though Airstream may suffer from some of the same value issues mechanically, the spirit and joy most of us get from owning and using our Airstream outways the challenge to have a perfect trailer.

So even if your particular situation has soured you beyond your threshold, others still believe "it makes me feel good", and that is what it is all about for them.

John

[AgZep]

Some of these things are very, very typical, and don't come from a "lack of quality control" at the factory. For example, the door issue. When we did our walk-through at the dealer, the door worked fine. The first time we took the trailer out, the door had to be slammed to close. But when we took the unit back to have these kinds of little issues cleared up, the door worked fine again. Good clue. Turns out the door works best when the trailer is levelled properly. Once we figured that out, we never had a problem again. Not an Airstream mistake.

The window seals need to be lubed periodically. You'll figure out how to do that easily. Once you get familiar with the working of the awning, that one will be fine as well. Our shower door leaked too, until we put a drop of silicone caulk at the end of the metal lip under the door.

Our water heater worked great during the dealer walk-through, but the first morning when we got up after hitting the road, it just clicked and wouldn't ignite. I got out the manual and started troubleshooting it. After a couple hours, I gave up and called the dealer. They had me try all kinds of things, like pulling wires, messing around with the switch, etc. Then an experienced guy walked into the dealer and overheard the mechanic talking to me. He suggested I rap it pretty good with a heavy tool. So I gave it a good clonk with an adjustable wrench, and it fired right up. Worked flawlessly ever since.

It's annoying that this stuff doesn't work smoothly the first time out, but some of these issues could only be remedied with solutions that would not be so reasonable over time. For instance, a harder seal material would keep the windows from sticking. It would also cause them to leak more as the trailer aged. The door could be fit a lttle looser, which would make it close easier in different orientations. But a looser fit would make it leakier and draftier too.

Keep working with the dealer until everything operates to your satisfaction. They are obligated to make sure every system works the way it should. In the long run, I'm sure you'll be very happy. At least we are, and we lived in ours for a year.

[Condoluminum]

Sharon-

Sorry to hear of troubles, but comments above about different dealers doing different jobs of inspection and bug fixing are true. Sometimes even a good dealer gets rushed or overwhelmed and fails to find things they should find...

Be aware there are several dealers and service shops near you in Vacaville.. The closest may not be the most competent...

I have had good luck with shop in Los Banos (v. Manteca or Martinez..) and it may be worth a slightly longer drive.. If they're in their new building, it has spaces with hookups for overnight stays on the lot...

[wasafari]

Check the gas line in the oven right next to where the pilot light is. The line may be cracked, which will allow a LARGE ammount of gas out and result in a very large ammount of flame when you light the pilot. Sorry to hear all your problems, I for one am not in the "it's the selling dealers responsibility" camp when it comes to delivering a good product. How bout building it right the first time?

[Poprivet]

I still maintain these issues are a quality problem with the factory and the dealer. Example - In the last 10 years I have bought four new cars and basically, they have performed flawlessly. Doors open and close, windows go up and down, all the options work as designed and a modern car is a far more complicated machine than a trailer you pull behind your car and a Airstream costs more than most cars. It took Demming and Japan to get cars where they are today and the same principles apply - zero defects. We now have 10 year, 100,000 miles warrenties on cars, you see that with a Airstream?

[K-stream]

Originally Posted by richg

I can tell you are a happy New Airstream owner. Welcome to the the on-going Airstream problems. When you buy a so called high quality product you expect minor problems. Guess what, this product is full of big problems for the last five years!!! It is a shame that a company with the reputation it has it turn out a product which is comparable to the low end trailers( which in some cases can have none of the problems we see with Airstream) I have own two Airstreams have have had nothing but problems with both of them. I would not recommend this trailer to any of my friends. This will be an issue on this forum( who are die hard Airstream fans) but lets face it. When you pay the dollar amount for a product it should be checked out at the dealership before they even think about turning it over to the buyer. Has this ever been done?
Sorry, but I am not a fan of the Airstream product or Wally like most of the post you read here. I am considering unloading this albratross and going back to my dream fifth wheel (Holiday Rambler) which I should of stayed with. Sorry to deflate your Airstream dream, but down the road you will agree with my comments.
Richg

Hey Rich,

If you are so unhappy with your unit...would you sell it really cheap???

I am looking for one!

K

[cosmotini]

Originally Posted by lovingtahoe

Well, we are diving in (just sold one of our AS's to make room) and ordering a new AS (2008 International Sig Series) today... has anyone else run into problems such as silversharon's? We love the floorplan as well as the new interiors but reading some of the "warranty" issues is a bit scary. Any thoughts? I read in this thread about the idea of camping overnight at the dealer's, sounds like a great idea to me. Any other sound advice?

We got our 2008 27' FB Signature Series CCD from Airstream of Arkansas on 6/5/07.

Before picking up the unit, I requested that a pressure test be done to check for leaks. None were found.

If your dealer can perform the pressure test, I'd recommend it. It just gave me peace-of-mind since this unit has more holes in the roof with the skylights and vista-view windows.

I stayed on their site overnight just to make sure everything worked. Gene Morris suggested staying 2 or 3 nights but we were pressed for time.

Took it to the Moraine View Rally the following weekend and it's at Carlyle Lake for 2 weeks as I write this.

So far, the only problem I have found is the sub-woofer makes a funny cat purring kind of sound only when playing a DVD. It's very low and erratic. Anyone have any ideas on this?

Our 2004 International CCD was fully but it had some poor finish work. Over the years, between taking it back to the factory and my own efforts, they were all resolved.

This trailer is a better built unit than our 2004 CCD. The fit and finish are much better.

Has anyone else noticed 2004 Airstreams seem to have a higher number of issues than other years? I personally think that's when the demand exceeded their ability to deliver quality units.

I'm sure that as we continue to use it, we'll find things that should have been done differently but as far as things working the way they should, we are very happy.

Also, until these things are built by robots on an automated assembly line, I expect SOME units with SOME amount of problems will ship from the factory. On the other hand, Airstream QC has lots of room for improvement if they're letting these units ship with the issues others have written about.

CAVEAT: The furnace. That's the ONLY appliance not yet tested.

Hey, it's 93 degrees here. The 15K Air conditioner works great!

[Tim A.]

Condoluminum's suggestion to Sharon to try the Los Banos dealer might be good advice. The Martinez dealer is new and their meager shop facilities were taken over from a previous RV business which was not involved with Airstreams. Our dealer in Sacramento had a moderately large service facility, but had never heard of a Hensley hitch when we took delivery. They did provide me with an extension cord so I could use my drill to install it in their back lot. We returned a couple of times to order parts, but that was like pulling teeth.

As for quality issues, I think we should all realize that our Airstreams are low-volume, hand-built products and not like automobiles produced in large computer-controlled, robotized factories. I have been able to fix myself all of the quality problems we have experienced with our Bambi. (And, I really like that carpenter's level which was left behind one cabinet at the factory!) Sharon's glitches, as so many others have indicated, can all be taken care of by a competent Airstream dealer's shop.

[AgZep]

Originally Posted by David Alan

I still maintain these issues are a quality problem with the factory and the dealer. Example - In the last 10 years I have bought four new cars and basically, they have performed flawlessly. Doors open and close, windows go up and down, all the options work as designed and a modern car is a far more complicated machine than a trailer you pull behind your car and a Airstream costs more than most cars. It took Demming and Japan to get cars where they are today and the same principles apply - zero defects. We now have 10 year, 100,000 miles warrenties on cars, you see that with a Airstream?

Airstreams are not cars, and they are not built like cars. They are hand assembled in very small numbers to a bewildering array of specifications. Although the frames and skins are metal, and thus have some promise of dimensional stability, most everything else is wood or some composite of mostly wood.

Take your typical board out and measure it closely. Haul it around in the back of a pickup for a year and then measure it again. It will not be the same size. Try moving it from a desert to a swamp and see if it stays straight.

Cars are built in comparatively enormous numbers from dimensionally stable materials. They are essentially a collection of parts, most of which change very little over a multi-year production run and are shared with many other models. Even Ferrari builds more cars than Airstream builds trailers in a give year, and they only have to make about four different models. The larger auto companies employ many multi-million dollar robots, something way beyond the scope of a company like Airstream.

I'm not saying Airstream shouldn't do a better job. But after visiting the factory a few times, I've become pretty surprised that they actually get the things out the door as cheaply as they do, with as few problems as they have. They join a steel frame to a (hand riveted) aluminum shell, then build a small apartment inside it (out of parts that have o be shoehorned in through a little door), then we drag the thing down the road and shake the heck out of it, and expose it to extreme environmental changes over a period of decades. Try that with your kitchen some time and see what you get.

[Poprivet]

Hey there AgZep - Your description of how Airstreams are built sound like how cars were built in the late '20's and '30's!.

I'm a Airstream fan! I have one and am very happy with it. The point I'm trying to "unsucessfully" make is that the problems new owners of new Airstreams are quality and materials related. The window sticking problem is an example of a materials related problem. The gasket is made out of the wrong material. BoatBoys mother was able to fix a leak in the toilet by tighting the water supply is an examle of a quality problem. The fitting didn't come loose, it was never tight. Most of the problems incountered are simple quality related problems. If Airstream wants to be considered the "gold standard" of the trailer manufactures then they should be just that and they are not going to improve unless the consumer demands it. It's the same with the dealers. Some are really excellent but more are just lousy as documented in this forum. It does not have to be this way. One reason the dealers have trouble is that they are absolutely swamped with these quality related problems. So much so that it might take 2 or 3 months to get an appointment.
So, I've had my say and I'll crawl back in my hole. Thank you, thank you every much.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by David Alan

Hey there AgZep - Your description of how Airstreams are built sound like how cars were built in the late '20's and '30's!.

I'm a Airstream fan! I have one and am very happy with it. The point I'm trying to "unsucessfully" make is that the problems new owners of new Airstreams are quality and materials related. The window sticking problem is an example of a materials related problem. The gasket is made out of the wrong material. BoatBoys mother was able to fix a leak in the toilet by tighting the water supply is an examle of a quality problem. The fitting didn't come loose, it was never tight. Most of the problems incountered are simple quality related problems. If Airstream wants to be considered the "gold standard" of the trailer manufactures then they should be just that and they are not going to improve unless the consumer demands it. It's the same with the dealers. Some are really excellent but more are just lousy as documented in this forum. It does not have to be this way. One reason the dealers have trouble is that they are absolutely swamped with these quality related problems. So much so that it might take 2 or 3 months to get an appointment.
So, I've had my say and I'll crawl back in my hole. Thank you, thank you every much.

David---I agree with you 100 percent !!! We own our 3rd AS, an 06 30'classic and although it has had few problems compared to the o4 and 05 we had, none of these we related to changes in material or towing road conditions,etc. Without exception every problem was because of poor quailty control and lack of concern for the person who buys the end product. It doesn't take rocket science to install tank monitors, and wall plugs "plumb and square", to put a tiny bit of sealant at shower door hinges, to "really" test for leaks and on and on. Not one of the problems we had occured due to use. When the person installing a componet walked away from it they "Knew" it wasn't done correctly!!! The problem we see are due to a production driven pay plan for the management of the company. That said::no I'm not interested in selling mine cheap, no I'm not going to trade for another brand, but yes I'm disappointed that company is not as loyal to it's customers as we are to them. Yes if we trade again it will probably be for another AS. As long as we continue to buy their product "as is" and as long as we make excuses for the why they are like they are I don't look for any significate change.----pieman

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by David Alan

The point I'm trying to "unsucessfully" make is that the problems new owners of new Airstreams are quality and materials related....

da

you made your point in the first post.
and there are dozens of threads...
dedicated JUST to the general topics of build issues, materials, 'they don't build'em like they used too...'
the misunderstanding of 'what is quality'...
and so on.

here we have a new buyer,
new to a/s
who spent a couple of hours at a dealer for a 60k$+ purchase...
before having the unit towed 2000 miles 2b a primary residence.
along with her short list of issues is the question...
"are these glitches normal or did i get a lemon?"

she needs some support that these issues are common.
that doesn't mean we ACCEPT the issues.
we get the issues fixed.
some do it themselves, others return to the selling dealer, while many need to visit a local shop/service center.
she has a warranty and needs to use it.

the issues she describes are not MAJOR by any measure...
each is easily repaired and hopefully, over time the unit will fit the owner,
there are no pending disasters, as in wheel separation, electrical meltdown and so on.

many of us are just trying to support a 2 time poster,
who may now think she's opened a huge can o worms...
with a few simple notes,

and not come back.

while i agree and disagree with every 1 of your points, there are plenty of ofhter threads for that endless discussion.

use the serach function and take the debate there....

"quality" in the forums requires some focus and effort too.

cheers
2air'

[Poprivet]

Oh what a wonderful day - I feel good - My Airstream is nice and shinny - Never mind those pesky little things that pop up now and then, just fix them as they seem to have become somewhat acceptable. I hear tell that a Rolls Royce is plagued with minor inconviences.

[BoatBoy]

I just bought an 07 Jeep Wrangler and you have to slam the door REALLY hard to get it to latch properly.

I made an appointment with my dealer to take my AS in for its post delivery "adjustments".

[Relentless]

We have about 3,000 miles on our 2007. We used a credit card the first time, from the outside, to open all the windows. Since then, no problem. The door needs to be slammed hard to get the dead bolt to engage from the inside. We can press on the door from the outside and the dead bolt will engage without slamming. Go figure. Not important enough to worry about.

A water line connection behind the toilet loosened. Smal leak. Repair guy pulled the toilet and tightened the fitting. No problem since. Cost Airstream $45 under warrenty. Had to read and re-read the instructions on the awning the first one or two times. Needs some Silicone.

That's it. Really happy with the quality.

John

[Streamer1]

Good perspective AgZep.

[TBRich]

Sharon...we, too, had a few minor issues with our new 2006 Bambi...bought early in 2007 after it had sat on the dealer lot for most of a year, probably, the Tucson heat (that in itself would cause many other brands of TT to just melt).

Of course, the issues were disconcerting because we all want perfection with a new AS, but they were minor in the overall scenario of owning an RV, and the dealer (Oasis RV Center in Tucson, specializing in AS...some of you know them) has been very good about seeing that everything is working as it should...and making sure we are happy, and bing willing to answer any questions we might have as our journey progresses. We owed an SOB motor home before the AS and I can tell you, the quality of AS far exceeds our experience with the earlier moho...talk about poor construcntion, etc.

A tech said something to me early on in our experience with the moho... "There will always be things that need to be dealt with—you have to remember that you are taking this big thing on the road for miles and miles and things will work their way loose, come unscrewed, detach, and fall off just becasue of the constant motion." I don't think he was making excuses..it's just a fact of physics...and it's something I've tried to remember.

So, Sharon, enjoy your new beauty...and certainly don't be afraid to insist that the issues be dealt with by someone who knows what they are doing...but don't let the small things overshadow the joy off owning an AS.

Happy Triaisl to you!
TB

[Silvertwinkie]

I would like to suggest that any person that has a 2008 unit please post both the good stuff and areas needing improvement here to this general thread:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f142...ity-31210.html


There are threads for as far back as 2004 and there will be a 2009 and beyond moving forward.

One comment on the recent posts I'd like to make here is that there are hand built cars, even the engines that have fewer defects than our hand built Airstreams......One would be the Buick Reatta, another car where the engine is hand built is the Z06 Corvettes, which I agree are FAR more complicated to build than an RV.....so the statement that these Airstreams are hand built isn't IMHO a blank get out of jail free card for the folks at Jackson Center. Airstream use to have a lifetime warranty, I think for such a premium product, at least 5 years should be the norm, not the same warranty you can get on an SOB (even not made by a Thor owned company). I think that they are improving, but IMHO, quality isn't a destination, it's a mind set and from what I've seen that mindset has not tricked down to the production floor people in a lot of cases, but then again, how can you blame them? If what I've been hearing is correct, they get bonuses for making quotas, if that's true, it's in direct opposition to building a quality product. A good example of this is the leaking shower stalls. Looking at the QC threads, one can clearly see it's been an issue for at least 4 model years, maybe more and I know that the factory not only reads these threads, but they also have warranty work that backs up there is an issue, yet if you read the QC thread for another 2008 owned by forum member Cosmotini, it too still has the dreaded shower leak, why? Well in his case there was NO caulk! Again, Quality is a mindset, not a destination. They should hire one of us to QC the trailers.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by Pop Rivet

I still maintain these issues are a quality problem with the factory and the dealer. Example - In the last 10 years I have bought four new cars and basically, they have performed flawlessly. Doors open and close, windows go up and down, all the options work as designed and a modern car is a far more complicated machine than a trailer you pull behind your car and a Airstream costs more than most cars. It took Demming and Japan to get cars where they are today and the same principles apply - zero defects. We now have 10 year, 100,000 miles warrenties on cars, you see that with a Airstream?

Couldn't agree more!! I've been in the auto service biz for over 35yrs and done my share of PDI's and the number of problems noted in no way compare in volume to what we have been putting up with in our A/S's over these last few years. QUALITY CONTROL AT THE FACTORY and at the dealer level! Granted A/S can't be held totally responsible for component failures they outsource, but I will still hold there feet to the fire for a lousy installation of even a faulty component. They didn't make the rattling speaker's for our sound system, but they are responsible for the mount screws that missed the mark. If someone at the factory had tried to open the under sink access door in the bathroom, the dealer wouldn't have had to tell me not to "worry" it's only there so you can get to the plumbing. And guess what, we had to get to the plumbing. If the factory had tested the shower, the fact that the cold water supply line was too short and leaked at the elbow on the distribution valve when the shower head was turned off to conserve water. Or how about testing the rain sensor's on the roof vent's, how many dealers do you think check that one out, not really a bad vent just a glob of sealent on the sensor. A/S doesn't make the roof shroud for the a/c, but they are responsible for the cracks around all the mount screws, noticed when we we were on the roof checking the vent. Both of these concerns probably known only to the persons who installed them.
We understand that all things made by humans are not perfect, but please give us a break, I think Wally would really be PO'ed!


If you haven't been anywhere, it's hard to make a comeback!

[rss_ty]

Well, beginning to think Airstream isn't quite as concerned with quality as many of us were led to believe. I purchased a 19' Ocean Breeze. At the time of delivery, the bottom drawer had completely dissembled. The dealer fixed that. Subsequently a rivet from door frame came out. Same problem with door as descriped in earlier post; screen door appears to be misaligned, door has to be slammed to shut. Can't adjust beyond the door post; screws in door itself unmovable except for the stripped one from the factory. At least three rivets from interior aluminum panel above TV cabinet have popped out. The TV cabinet itself swiveled out and pulled facing piece out. I fixed that by buying a step panel with 1" dimensions and screwing it down between the bed and TV cabinets. The floor has a sqeak that needs to be remedied. The water gauge shows empty with a full tank of water. Cheap material of cabinets doesn't appear to be very durable. Thought I was getting real plywood until the facing strip came loose near the sink. Ironed that back on.

Not quite sure why Airstream can't produce a quality product. Tow vehicle is a Toyota Tacoma nearly a year old and 15K miles. American produced in California, yet absolutely nothing wrong with that more complex vehicle.
Very satisfied with it, yet the trailer leaves a lot to be desired.

Sort of death knell for any more American branded, American produced products as far as I am concerned.