Wiring 50 Amp Receptacle

[Spaggs]

I have a couple of questions about this box.
Sorry for the two pics, but I can’t figure out how to remove one.
The bus bar to the left seems like the only place to attach the ground and neutral wires. Is this where I should attach both?
The space to the left and next to the three 20 Amp switches is where I was planning on placing the 50 Amp double switch. What do I do about this?
Thanks for any help you can provide.

[waninae39]

if you are not sure, don't know electricity well, please leave it to a certified electrician.

is making a mistake , worth a potential life affecting incident?

[ITSNO60]

Yes, the grounds and neutrals both go on the same bus on that service entrance, is that a mobile home pedestal or an exterior disconnect (meter/main) for your house? I see a space for a two pole mounted upside down over the two single poles that are in there now. (Keep in mind upside down breakers are no longer allowed by code). There is no way you can mount a breaker to the left as you planned. What does the deadfront look like?
By design that service equipment allows for six disconnects maximum by code, keep in mind that the main bus is always energized unless the meter is pulled. Switching off the 200 amp breaker will not de-energize the bus! It will only de-energize the mobile/manufactured home (or your stick and bricks sub panel or barn if that is what you have), while the bus and stabs and those two main lugs to the left will remain energized!

[ITSNO60]

Looking at the 200 amp feed wires exiting the rear of the enclosure with fire putty around them I'll guess this is a meter/main on the exterior of your house back to back with your sub panel?

[Spaggs]

Originally Posted by ITSNO60

Looking at the 200 amp feed wires exiting the rear of the enclosure with fire putty around them I'll guess this is a meter/main on the exterior of your house back to back with your sub panel?

Thanks guys for the input.
Yes, that is correct. It’s on the outside of my garage and is where my meter ties in.
So, can this be used at all or do I need to install a separate panel?

[ITSNO60]

Originally Posted by Spaggs

Thanks guys for the input.
Yes, that is correct. It’s on the outside of my garage and is where my meter ties in.
So, can this be used at all or do I need to install a separate panel?

It will work using the top right space, just realize that mounting the breaker upside down violates current code so that is kind of a gray area. Also be extremely careful especially with the bare ground wire as making contact with any of the aforementioned live parts could be deadly at worst or cause damage at the least. It is not recommended to work that panel live, especially for a novice. Technically one would obtain a permit and have the power company come and pull the meter, then perform the work, get inspected and have POCO replace meter. That being said, most electricians, including myself, would not have a problem working that panel live. Depending on your POCO, they may be willing to pull and replace the meter without requiring a permit but in most areas they are going to want a permit and a successful inspection before re-connecting.
You also have a violation where there are grounding conductors and neutral conductors under the same screw. It is OK to have 2 ground wires (of the same size) under a single screw but neutral conductors are not to be doubled up with any other conductors, not even with other neutral conductors.

[10Smiles]

Originally Posted by ITSNO60

It will work using the top right space, just realize that mounting the breaker upside down violates current code so that is kind of a gray area. Also be extremely careful especially with the bare ground wire as making contact with any of the aforementioned live parts could be deadly at worst or cause damage at the least. It is not recommended to work that panel live, especially for a novice. Technically one would obtain a permit and have the power company come and pull the meter, then perform the work, get inspected and have POCO replace meter. That being said, most electricians, including myself, would not have a problem working that panel live. Depending on your POCO, they may be willing to pull and replace the meter without requiring a permit but in most areas they are going to want a permit and a successful inspection before re-connecting.
You also have a violation where there are grounding conductors and neutral conductors under the same screw. It is OK to have 2 ground wires (of the same size) under a single screw but neutral conductors are not to be doubled up with any other conductors, not even with other neutral conductors.

All good information. It's always nice to hear from the professionals.

[Spaggs]

Looks like I’ll be calling an Electrician.
Thanks for all of your help. At the very least, my wife can now breath easy.

[ITSNO60]

Originally Posted by Spaggs

Looks like I’ll be calling an Electrician.
Thanks for all of your help. At the very least, my wife can now breath easy.

You also have a minor issue with that twin breaker, it is a non-ctl breaker and is not supposed to be installed in a ctl panel like yours, but the only way to eliminate it is to replace it with 2 full size breakers but then you lose one of the top spaces. Or you could just replace it with one single pole and pigtail two loads together into 1 breaker. The other issue with the non-ctl is that it may not have a high enough interrupt rating to be suitable for service use, I can't read the label. Breakers used as a service disconnect must have enough of an interrupt rating so in the event of a bolted short they will open instead of jamming or exploding. Being directly connected to the incoming conductors it has a lot of available fault current, in a main breaker panel it would be protected by the main but in yours it is not so it needs to have an interrupt rating high enough for service use which is normally around 22K. Our POCO requires 22K for residential unless you have an available fault current study done by an engineer which is cost prohibitive. Basically the closer you are to the transformer the more available fault current you have.

I only bring this up in the unlikely event that your electrician mentions it, or even notices it.

[ITSNO60]

Well I just noticed the 200 is only 10K so the twin is probably 10K as well, if the POCO was good with that no worries.

[Spaggs]

Electrician just put this in for me.
Both A/C units/heat pumps work. Hughes Autoformer has all green lights, but the power cord blue light(s) do not light up. I can’t remember if there are two or one blue light(s).
When we have plugged into a campground, even with the converter not working, there were blue light(s) on top of the power cord where it plugs into the TT.
I don’t know if this a deal or not. Can someone enlighten me?
Thanks.