Why bother?

[callmedave]

Before I go and spend several hundred dollars to replace the factory-installed Parallax charger/converter and add surge protection, I’d like to hear from folks who have actually cooked their batteries because of the Parallax device(which, as I understand it, are single-stage).

I’d also like hear from those who have had their trailer electronics cooked due to “bad” service at campgrounds, or from lightening strikes.
Or alternatively, actually know someone who did.

Do these things really happen or are they speculation and rumor? Aren’t such events rare? Are the stories one hears and reads about merely anecdotal?

The discussions on the forums I’ve seen seem to be about solutions for problems that rarely occur. There’s a rationale about how bad events could be so we might as well drop the $$$ now.
However, Airstream seems “content” with the Parallax units, suggesting they’ve not faced many, or any, claims.

Adding surge protection and upgrading the charger/converter could quickly get to $500, even more if you have to pay someone to do the work.

A number of friends we camp with have never done either of these things.

If these events rarely happen, why not make an insurance claim, if or when?
We have to have insurance anyway…
What am I missing?

Thanks in advance
Dave

[A W Warn]

Whether your battery gets cooked or not depends on you. If you maintain a proper electrolyte level in your trailer's batteries, then they will not boil dry and die. The constant ~13.6 volt charge does not harm the battery as long as the water does not evaporate.

I did not change the Parallax in my Safari until the voltage started going too high. Before that, when I plugged in full time while at home, I would occasionally use a timer where the converter plugs in. This was to limit charge to about one hour per day while in storage.

In my Excella I got a power surge (I assume lightning) that burned out the AC/Heat pump, the converter, several lights, and two batteries. Yes, it happens.

I've seen reverse polarity at a few campgrounds. Maintenance people are not always electricians.

ps: When these issues happen, it is hard to prove the cause to the insurance company. And, in my case, the deductible was more than the cost of the damage.

[SeaLevel]

Originally Posted by callmedave

If these events rarely happen, why not make an insurance claim, if or when?
We have to have insurance anyway…
What am I missing?

Thanks in advance
Dave

It doesn't sound like you're missing much. I think some of it depends on how you camp and where you camp, and as mentioned, how well you maintain your batteries. We've only had our AS for a little over two years, but we've never run into bad power. Just lucky?

On the insurance thing, I'd rather not have the trailer or appliances be damaged by bad power or lightning, and be without the trailer while waiting for repairs.

[ROBERT CROSS]

....Airstream=$$$$$, TV=$$$$$, Stuff=$$$$$

Why scrimp on the small stuff?
We went 5 Seasons before a brownout, the EMS PT-30c shut down the line, how much $$$$ did it save, who knows, it did what it was designed to do.

I got rid of the P-Lax after it took a dump and ruined the second set of Iinterstates. (first set damaged on the dealers lot, 24/7 plugged in)

IOTA DLS 30a IQ4 and 2 100ah Lifeline AGM's, 11yrs & counting.

Bob

[rmkrum]

Surge protection/voltage monitoring devices protect you from situations that can, in the extreme, result in total destruction of your AS electrical system and 110 volt appliances. At minimum, some of these systems detect and block under and over voltages.

Miswired/defective power connections are not that uncommon. Surges are easily generated in the vicinity of lightning, bad grounds, and sloppy RV park wiring.

Yeah, insurance may rebuild/replace, but personally, I'd rather stop the problem before the damage occurs, and I'm out MONTHS getting the insurance to pay and replace the damaged bits.

We managed to damage an Air Conditioner compressor beyond repair because of low campground voltage for an extended period. Yeah, the insurance finally replaced the unit, but it took quite some time to get the claim accepted, and out here in the heat, the AS was useless until the A/C was replaced. A decent EMS/surge protector would have shut the system down before it could be damaged by low voltage. They also prevent high voltage event damage, like plugging in to a miswired connection that gives 220 volt to a 110 volt connection. Last time that happened, the victim spent about 10 grand to fix the resultant mess.

I can also address the cheapo Parallax converter issue. Our OEM (POS single output voltage) convertor has fried our batteries twice because of undetected overcharging. The replacement converter will cost me less than the two sets of batteries that needed replacing, and will extend their life. I'm spending the money to do it right. Airstream has apparently seen the light on this issue, and upgraded their OEM converters on recent models.

Your choice--you can prevent an issue at the front end, or pay with lots MORE $$ and time in the aftermath...

[AirMiles]

SeaLevel is right that "it depends". But here is my story. Were my batteries cooked?

Even though we tried to maintain our original batteries, they bit the dust after only 10 months. Miles never sat for more than 30 days without being plugged in for multiple days and the batteries were less than 1 month old when we purchased Miles. The store switch was always used intelligently. Miles was used nearly 100 out of his first 300 days. Sitting around with dying batteries was not the cause of the problem. The battery water level was checked frequently and the plates were never exposed. We believe the cause was due to having low-amp-hour batteries with a low-cost power converter.

At 10 months, I could not store my Airstream (Miles) for over two weeks (in "store" mode) without the batteries dropping into the mid-11V range. At two weeks, it had barely enough charge left to operate the tongue jack. After charging the batteries for a full 24 hours, a hydrometer indicated nearly all dead cells. I decided to use my "under warranty" 10-month old batteries for the core charge on new set of EGC12 Golf Cart batteries. I also installed a blade cut-off switch and replaced my converter. I believe these changes will improve my battery situation.

There are two reasons for replacing my converter. First, I do believe it damaged my original batteries as it constantly operated at 13.6V and second to get the ability to charge my battery quickly with my generator with a 14.4V Boost mode.

So again, was my battery cooked? I don't know but I replaced it. Was my converter the cause? I don't know but I replaced it. I also use a surge protector when hooked up to shore power. It has tripped a few times and I've also experienced reverse polarity at a campground on the 30 amp connection and therefore used the 50 amp connector. I use a tester on every post before I hook up in addition to using a surge protector.

Here is a picture of my replacement batteries, blade switch and modified battery box to work with this setup. http://www.airforums.com/forums/f42/...ml#post2079369 This link also describes the solar addition I will get this summer for boondocking.

Again, the battery system you need depends how you use your Airstream. Those who always stay connected will have different requirements that those who boondock, charge with solar or a generator, or have storage without power. Your experience my be different than mine but I thought I'd share my story.

[PKI]

What kills batteries is running them down below 50% charge (12.2 volts).

The boiling issue is valid, but unlikely if you have a constant load on the converter while charging and do not charge for an extended period of time. It is key to check water level weekly. We used a similar system on a boat with little difficulty, but care is required.

Having said all that - we replaced the converter. It's an improvement over the unit that was installed by AS. Not expensive if you do it yourself.

A battery monitor is a good idea and worth the investment. It is not mandatory, but really nice to have.

A battery disconnect is very important if you store your trailer for extended periods and do not have the capability to periodically charge the bank.

Spend some time with the search function. Lots of good information. Not difficult to understand, but lots of confusion. Best to not be confused. Pat

[PKI]

The surge protector is a different story. My service tech said he would appreciate it if I purchased one so he would not have to repair the electronics. We have never experienced a surge, so maybe a false expenditure. However, I have always used one. It just seems prudent. Probably also a good idea to unplug the coach from shore power in a lightening storm. Pat

[SilverHouseDreams]

Worst case electrical wiring is a hot ground, which is rare...but does happen when well intended people take on electrical wiring that they know nothing about. Even a reverse polarity is dangerous, however a hot ground could be absolutely fatal as your entire shiny shell is now electrified looking for a path to ground...which is you when you grab the door latch or the handle on your way in. Will insurance cover that? Do you care when you aren't here to see if they do?

While hot ground is pretty rare, I have seen it (not in RV parks, but in office buildings and residential wiring)...but in an RV park an "open ground" and reverse polarity can quickly become a hot ground with a badly wired neighbor plugging in, or someone using a "generator adapter" dog bone that connects neutral to ground.

[GMFL]

I cooked one of my two interstate batteries while on a trip. Forced to disconnect one of the 12volt batteries and run on on till I could get new ones.

[perryg114]

More like $100 and you can use your old one as a spare. You don't have to buy these things from the dealer.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Perry

[ROBERT CROSS]

100 bucks, sure we ain't spending too much?

Bob

[TheGreatleys]

My EMS routinely shuts off our power before we trip the breaker at my in-laws. We're plugged in to a 15A outlet and run a small space heater when visiting in the Winter. If MIL uses the hair dryer when the space heater is on, EMS senses the voltage drop and switches us off. Saves me having to go reset the breaker.

Doesn't need to save you from a catastrophic event to be useful.

[ShinyPete]

Dave-

I say yes to both upgrades, as I both ruined batteries with the 1-stage converter, and have experienced (twice) cooking electronics and stuff without an EMS/surge suppressor.

Our first set of batteries was "cooked/low voltaged to death/whatever" within about 18 months on our 27fb. Our pole barn has a 30 amp RV plug, and so I leave our "Pete" plugged in 24x7, as I have 3 previous RVs over 18+ years. I thought I would be "smart" and remember to turn on/off the battery disconnect switch inside the entry door regularly, thereby turning off the constant charge voltage.......... Yeah, that didn't work, I forgot to turn it back on too many times, and killed the batteries anyway. So, I swapped out the power center insert with a 3 stage from Best Converters, and done. The 2nd set of batteries is still going strong, almost 3 years later. So yes, do this one. Airstream finally listened, and apparently now put multi-stage chargers in the new coaches.

One the EMS/surge protector, yeah, do this too. I plugged our motorhome into a mis-wired "30 amp RV plug" at our local fair grounds years ago in a hurry to setup for an event, and cooked pretty much every 12v control board-both A/Cs, fridge, water heater, fried both TVs, the $3000 3000 watt inverter using 6 6-volt batteries, and a bunch of other stuff. Cost a mint to repair. For the 2nd go-round, 2 years into Airstream ownership, I took a nasty lightning strike near the buried power cable to the pole barn, and fried nearly the same stuff in the Airstream. Oh, and the "plug-in" EMS for Pete was conveniently stored in the compartment instead of being plugged in. (I documented this event on AF somewhere....) So, yes do this one too.

I now have a 30 Amp Hardwired Surge Guard installed in Pete, so I can't forget. Experienced both, glad to have upgraded both, and could have saved money if I had done both first. Oh well.

Hope this helps.

[rmkrum]

Ouch!

[callmedave]

Many thanks for the replies - exactly what I was hoping for - so, stuff really does happen.
Several stories struck a cord…
For almost two years I attributed our battery problems to my lack of understanding how to properly care for them as well as how much use to expect from them.
The factory installed Interstate grp 24s never seemed to last as long as those of folks on the forum.
At some point I read comments suggesting that if those batteries hadn't been maintained from the time the trailer left Jackson Ctr. until the time we drove off the lot (~3-4 mos) they could have been damaged.
By then I figured it was too late to complain to JC so I replaced them with "wet" grp 29s.

And then we headed for Newfoundland for 2 ½ mos. BUT, we still had trouble with the new ones lasting much more than 24 hrs between charging. We dry camped a lot and had to use the furnace, but very sparingly. We used candles and lanterns for light, used the cg showers, etc and still couldn't make them last.

So there we were in NL when the warranty expired. Airstream would do nothing for us - I was lead to believe I was doing something wrong.
Last spring, I did some research on how to improve our situation, especially so that we could dry camp for longer periods. We ended up having our dealer upgrade our batteries to Lifeline grp 31s and add solar.
It did not occur to me that the charger/converter could have been the culprit and neither the dealer nor JC suggested that possibility.

At this point, we're gonna just keep going forward - which leads me to thinking about replacing the Parallax cc and adding EMS.
I appreciate the comments about leaving it (or not) up to my insurance co. and waiting for a resolution.

I'm encouraged by the replies that this work is not a wasted investment.
Many thanks,
Dave

[rmkrum]

That is the power of the forums here. Many experienced folks willing to discuss whatever happened with their Airstream, and a general willingness to be helpful (and opinionated as well[emoji3]”guilty as charged, your honor...”)