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Old 08-18-2019, 09:58 PM   #21
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Thanks a bunch to everyone for their help.

George
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Old 08-18-2019, 11:01 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waninae39 View Post

I was at this site before which is why I asked the question about a wiring diagram. I can't find anything in these manuals showing a wiring diagram. Maybe I'm missing something?
Thanks anyway.


George
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Old 08-18-2019, 11:04 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by TRIPPPIN View Post
I have a EB 25FB 30A and installed it near the panel under the bed. There is a perfect spot for it. My main reason for that is so I can protect all power inputs from the front or rear exterior connections before the transfer switch. Here are the pics. I also mounted it with rubber insulators to reduce the humm sound that sometimes is evident. I ran the external monitor panel to the front door near the store switch.

Thanks. This helps a lot. Wondering if you also have a shot looking down where the converter is? Is the orange wire taken from the Transfer switch, through the EMS and back to the transfer switch?
Thanks
George
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Old 08-19-2019, 09:06 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gandttimes View Post
Thanks. This helps a lot. Wondering if you also have a shot looking down where the converter is? Is the orange wire taken from the Transfer switch, through the EMS and back to the transfer switch?
Thanks
George
Take the output from the transfer switch that went to the panel and put it into the EMS. Then output from EMS to the panel.
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Old 08-19-2019, 09:08 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gandttimes View Post
I like this spot, thanks verdana. I'll have to stash my Scotch somewhere else though
Who is verdana?
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Old 08-19-2019, 09:54 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRIPPPIN View Post
Take the output from the transfer switch that went to the panel and put it into the EMS. Then output from EMS to the panel.
Perfect. Thanks much. G
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Old 08-19-2019, 09:57 AM   #27
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Who is verdana?
Verdana is what you type when you are not paying attention to names and copy the first thing you see that looks like a strange airstream name. Also called a Whoops!
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Old 08-19-2019, 12:48 PM   #28
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I installed a Progressive EMS HW-50C in our '17 25'FCFB a little over a year ago. It's pretty simple, really, but 1) have a fan connected to a plug and extension cord from your house in there (you'll get warm!) and 2) if you don't have one, buy or borrow a wire stripper that can handle either #6 or #8 stranded wire, depending on what your breaker panel uses. Prior to removal of any wires inside the breaker box, take several pictures for later reference; they'll come in handy if you have any questions.

Our FC has the two AC's, so I purchased 3' of 6/3 with ground wire. More about this in a moment. Disconnect the power to your FC and open your breaker box. Remove the 1/4" hex screws holding the inside panel in place and you'll find either a black and white wire + uninsulated ground wire (30A service) or a black, red and white wire (50A)also with an uninsulated ground wire.

Remove each wire from the 'main' breaker they're connected to as well as the bus bar connections. There's a clamp on the back of the breaker panel that secures this and other wires; open this clamp a bit by unscrewing the screws holding the two halves together and fish the wire out of the breaker box. This wire will go into the 'in' side of the EMS box with each conductor attaching to the connections on the relay inside. Take your time here--the wire's stiff and you'll want to finesse each conductor to its connection and Progressive gives you some really good, step-by-step instructions.

Now pare back the insulation on the wire you purchased per Progressive's instruction sheet and feed these through the other side of the EMS unit, attaching them to the relay as you did on the above wire. BTW--Progressive gives you a really nice set of instructions with the unit, plus, you can access them online to better determine if you want to do this yourself. You'll find that it's not as difficult as you might have thought!

Tighten the wire clamps on the EMS unit gently and you're almost done! Now feed the other end of that last wire back through the rear of your breaker panel; pare the conductors as you'd observed them prior to removal and reinstall to the main breaker and bus bars.

There's a little 'pendant', a digital readout with a slide switch that came with your unit. Progressive give you plenty of wire to connect this with, sort of a phone jack type connector--and I routed this out of the breaker box, through the maze of panels under the bed and out through a seam near the cabinet where the water heater's located. I stuck mine near the bottom of the cabinet as the readout's sort of bright but you may not mind. And you may want to try several locations before you decide on a permanent location for it.

Recheck your connections per the instruction sheet and your photos and congratulate yourself for saving a LOT of $$ having the dealer install it. Chances are you can do a better job yourself! Finally, mount the EMS unit to a panel in the breaker box area and install the EMS unit's cover with the screws provided.

BTW--when I installed mine, the voltages on L1 and L2 (per the display) were slightly different. Since I was connected to a regular 20A circuit with an adapter to the 50A plug, they should have been exactly the same. Called Progressive and the tech there informed me of two, multiple-turn potentiometers on the circuit board that had small adjusting screws. Screwdriver in hand, I tweaked each to match the line current my Fluke meter read and since then, have not had to readjust either. Props to the Progressive techs!

It's a great project and you'll have a safer, better alternative to a portable EMS system. Good luc
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Old 08-19-2019, 06:32 PM   #29
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Thanks all. Great pictures Tripppin and explanations emelaich01.

George
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Old 08-20-2019, 05:36 PM   #30
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Gandtimes - thanks again for kicking off this thread.

tripppin - Iím going with the location you suggested under the Queen. Close to the distribution box and easy to access. Thanks

Now on to the wiring.

Wes
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Old 08-25-2019, 10:30 AM   #31
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Cool

I installed the 50 amp version on our 25FBT. Install was really straight forward as others have indicated. I chose to put mine next to the furnace under the pull out bed. This is because these units have an actively energized relay inside that makes noise and I didnít want that under my bed. FWIW I am more sensitive to these kinds of noises than my wife.

There is a perfect large space for the unit in between the wheel well and the furnace. There was even a long loop of 6/3 from the factory in this area that made it a simple splice and wire job with no extra cable required. I have my remote display inside the cabinet next to the furnace air intake.
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Old 08-25-2019, 12:22 PM   #32
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mtbackpacker.
One question. With your placement, does it not negate the transfer switch from working with the front auxiliary plug in?
Maybe I don't totally understand the function of the transfer switch.
It does however seem like an easier place to put the EMS.with the extra wiring not needed.
Please correct me if I am wrong.
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Old 08-25-2019, 09:07 PM   #33
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I attended a seminar put on by Mike Sokol in which he gave a few recommendations that are appropriate to this thread.


First, it is his opinion that while Progressive historically was the best EMS manufacturer, after the original owners sold the business 2 years ago, the product development has bee put on the back burner. He now thinks Southwire Surge Guard produces the best EMS units.


Also, he suggested a setup design:
Power Pedestal -> inexpensive vanilla surge protector (not an ems) -> umbilical -> internal hard wire EMS -> trailer. Reason for this - manufacturers are stopping warranty replacement of the surge portion of an EMS, so it is possible that the first surge protector may absorb a big surge and leave the EMS unaffected...
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Old 08-25-2019, 09:34 PM   #34
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Devil is always in the facts. What manufacturer's are stopping warranty replacement of the surge portion? Both primary players, SouthWire and Progressive warranties have nearly identical verbiage about exclusions which include lightning strikes. Power surges for warranty are not mentioned. But Southwire is a 1 year warranty and Progressive is Lifetime. Number one failure of external units is shorting of the connector for the RV power cable. When that happened with my Progressive PT50 they had a very reasonable exchange price and I got the latest unit available. This on a PT50 that was about 30 months old at the time.

With the updates in the Progressive line in the past couple of years I'm not sure what product development would be needed for some period of time.
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Old 08-25-2019, 09:58 PM   #35
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Just bought a Southwire because they are now advertising a lifetime warranty.
I had sent them an old 4 or 5 year old surge protector that would not let the power pass through with all green lights. They replaced it for free.. Now I have one to travel and one on my home pedestal.
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Old 08-25-2019, 11:53 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gandttimes View Post
mtbackpacker.
One question. With your placement, does it not negate the transfer switch from working with the front auxiliary plug in?
Maybe I don't totally understand the function of the transfer switch.
It does however seem like an easier place to put the EMS.with the extra wiring not needed.
Please correct me if I am wrong.
As I have the 50 amp model I do not have a front auxiliary plug unfortunately.
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Old 08-26-2019, 01:23 AM   #37
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Devil is always in the facts. What manufacturer's are stopping warranty replacement of the surge portion?
Mike stated that Southwire has come up with some new patented or patent pending features that he thought were valuable, and he initially didn't think were possible. He talked to the engineers and, under non-disclosure, learned how they were doing it... I didn't get a full understanding of what the features are. I did see that their external units have the ability to detect abnormal heat at the power pedestal connection.

My understanding on the warranty issue. Surge protection is provided by MOVs. MOVs are sacrificial - each time they contain a surge, they die a bit. Say a unit is rated for 1,000 joules. If a 100 joule surge occurs, afterwards, the unit will have a capacicity of 900 joules. Once it has consumed 1000 joules, either in one surge or multiple small ones, the surge suppression feature no longer functions and the MOVs need to be replaced. I equate it to tires - you aren't going to find unlimited mileage warranties on them.
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Old 08-27-2019, 07:40 AM   #38
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If a surge protector like the EMS30 is limited in its life due to surges is the same true for low voltage or bad ground. The main use of my surge protector is to cut power due to low voltage or bad ground. Do I need to replace my surge protector at any point if I never experience a surge and only low voltage cut offs?
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Old 08-27-2019, 08:36 AM   #39
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Thus the need to put an internal surge suppressor where it is easy to replace. Murphy's Law says it will fail at the most inconvenient time when access would be the most difficult.

Our 50 amp EMS unit from Progressive Industries has a steel loop around the power cord with a hole for a padlock and chain of whatever thickness the user wants. A thief will go to one that is much easier to steel without making any noise.....
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Old 08-27-2019, 05:43 PM   #40
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Just a final update on my 50 watt Progressive installation. I installed it this weekend in the location under the queen (where gandtimes hides his scotch). The 50 amp unit appears to be larger and the #6 wire is tough to work with, but I completed it successfully. I can’t speak to the relative merits of progressive vs other brands, but so far I’m delighted with what I bought, and it came up without issues. Appears to be very high quality components, and tech support quickly answered one installation question.

As far as the location, the only reason I didn’t go with the location between the furnace and wheel well was that I wasn’t smart enough to figure out how to access it. Sounds like it might have been an easier install. Will keep that in mind if I ever need to do this again.

But on the whole I’m pretty pleased with how it went and with the product itself. Thanks again for all the useful advice.
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