RV News RVBusiness 2021 Top 10 RVs of the Year, plus 56 additional debuts and must-see units → ×
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-18-2020, 03:41 PM   #1
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
My turn for battery, Victron and solar upgrade

Well, thanks to the multitude of advise offered by so many of you in this forum, I have decided to cautiously jump in and attempt to upgrade my battery/solar/charging system. Actually, after reading what seems like a thousand or more posts related to this subject, I think Iíll place the blame on many of you for convincing me itís something I can tackle. (Big smile.) Plus, unfortunately Iíll be in Ohio this winter so this seems to be a good choice for a project to help keep boredom at bay.

We have a 2019 International Serenity 25FB twin with the factor added solar package and a single AC. Iíve ordered and just received the following from Battle Born...
(3) Battle Born 100Ah Lithium batteries.
Victron SmartSolar MPPT 100/30 charge controller.
Victron BMV-712 Battery Monitor
Victron 12/3000 MultiPlus
(And btw...Battle Born is awesome to work with!)
I also plan to add 2 Zamp 90 watt panels to the existing 2 90 watt panels.
Iím hopeful to get the Airstream back on the road before itís winterized. Therefore, I donít plan to start this project for a while. Even so, I thought Iíd throw a few questions out there, a couple that I have yet to encounter on this forum.

1. After installing the BMV-712, the factory installed Sunexplorer II monitor is of no use. So, after itís removal, what do you do with the hole in the wall? If Iím understanding the pics correctly, I see on GMFLís recent install he has placed a Digital Multi Control in a 120v outlet location and moved that outlet to the Sunexplorer II location. Perfect for that install but I wonít be adding the Multi Control. Any ideas?

2. On all these battery upgrades I see, seems like most everyone is using 4/0 cable to connect the batteries. I get it, bigger is better to reduce voltage drop. However, when I was making my package with Battle Born, I asked for some 4/0 cables to connect the batteries. They told me the largest they carry is 1/0 because they have had some troubles with using 4/0 on their lithium batteries. I regret not asking him for more details just to understand more clearly. But, are there issues using one vs. the other? (I did get and plan to use some 1/0 cables.)

3. Ok, this one Iíve seen much discussion so itís not really a question. But when I add the two 90 watt Zamp panels, that will give me 360 watts total on my roof. Certainly not ultra size like so many but I believe it will fit my needs. These panels could maybe produce 20 amps under optimal conditions. Even though my owners manual states the wire down from my combiner box is 10awg, it is actually 8awg. Nice surprise. I believe considering the size of my solar bank that I will not be changing out the wire to 6awg as many have. Doesnít seem worth the hassle.

Anyway, thanks to so many of you for sharing your talents. It certainly is appreciated by others!

Mark
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 04:36 PM   #2
Rivet Master
 
wulfraat's Avatar
 
2017 30' International
Broomfield , Colorado
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,535
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honstream2;
1. After installing the BMV-712, the factory installed Sunexplorer II monitor is of no use. So, after it’s removal, what do you do with the hole in the wall? If I’m understanding the pics correctly, I see on GMFL’s recent install he has placed a Digital Multi Control in a 120v outlet location and moved that outlet to the Sunexplorer II location. Perfect for that install but I won’t be adding the Multi Control. Any ideas?
You can have both the 712 monitor and a CCGX / Cerbo in the same system. 712 comes with the monitor so might as well use it to plug the hole. Or you could leave your old monitor in place, albeit not useful. That is what I did with my inverter on/off switch - just left it there even though it is not attached to anything / is basically a brick.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Honstream2;
2. On all these battery upgrades I see, seems like most everyone is using 4/0 cable to connect the batteries. I get it, bigger is better to reduce voltage drop. However, when I was making my package with Battle Born, I asked for some 4/0 cables to connect the batteries. They told me the largest they carry is 1/0 because they have had some troubles with using 4/0 on their lithium batteries. I regret not asking him for more details just to understand more clearly. But, are there issues using one vs. the other? (I did get and plan to use some 1/0 cables.)
4/0 all the way for a parallel connection feeding the Multi given the amps the multi is spec'd to pull from your batts. Consider a Lnyx distribution center for cable management. Use 500AMP blue sea HD switches downstream of the batts (I have melted a 300AMP switch already, and had to upgrade).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Honstream2;
3. Ok, this one I’ve seen much discussion so it’s not really a question. But when I add the two 90 watt Zamp panels, that will give me 360 watts total on my roof. Certainly not ultra size like so many but I believe it will fit my needs. These panels could maybe produce 20 amps under optimal conditions. Even though my owners manual states the wire down from my combiner box is 10awg, it is actually 8awg. Nice surprise. I believe considering the size of my solar bank that I will not be changing out the wire to 6awg as many have. Doesn’t seem worth the hassle.
For 360w / 20A you are fine with 8ga. The combiner box on the roof only allows for 3 connections - so you will need to have a secondary combiner. You could go with series-parallel but not necessary with 8ga.

Finally - make sure your new ZAMP panels match the existing ones from a voltage perspective. You do not want to vary more than 0.3 volts between panels otherwise you will loose efficiency (power) with an MPPT controller and will not harness maximum yield from the panels.

Nice setup you are planning.... GMFL is the master and I am sure will comment further.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Screen Shot 2020-10-18 at 3.35.37 PM.jpg
Views:	11
Size:	102.6 KB
ID:	381179  
wulfraat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 05:12 PM   #3
Rivet Master
 
Acheron2010's Avatar

 
2019 26' Flying Cloud
Morristown , Tennessee
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 668
Any thought to using portable panels that plug into your external connector on the trailer tongue?
__________________
2015 Chevrolet Silverado 2500
2019 Airstream Flying Cloud 26RBQ
WBCCI #6679
Acheron2010 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 05:18 PM   #4
Rivet Master
 
waninae39's Avatar

 
2017 22' Sport
NCR , Ontario
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 2,314
this is our schematic. it may be useful for you to study it as you have many of the same parts
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	AS22FB- power DC-V13b.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	247.0 KB
ID:	381182  
waninae39 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 06:17 PM   #5
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by wulfraat View Post
You can have both the 712 monitor and a CCGX / Cerbo in the same system. 712 comes with the monitor so might as well use it to plug the hole. Or you could leave your old monitor in place, albeit not useful. That is what I did with my inverter on/off switch - just left it there even though it is not attached to anything / is basically a brick.

For 360w / 20A you are fine with 8ga. The combiner box on the roof only allows for 3 connections - so you will need to have a secondary combiner. You could go with series-parallel but not necessary with 8ga.

Finally - make sure your new ZAMP panels match the existing ones from a voltage perspective. You do not want to vary more than 0.3 volts between panels otherwise you will loose efficiency (power) with an MPPT controller and will not harness maximum yield from the panels.

Nice setup you are planning.... GMFL is the master and I am sure will comment further.


Thanks Wulfraat! I appreciate your advise. For now, I donít plan any more monitoring devices. I might just have to put a blank/dummy plate on the wall.
Zamp has a ďYĒ connector that is supposed to work for my application. That will allow me to add the 2 panels with a single port.
Actually, my plan is to use the same 90 watt panels that are currently on the roof. Long and narrow will fit my available space nicely.
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 06:23 PM   #6
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acheron2010 View Post
Any thought to using portable panels that plug into your external connector on the trailer tongue?


Actually, yes I have considered this as an ďadditionalĒ option. I wanted to add capacity on the roof first for the convenience of just installing it and then not having to mess. However, Iíve thought that if the 360 watt total isnít enough then I might add a suitcase to the mix.
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 06:27 PM   #7
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by waninae39 View Post
this is our schematic. it may be useful for you to study it as you have many of the same parts


Thanks Waninae39! Yours is one of the many that I have studied.
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 08:22 PM   #8
Rivet Master
 
daleyocum's Avatar
 
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 938
ctron

I have the Flying Cloud version of your trailer with the Victron/Battleborn system upgrades. A couple of thoughts.

You really want a multicontrol. You’ll find you and others are frequently turning the Multiplus on and off to save the parasitic drain on the batteries when not using 120v. We also frequently adjust the shore current the Multiplus is allowed to draw. It’s worth it to have an easy switch that turns the inverter on and off that everyone can use. We put ours where the inverter control was behind the stove because that’s where airstream ran the wires (for the solar.) And it fills up the hole from the stock solar control.

The BMV-712 is pretty easy to mount in the hall just outside the bathroom. It’s nice to see it at a glance without having to get out your phone. There are two triangular chases inside the bathroom on either side of the door. One has the vent pipe, the other is empty. The back of BMV-712 fits nicely in the empty one closer to the kitchen.

I used 02 wire for mine. The runs are fairly short in my case and likely will be in yours assuming you put the batteries under the curb side twin. 04 is overkill in my opinion for such short runs. Doesn’t hurt of course. I don’t see much of any voltage drop even when I run the air conditioner off the battery bank. That draw is about 160 amps.

Here are a few pictures.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	8260264E-D0FE-4DF0-87A4-68A6435AAA2C.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	260.6 KB
ID:	381202   Click image for larger version

Name:	DCC1B2E2-215F-436B-9F3F-16CEB1133A43.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	285.4 KB
ID:	381204  

Click image for larger version

Name:	687589CF-8623-4ECB-A2B0-D916FF0C1653.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	193.3 KB
ID:	381205   Click image for larger version

Name:	F58C4745-D549-439E-8D52-B86F57656476.jpg
Views:	17
Size:	358.2 KB
ID:	381206  

daleyocum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 08:34 PM   #9
Overkill Specialist
Commercial Member
 
GMFL's Avatar

 
2020 30í Globetrotter
2014 23' International
Dadeville , Alabama
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 4,171
Images: 4
Blog Entries: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honstream2 View Post
Well, thanks to the multitude of advise offered by so many of you in this forum, I have decided to cautiously jump in and attempt to upgrade my battery/solar/charging system. Actually, after reading what seems like a thousand or more posts related to this subject, I think Iíll place the blame on many of you for convincing me itís something I can tackle. (Big smile.) Plus, unfortunately Iíll be in Ohio this winter so this seems to be a good choice for a project to help keep boredom at bay.

We have a 2019 International Serenity 25FB twin with the factor added solar package and a single AC. Iíve ordered and just received the following from Battle Born...
(3) Battle Born 100Ah Lithium batteries.
Victron SmartSolar MPPT 100/30 charge controller.
Victron BMV-712 Battery Monitor
Victron 12/3000 MultiPlus
(And btw...Battle Born is awesome to work with!)
I also plan to add 2 Zamp 90 watt panels to the existing 2 90 watt panels.
Iím hopeful to get the Airstream back on the road before itís winterized. Therefore, I donít plan to start this project for a while. Even so, I thought Iíd throw a few questions out there, a couple that I have yet to encounter on this forum.

1. After installing the BMV-712, the factory installed Sunexplorer II monitor is of no use. So, after itís removal, what do you do with the hole in the wall? If Iím understanding the pics correctly, I see on GMFLís recent install he has placed a Digital Multi Control in a 120v outlet location and moved that outlet to the Sunexplorer II location. Perfect for that install but I wonít be adding the Multi Control. Any ideas?

2. On all these battery upgrades I see, seems like most everyone is using 4/0 cable to connect the batteries. I get it, bigger is better to reduce voltage drop. However, when I was making my package with Battle Born, I asked for some 4/0 cables to connect the batteries. They told me the largest they carry is 1/0 because they have had some troubles with using 4/0 on their lithium batteries. I regret not asking him for more details just to understand more clearly. But, are there issues using one vs. the other? (I did get and plan to use some 1/0 cables.)

3. Ok, this one Iíve seen much discussion so itís not really a question. But when I add the two 90 watt Zamp panels, that will give me 360 watts total on my roof. Certainly not ultra size like so many but I believe it will fit my needs. These panels could maybe produce 20 amps under optimal conditions. Even though my owners manual states the wire down from my combiner box is 10awg, it is actually 8awg. Nice surprise. I believe considering the size of my solar bank that I will not be changing out the wire to 6awg as many have. Doesnít seem worth the hassle.

Anyway, thanks to so many of you for sharing your talents. It certainly is appreciated by others!

Mark
See photo on how to set up your BMV and MultiControl by relocating the kitchen plug into the SunExplorer hole. This does require you to run a VE.Direct cable (If using a GX monitor) and the shunt data cable to this location in the wall but it is possible
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	675AF471-9B8B-4AA0-A603-48E9DC399E49.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	238.0 KB
ID:	381211   Click image for larger version

Name:	9F36B8AC-567A-496C-BEF3-18270F3E64A9.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	240.2 KB
ID:	381212  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0153EE44-F851-4C72-A0E4-8D6BEE4C9B9D.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	252.8 KB
ID:	381213   Click image for larger version

Name:	6782EAD8-C18B-4D76-8434-0B48C82531E5.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	230.4 KB
ID:	381214  

GMFL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 09:56 PM   #10
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
Hi guys. Thanks for the replies. And thanks for including pics. Much easier to reference.
I think though there is some confusion on what I was asking regarding what to do with the hole created when I remove the factory installed Sunexplorer II monitor. I was only referencing Ronnieís install of the multi control as he shows on his pictures. (I saw this on Instagram.) My plans however do not include the multi controller. I was just curious what everyone does with the hole when they pull out the Sunexplorer in favor of the 712. (And are not installing anything else.)

A possible answer literally just came to me as Iím writing this. Maybe I could mount the 712 on a single gang no devise wall plate. Then mount that assembly to the wall at the cutout where the Sunexplorer was.
Anyway, other ideas are welcome.
Thanks!

Mark
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2020, 10:10 PM   #11
Overkill Specialist
Commercial Member
 
GMFL's Avatar

 
2020 30í Globetrotter
2014 23' International
Dadeville , Alabama
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 4,171
Images: 4
Blog Entries: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honstream2 View Post
Hi guys. Thanks for the replies. And thanks for including pics. Much easier to reference.
I think though there is some confusion on what I was asking regarding what to do with the hole created when I remove the factory installed Sunexplorer II monitor. I was only referencing Ronnieís install of the multi control as he shows on his pictures. (I saw this on Instagram.) My plans however do not include the multi controller. I was just curious what everyone does with the hole when they pull out the Sunexplorer in favor of the 712. (And are not installing anything else.)

A possible answer literally just came to me as Iím writing this. Maybe I could mount the 712 on a single gang no devise wall plate. Then mount that assembly to the wall at the cutout where the Sunexplorer was.
Anyway, other ideas are welcome.
Thanks!

Mark
Mark,
I think you are going to want the multi control. It makes operating the Multi-plus much more user friendly.
GMFL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2020, 12:43 AM   #12
Rivet Master
 
57Vintage's Avatar

 
1958 26' Overlander
Battle Ground , Washington
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 564
Images: 22
X2 on GMFL's suggestion on the Victron Multi Control. Makes control of charging from the Multiplus a simple turn of the dial. Plus turning the Multiplus on/off from this panel gives you more options on whether easy access to the Multiplus is needed.
__________________
Harold & Rebecca

Our thread:
https://www.airforums.com/forums/f97...er-172124.html
57Vintage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2020, 01:28 AM   #13
Rivet Master
 
daleyocum's Avatar
 
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 938
X3 on the Multicontrol.

How are you planning to turn the inverter on and off otherwise? Controlling the Multiplus with your phone is not a user friendly way for the whole family to interact with it. And you donít want to run the risk of leaving it on. It draws around 3-5 amps just sitting there.
daleyocum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2020, 04:18 AM   #14
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
Thanks all for your suggestion on the multi control. I feel humbled knowing I missed that as an important part of my set up. Iíll get one ordered today. You guys are awesome for helping me out!

Mark
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2020, 06:23 AM   #15
GLCMRANGER - Sue
 
2016 25' International
Littlestown , Pennsylvania
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 260
I modified the combiner box to accept 4 separate panel plug-ins. Just buy a plug-in, similar to the one on the trailer tongue -- Amazon (Zamp solar connector). Then, drill a hole in the side of the combiner box. Hook up POS/NEG to the same posts used for the other plug-ins.
Of course, this requires you remove the combiner box first. If you damage it when removing it,,,, buy another one on Amazon.
glcmranger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2020, 09:33 AM   #16
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by glcmranger View Post
I modified the combiner box to accept 4 separate panel plug-ins. Just buy a plug-in, similar to the one on the trailer tongue -- Amazon (Zamp solar connector). Then, drill a hole in the side of the combiner box. Hook up POS/NEG to the same posts used for the other plug-ins.
Of course, this requires you remove the combiner box first. If you damage it when removing it,,,, buy another one on Amazon.


Thanks glcmranger! I appreciate the suggestion!
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2020, 09:39 AM   #17
1 Rivet Member
 
Honstream2's Avatar
 
2019 25' International
Bellefontaine , Ohio
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by GMFL View Post
See photo on how to set up your BMV and MultiControl by relocating the kitchen plug into the SunExplorer hole. This does require you to run a VE.Direct cable (If using a GX monitor) and the shunt data cable to this location in the wall but it is possible


Just wondering, how did you get such a clean cut in the aluminum for the BMV? Did you just use a nibbler or do you have another method? (All of your work just looks so darn good whether itís visible or hidden.)
Honstream2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2020, 11:51 AM   #18
Rivet Master
 
daleyocum's Avatar
 
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 938
And since you are spending money if you haven’t already you’ll want the Victron MK3 USB adapter to configure and update the Multiplus. GMFL will have more recent info but when I did mine two years ago that was the only way to configure and update it. It is a pretty clunky process. You can also buy it preconfigured and updated from AMSolar and, I think, Battleborn.

There’s a chance you’ll want one of their GX controllers to watch over everything. At least two years ago without it the solar controller is more primitive in the way it charges. It doesn’t seem to recharge during the day. It just charges once in the morning. I have the Venus and check it with my phone. Others have the fancy color display. The later takes a lot of wires going to it and was hard for me to place.

It’s unclear to me which devices look at the battery monitor and when without the GX. I would hope they’ve fixed this by now.
daleyocum is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
BMV comparison: Victron 712, Victron 700-02, v. Ali Battery Monitor JeffofCT Electrical - Systems, Generators, Batteries & Solar 9 09-16-2020 08:22 PM
Victron 100/30 vs Victron 100/20? smsasf Generators & Solar Power 0 08-04-2020 07:09 PM
Victron 100/30 and Victron 712 installer needed in PA RMD Generators & Solar Power 0 07-01-2020 10:08 AM
Upgrade Factory Solar Controller to Victron MPPT wlquan Electrical - Systems, Generators, Batteries & Solar 1 06-30-2020 12:34 PM
Bedroom Lights Don't Turn On/Turn Off and turn back on after a couple minutes. alecg Lights - Interior & Exterior 9 09-01-2010 03:01 PM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.