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04-28-2021, 08:48 AM
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#1
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2 Rivet Member
2019 23' Flying Cloud
Port Colborne
, Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 67
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Has anyone installed an internal EMS surge protector
Folks,
We have a 2019 FC 23' FB and I am considering an internal surge protector. When we had the old 25' Safari, we used the type mounted on the distribution post and sold it with the trailer.
I am wondering if anyone has mounted the internal EMS into their AS and if so how difficult was the task?
During my working career, I worked with food packaging equipment and have all the tools and skillset to do this type of electrical work.
The trailer is currently in storage and we will be picking it up next month. I plan on carrying out a check to see if it is possible to access the internal wiring and if there is a suitable mounting spot for an internal device before making what is an expensive purchase.
Thanks,
Keith S
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04-28-2021, 08:58 AM
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#2
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,403
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I did think long and hard about going with an internal unit rather than my outside one, but I got sort of freaked out with all that voltage coming into the trailer and if the unit sacrificed itself, I'd rather have those interactions or destruction going on at the power post rather than under my sofa where the power cord terminates inside my trailer.
Quite honestly I've never met anyone who had one die from a nearby lightning strike or a surge. So without that interaction I decided to go outside. One other reason also is if the internal unit does it's job and fails, you are now having to make some repairs to get power going again. With the outdoor unit you unplug from it and plug into your power outlet until you get a new external unit. I hate having to make repairs when I'm on vacation!
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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04-28-2021, 09:15 AM
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#3
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Rivet Master
2007 22' International CCD
Corona
, California
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,180
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Has anyone installed an internal EMS surge protector
I installed my hard-wired unit in the power enclosure under the dinette seat. If it gets blown up by a surge I’ll deal with it as needed. Forgetting to bring it along when we break camp is a bigger worry, along with theft or water intrusion. I’ve got enough stuff to remember without adding to the list.
The installed unit under the dinette seat (removed for easy access.
The EMS/surge protector monitor dongle:
The manual transfer switch to select power port:
The front power port for the generator that lives in the truck bed that I added:
The Champion 3400 inverter dual fuel cranking out the power for air conditioning during the test run off the A-frame propane port. Nice and quiet.
__________________
Rich, KE4GNK/AE, Overkill Engineering Dept.
'The Silver HamShack' ('07 International 22FB CCD 75th Anniversary)
Multiple Yaesu Ham Radios inside and many antennae sprouting from roof, ProPride hitch, Prodigy P2 controller.
2012 shortbed CrewMax 4x4 Toyota Tacoma TV with more antennae on it.
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04-28-2021, 09:20 AM
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#4
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Site Team
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere
, South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 6,436
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I did internal also.
__________________
S/OS #001 2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Dexter 4 Piston Disc Brakes, Carslile Actuator, Equal-I-Zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook. BMV-712. DEMCO 21K Lb Cast Iron coupler
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04-28-2021, 09:53 AM
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#5
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,403
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Has anyone installed an internal EMS surge protector
Yeah I understand the risks of external. I'm not concerned a lot about leaving it since the last thing I do prior to pulling out of a campground is unplugging my electrical cable. With that external unit staring me in the face at that point I don't see much chance of me leaving it. Theft is another matter and I have taken some tamper precautions with it. Like anything it can be stolen of course if someone is hell bent on taking it.
I've only been a victim of campground theft once, and that was in one of the big Myrtle Beach campgrounds. While I can't prove it I think my neighbor stole my bumper end caps on my SOB and my aluminum airplane wheel chocks. I left for about 15 minutes and the guy packed up and left during that timeframe. I specifically remember he had neither of those items on his wreck of a trailer. Campground management shrugged their shoulders when I reported them missing when I returned from my errand.
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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04-28-2021, 10:39 AM
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#6
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2 Rivet Member
2017 30' International
Box Elder
, South Dakota
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 78
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I installed the Progressive Industries 50 amp hardwire in my 30' (i had the dealer install the 30 amp version on my 26' and really liked it so got the 50 when we changed trailers)
It was very straight forward install, there was large amount of cable left behind the main breaker panel. fortunately in the 30' layout the incoming power is right behind the main breaker area. hardest part for me was working with the thick heavy wires of the 50amp cable. you have to finesse them all into a small terminal space inside the PI unit. But overall it was a pretty easy install. the external display is really handy when plugging into the campground pedestal and its nice to not have to include that step when hooking up and disconnecting
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04-28-2021, 11:01 AM
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#7
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Rivet Master
2005 25' International CCD
Westlake Village
, California
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 508
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Internal EMS
We decided on internal for many similar reasons to others. Floor mounted it directly behind newer 4 stage converter and directly in line with the ample existing Orange shore power Romex 120v feed. EASY. Just disconnect any 120v shore power before hand !
We didn’t want to wire the remotes sticking amidst the trailer walls so easily ran them inside the converter door area to conceal the “power related” stuff together with easy manual override and EMS display access when needed.
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04-28-2021, 12:39 PM
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#8
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3 Rivet Member
2000 25' Excella
Northern
, California
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 247
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I installed one in my 25-foot, rear twin several years ago. There was a perfect, separate comparment in the rear storage area, safe from accidental damage from cargo shifting. It was also right above the shore power entry point, so wiring was relatively easy; however anchorage was a little more challenging, albeit doable. Essentially, the unit was immediately underneath the head of my bed, and in the quiet of the night, I could hear the distinct hum, even with my less-than-perfect hearing. The manufacturer sent me a replacement, but same result. I removed it, and replaced it with an external device that lasted nearly 20 years, failing just this spring on a freezing night. I replaced it with a Progressive Industries 30-amp, external device, which also hums if one is standing next to it. Fortunately, I can't hear it from inside the coach. I like the device, and the data it yields. My experience has been that most parks are woefully under-powered with all of the modern RV's and multiple air conditioners, so I also routinely use a Hughes Autoformer booster downstream of the Progressive Industries device whenever I use the air conditioner. The Autoformer kicks in at about 115V. I also lock both devices to the pedestal just to discourage the normally-honest folks. I hope this helps.
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04-28-2021, 01:01 PM
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#9
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2 Rivet Member
2009 19' Flying Cloud
San Mateo
, California
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 56
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I installed the Progressive Industry hardwire in my 2009 19' Flying Cloud. It's not hard at all. Took me about 2 hours. And now that I did it once, I could do another one a lot faster so if you are used to this type of work, it'll be easy
I decided on hardware since I didn't want to deal with potential of theft, and more likely, me forgetting it at the campsite.
By the way, I also upgrade the outside plug to SmartPlug. A lot easier to deal with than the stupid ring you have to twist. The contacts on the plug is a lot more solid.
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04-28-2021, 01:29 PM
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#10
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Rivet Master
2022 25' Flying Cloud
NCR
, Ontario
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 3,085
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we installed it 3 years ago . it runs very well.
it stops power issues more that 15 times over the years
lower 90v, higher 130v and low amps
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04-28-2021, 02:34 PM
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#11
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2 Rivet Member
2009 19' Flying Cloud
San Mateo
, California
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 56
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Oh, one thing you need to be aware of. If you go hardwired EMS, when you use a generator, then you either need to bypass the EMS or get a neutral bonding plug (connects the neutral and ground) to stick into the regular 15amp plug of the generator, like this (except instead of buying this, you can goto Home Depot and pickup the parts to make this on your own for $3. All you need is a 110v plug and a piece of copper wire. Connect the ground and neutral)
https://www.etrailer.com/Generator-P...rs/HU33FR.html
Without it, the EMS will detect a ground fault and not let the 110v through. Or you could put the EMS in bypass, that will solve the problem as well.
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04-28-2021, 04:08 PM
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#12
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Rivet Master
, Minnesota
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,721
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I installed a 30a Progressive inside.
My '59 Tradewind has 50a service. The only item the surge protects is my A/C. It's the only item in the trailer that runs on 120v and is more expensive than the surge protector.
If I lose the microwave or flat screen TV due to a surge I can replace them in a few minutes.
I wired the surge protector between the 20a breaker and the A/C. Does a good job of checking for wiring faults at the campsite.
Be careful where you mount it. It may give off a high pitched whine that you only hear at night if the surge protector is mounted on the wall over the head of your bed.
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04-28-2021, 04:26 PM
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#13
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Rivet Master
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Sag Harbor
, New York
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 17,523
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04-29-2021, 09:24 AM
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#14
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2 Rivet Member
2021 27' Flying Cloud
Winter Park
, Florida
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 35
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I decided on the external for the same reasons stated by jcanavera. It's easy enough to grab since I need to pull the electric anyway.
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04-29-2021, 09:57 AM
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#15
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Half a Rivet Short
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 15,684
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Hi
After watching out external rust away after only a year of use, going to an internal made a lot of sense. Protecting an external from 6 to 8 months out in the rain at many dozens of campsites .... nope ....
In our trailer, putting it behind the breaker panel was the obvious choice. It dropped in there quite easily. We got one with a remote readout panel. That is a *very* useful item. I would not get the version that is "front panel only" and does not have the remote display.
I'm very happy *not* having to watch the rain pour down on our external and wonder if it's going to short out .....
Bob
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04-29-2021, 10:13 AM
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#16
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Rivet Master
2018 30' Flying Cloud
Springfield
, Ohio
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 567
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I have the internal surge protector in my 30RB. I didn't do the install, the prior owner did and he made a video of the installation. The link below shows how it was done. Your trailer should be similar.
__________________
2018 Flying Cloud 30RB + 2020 Silverado 2500HD Duramax/Allison
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04-29-2021, 10:16 AM
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#17
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Site Team
2002 25' Safari
Dewey
, Arizona
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 15,615
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My EMS gave it's life to save my trailer when lightning struck close by at the Outer Banks of NC. It would no longer function and I had to unplug it to get power to the trailer. The company shipped me a new unit and it took 2 minutes (power up wait time) to replace the unit.
__________________
Richard
Wally Byam Airstream Club 7513
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04-29-2021, 10:26 AM
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#18
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2 Rivet Member
2004 30' Classic
London
, Ontario
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 93
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Not difficult to install
I installed the EMS-HW30C in our 30 ft Classic a couple years ago, while camping. Took less than two hours. its installed in the rear corner of our unit right above where the power comes in. Our trailer has a storage compartment underneath where the 30A hardwired power cord is coiled. I just inserted the EMS-HW30A between the cable end, and where it was previously connected. The remote monitor switch I ran up into the bedroom and its mounted with velcro onto a cupboard. My wife doesn't like the flashing display at night, so we often take it down and tuck it down beside the bed (RB twins) so its out of the way.
I'm far too forgetful to use a pedestal mounted EMS. This one has saved us a few times from low voltages, and we don't hear any noise coming from it, even though its under one of the beds. Highly recommended!
__________________
2004 30' Classic
2020 F150 XLT 4x4
WBCCI #1783, Region 2, Ontario Canada Unit
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04-29-2021, 11:32 AM
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#19
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3 Rivet Member
2019 27' Tommy Bahama
Foothill Ranch
, California
Join Date: Jul 2020
Posts: 160
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We, too were a bit overwhelmed by the idea of a self installation, so we had the dealer do it.
Then we saw how easy it was! In our TB27FB, if you open the hall closet doors, there's a "hidden" door just below it that has a furnace vent cut into it (no handle, you just pull at the top). Easy access to the back side of our 50amp plug and loads of room for the Hughs Autoformers internal "Bulldog" unit. https://hughesautoformers.com/
We chose them for the reason listed earlier - if there's a direct lightning strike, they offer a swap out component so the unit keeps working (unlike the Progressive, that requires complete replacement ~ and re-installation).
We also LOVE the fact it has an app that we can easily monitor what's going on from our phone (so the unit, being located out-of-site doesn't matter at all!)
We've only had this coach for a year, but the EMS has already saved us multiple time with miss-wired pedestals, and a brown out. The piece of mind it brings just adds to our "camping serenity" of not having to worry about "stuff"
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04-29-2021, 12:37 PM
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#20
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4 Rivet Member
2005 30' Land Yacht 30 SL
Castro Valley
, California
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 425
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I installed it internally, but this was much easier in the Class A TerraYacht. However there's an internal problem, sometimes the Progressive will only show 23vac on one input, and this happened even when using a single phase and adapter plugs. It will correct to ~120vac when I discipline it with the soft hammer, have to call Progressive some time.
__________________
Cliff & Andrea,
two snowshoe cats, have not been camping yet
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