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Old 06-27-2020, 01:20 PM   #1
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1000 Watts of Solar!

We will soon be installing our new Zamp Obsidian high voltage 100W panels on the roof of our 30’ Globetrotter. We will be installing 1Kw! Anyone else installed that much solar on the roof of an Airstream and if so what solar controller did you use. I’m looking at a couple of different options but just curious as to what others have done.
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Old 06-27-2020, 06:05 PM   #2
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Looking at the Victron 150/70 VE. We will install them series/parallel so should run around 50volts @ 23Amps on the input side. Output should be 14.4 volts @ 65 amps
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Old 06-27-2020, 06:28 PM   #3
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I'm loving it!

I have 500 watts on the roof and it works very well. I can't imagine 1000 watts and four lithium batteries. You are putting in four? Six?
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Old 06-27-2020, 08:42 PM   #4
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Had Lewster and Mike install 1kw on my classic with a 150/70. This morning, parked on the street under a tree, the sun came in from the side and we were getting 465W on a cloudy hazy day. Have pulled in over 900W a number of times. It fills the 600 AH of BB quickly. When we were getting it done, the plan was do all you can, all at once. Make it yours and noting says GMFL like all that will fit!
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Old 06-27-2020, 10:19 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turk123 View Post
I'm loving it!

I have 500 watts on the roof and it works very well. I can't imagine 1000 watts and four lithium batteries. You are putting in four? Six?
8.......
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Old 06-27-2020, 10:21 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LilPeanut View Post
Had Lewster and Mike install 1kw on my classic with a 150/70. This morning, parked on the street under a tree, the sun came in from the side and we were getting 465W on a cloudy hazy day. Have pulled in over 900W a number of times. It fills the 600 AH of BB quickly. When we were getting it done, the plan was do all you can, all at once. Make it yours and noting says GMFL like all that will fit!
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Old 06-28-2020, 11:13 AM   #7
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WOW!!!! we run 200w on the roof + 180w suitcase when sun is iffy :-)
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Old 06-28-2020, 11:47 AM   #8
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Old 06-28-2020, 12:10 PM   #9
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What makes them high voltage ?
The connected circuit max voltage is 21.9 - according to your label .

In solar system design , 48 vdc is the typical recommended max. - because of the tendency of DC voltage around & above of the 48vdc range to arc / jump between conductors .

What ever happened to common sense / engineering a system = design / plan before buying components ?
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Old 06-28-2020, 01:01 PM   #10
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Hi

Well, 1KW at 12.0 V would be 83A. I'd go with the Victron 150/100. When you *really* need the power ( = batteries are dead) you will have it. 80% capacity is a pretty good design goal ....

No, it's not my charge card

With 8 batteries, there is no concern about "to much current". Even the 83A is right at C/10. They'll last forever and ever at that rate.

Bob
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Old 06-28-2020, 01:47 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnTF View Post
What makes them high voltage?
What ever happened to common sense / engineering a system = design / plan before buying components ?
Haha. I guess my question was miss leading. Please don’t think I’m not versed in this stuff.
I have a design and a plan. I was just curious what others had done. Thought some might have used Morning Star of something else. Victron is about all I’ve used.

These Panels are 39 Cell Prototype panels vs 36 cells. They are higher voltage because of this increase in cell count. Meaning that a standard 100watt panel would have an Optimum Operating Voltage (Vmp): 17.9V @ Optimum Operating Current (Imp): 5.72A. vs these with a (Vmp): 21.9 @ (Imp): 4.58A. Hence higher voltage lower amps.

My “plan” is to wire these 10 panels in a series/parallel configuration for 5 pairs of panels. Voltage will be 44 ish volts at 22A. The controller I am planing to use is the Victron 150/85-Tr VE.Can
It’s a Toss Up now between 4 of the “NEW” Victron 200Ah LiFePo4 Batteries (man they are small) or 8 BattleBorns.
I’ll be running a Victron MultiPlus 3000 watt inverter through an AM solar SPS (Smart Phase Selector)
Victron CerboGX with Touch 50 monitor
Victron Lynx 1000A shunt With Lynx distribution buses
Victron 50A Buck-Boost Charger
Ect... as needed.


I’ve also considered using the MasterVolt system and doing the whole CZONE upgrade, but that’s just an option.
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Old 06-28-2020, 01:49 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uncle_bob View Post
Hi

Well, 1KW at 12.0 V would be 83A. I'd go with the Victron 150/100. When you *really* need the power ( = batteries are dead) you will have it. 80% capacity is a pretty good design goal ....

No, it's not my charge card

With 8 batteries, there is no concern about "to much current". Even the 83A is right at C/10. They'll last forever and ever at that rate.

Bob
I’m thinking the 150/85 is the plan. We all know these panels will never produce 80 amps in the real world.
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Old 06-28-2020, 01:55 PM   #13
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Question Why not allow Victron output at 14.6V ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GMFL View Post
Looking at the Victron 150/70 VE. We will install them series/parallel so should run around 50volts @ 23Amps on the input side. Output should be 14.4 volts @ 65 amps
Comment: Youre' doing 5 panels in parallel per string, 2 strings in series. Victron can handle 150 Volts total (disconnect voltage), so you would slightly exceed the maximum voltage by flipping it over (5 series sets of only 2 panels in parallel.) 10 panels offers only those two alternatives, so you are planning to use the right one. A controller which could handle 200V maximum input voltage could run 2 strings of panels in series, with some benefit of lowering current in the PV wires.

My question: AFAIK, you are using LFP batteries. Why would you limit output Voltage to only 14.4V, rather than 14.6V? (14.6V would finish charging the batteries more quickly when you reach "Constant Voltage" and the Victron current maximum is no longer the limiting factor). IIUC, reaching all the way up to 14.6 - rather than 14.4 - gives some BMS boards in "12.8 Volt" LFP batteries a better shot at balancing the individual cells. And your max output estimate of 65A * 14.4V is only 93% efficiency, I imagine that the Victron can do a bit better than that when the Voltage differential is that small - another reason to maybe consider output Voltage 14.6V.

Maybe you've got a non-Lithium Converter, which must not be "driven backwards" at 14.4V? Please reply, I'm curious. I own a PD Lithium capable "Wildkat", which runs CC/CV at around 14.7, and doesn't get driven backwards from my Solar Controller at 14.6V.
- - - -
My own Solar configuration is only about 500 watts. I use an 'el-cheapo' Ep-Solar 'BN' controller. It can't be programmed to skip over 'Float Mode' completely (it's not a genuine CC/CV Lithium charger). But I've been getting pretty good results with: 'Boost Charge Voltage' = 14.6V, 'Equalize Charge Voltage' = 14.6V, Equalize Duration = 0 minutes, Float Charge Voltage = 13.5V, Boost Reconnect Voltage = 13.3V, and Boost Duration = 180 minutes (the maximum value). Things like "Discharge Limit", Under Voltage Warning" are set a ways above the too-low Battery BMS limits, but I've never hit any of those. Over-Voltage Disconnect is 14.7V, with Reconnect at 14.6V.

Whenever I use the batteries (LFP *2) to run an appliance, Voltage pretty quickly drops below 13.3V - and that causes the controller jumps back to "Boost Mode" for up to 3 hours, if the sun is still shining bright enough to supply all the power the batteries want to take.
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Old 06-28-2020, 02:14 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMFL;
It’s a Toss Up now between 4 of the “NEW” Victron 200Ah LiFePo4 Batteries (man they are small) or 8 BattleBorns.
Are you considering the Victron SuperPacks? If you are note the very low discharge rate - 0.5C. Just something to take note of when running your Air Con.

I have the legacy Smart lithium with external BMS. More system complexity and additional weight, but your get 2C discharge rate which is nice, and they communicate via VE.Bus to boot.

BB are rate 1C I believe.....
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Old 06-28-2020, 02:16 PM   #15
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are you considering the victron superpacks?
yes!
I see them with a 1C discharge rate
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Old 06-28-2020, 02:17 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickst29 View Post
Comment: Youre' doing 5 panels in parallel per string, 2 strings in series. Victron can handle 150 Volts total (disconnect voltage), so you would slightly exceed the maximum voltage by flipping it over (5 series sets of only 2 panels in parallel.) 10 panels offers only those two alternatives, so you are planning to use the right one. A controller which could handle 200V maximum input voltage could run 2 strings of panels in series, with some benefit of lowering current in the PV wires.

My question: AFAIK, you are using LFP batteries. Why would you limit output Voltage to only 14.4V, rather than 14.6V? (14.6V would finish charging the batteries more quickly when you reach "Constant Voltage" and the Victron current maximum is no longer the limiting factor). IIUC, reaching all the way up to 14.6 - rather than 14.4 - gives some BMS boards in "12.8 Volt" LFP batteries a better shot at balancing the individual cells. And your max output estimate of 65A * 14.4V is only 93% efficiency, I imagine that the Victron can do a bit better than that when the Voltage differential is that small - another reason to maybe consider output Voltage 14.6V.

Maybe you've got a non-Lithium Converter, which must not be "driven backwards" at 14.4V? Please reply, I'm curious. I own a PD Lithium capable "Wildkat", which runs CC/CV at around 14.7, and doesn't get driven backwards from my Solar Controller at 14.6V.
- - - -
My own Solar configuration is only about 500 watts. I use an 'el-cheapo' Ep-Solar 'BN' controller. It can't be programmed to skip over 'Float Mode' completely (it's not a genuine CC/CV Lithium charger). But I've been getting pretty good results with: 'Boost Charge Voltage' = 14.6V, 'Equalize Charge Voltage' = 14.6V, Equalize Duration = 0 minutes, Float Charge Voltage = 13.5V, Boost Reconnect Voltage = 13.3V, and Boost Duration = 180 minutes (the maximum value). Things like "Discharge Limit", Under Voltage Warning" are set a ways above the too-low Battery BMS limits, but I've never hit any of those. Over-Voltage Disconnect is 14.7V, with Reconnect at 14.6V.

Whenever I use the batteries (LFP *2) to run an appliance, Voltage pretty quickly drops below 13.3V - and that causes the controller jumps back to "Boost Mode" for up to 3 hours, if the sun is still shining bright enough to supply all the power the batteries want to take.
I am wiring 5 pairs of 2.
I am a BattleBorn dealer and I use the setting they recommend. See photo.
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Old 06-28-2020, 02:31 PM   #17
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That's curious ....

Just a week later, another BB person "Jesse" posted this (for the previous 'AN' models of my controller) https://battlebornbatteries.com/sett...ar-controller/


He recommended a slightly higher "Float Voltage" value than mine, but we're nearly identical for everything else. Those two people might want to coordinate their recommendations a bit closer?


With your hint, I'll be dropping mine to 14.5V - even though the PD Converter seems to be closer to 14.7V than 14.6, considerably above the BB-preferred values.
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Old 06-28-2020, 02:49 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by GMFL View Post
yes!
I see them with a 1C discharge rate
My bad, was looking at max vs recommended. 800ah is a good number to have. running the Air Con off batts while while traveling or boondocking is nice.
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Old 06-28-2020, 02:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickst29 View Post
Just a week later, another BB person "Jesse" posted this (for the previous 'AN' models of my controller) https://battlebornbatteries.com/sett...ar-controller/


He recommended a slightly higher "Float Voltage" value than mine, but we're nearly identical for everything else. Those two people might want to coordinate their recommendations a bit closer?


With your hint, I'll be dropping mine to 14.5V - even though the PD Converter seems to be closer to 14.7V than 14.6, considerably above the BB-preferred values.
Jessie and I are good friends. I will call him and see what he has to say.
I also follow Peter Kennedy’s advice from PKYS. He and I both believe in not overcharging LiFePo4 batteries.

Check time stamp 23:23 and 28:22 in video below. It’s Dennis one of the owners of BattleBorn stating 14.4V

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...ature=emb_logo
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Old 06-28-2020, 03:26 PM   #20
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My bad, was looking at max vs recommended. 800ah is a good number to have. running the Air Con off batts while while traveling or boondocking is nice.
The 800 along with the 1Kw on the roof will be as close as I can get to energy independence.
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