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Old 01-12-2006, 09:19 PM   #21
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Followed your thread and I have one thing to say....

Look on the bright side - you are young - you have great kids and you live in Texas - There is NO winter as us northerners experience! thus.....

You have all the time in the world to fix your trailer - bit by bit. Fix any leaks (windows, roof door etc.) first. Goup the parpon on if you have to. Work on your floor next, do it in sections if you have to - get your axles fully checked - get your wheels balanced and tire pressure spot on Running gear is the next top priority before anything else. Now you GO CAMPING.

She does not have to be perfect to go camping with the kids. Even if you have sections of your interior missing each trip - who cares. The bathroom is apart for a weekend trip - then take a bucket and portapotti - campgrounds usually have facilities.

Next time your kitchen may be in shambles - a BBQ and propane burner work great.

Maybe the bedroom cabinets are out the next long weekend - so grab a bunch of foam and have a sleeping bag pile up in the middle of the trailer.....

The kids just won't care - cause they will be going Tin-Tenting..

We have a 61 Overlander - but were expecting the worst - and this booty sag deal IS NOT just in the 70's - any of the older units that have sever floor rot causes the shell to release from the frame - as that is basically what holds it together - a simple bolt from the frame through the floor to the c-channel which is then riveted to the shell. No solid wood between that set up and you have a sloppy trailer - that is going to shake rattle and roll down the highway. Any poor running gear set up and you will get some pretty good flexing and damage to your shell. If you have extras like A/C or Awnings that will be added weight and through her around even more.

The days of traveling 50 miles an hour are long gone too - more like the most widely used saying on this forum - Towed like a charm - at 70 miles an hour. (Just think of a tarp flapping in the wind)...

...But as you have found out - take a deep breath and take one thing at a time - and you know you will always find help here.

We started with the running gear on the Overlander first - she still leaks in several places - but we are doing the floor in the spring - love to do it now - but a cold winter has something to do with our work schedule

Good luck with your reno's

PS building re-use it places have great chunkc of solid 1/2 -3/4 plywood - or go to a building site and check out their dumpsters. You may only need 2-3 foot sections with the middle being solid.

Check out e-bay for bags of rivets - or a specialty stores on the internet that sells bulk.
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Old 01-12-2006, 10:24 PM   #22
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Small Update at 10:45 PM...

GT6921...I appreciate your perspective. Quality camping with the family is the ONLY reason I bought this Airstream. Gotta keep that in mind, don't we?

After reading all the posts I took one final trip outside to do more inspection. Armed with an ice pick in one hand and a drop light in the other, I headed out the door. Set the drop light on one of the tires inside the wheel well. Crawled around in the dark trailer to see if I could see any light coming through at all. TOTAL DARKNESS. (That's a good sign, so far...)

Further inspection of the wheel wells called for me to lay flat on my back outside the trailer, looking deep into the recesses of the wheel well. Here's what I noticed about the streetside (the side with the most ripples):

1. The wheel well has suffered a blow, apparently from an earlier blowout(?). I could see an outside crease about 7" long on the uppermost part of the wheel well (immediately above the tires). Not sure if a blowout could have caused an outward crease, to be honest. Looks like something inside could have caused the crease, or a blow to the side skin (but no indication of that). Cornfusing...

2. The entire side of the wheel well should be attached somehow to that top (cold weld? molded?), but it has separated itself from the top, making the side that should attach to the aluminum skin very floppy in places. This would certainly account for the lack of strength in the outside skin and possible a ripple or two.

3. The aluminum skin and trim molding around the wheel well SHOULD be riveted to the inside wall of the wheel well, but it is not. In fact, either the skin is LOWER than the wall of the wheel well, or the wheel well is HIGHER than the skin. Either case, both do not line up with each other. It's off by at least 1/4". This could indicate the probable shift of the shell to that side, thus resulting in the small crack in the interior ceiling panel. Which of you suggested that possibility? You may be onto something.

4. Next, I went back inside the Overlander with my trusty ice pick. I could only find TWO soft spots that I was able to jab the pick all the way through the floor. One was at the front where the fresh water tank was. (Earlier I removed it because the plug on one side was leaking.) The size of this spot is approximately 8" x 4". Is that large enough to compromise the integrity of the floor? Would you go to the trouble of replacing that small piece?

The OTHER SOFT SPOT (as mentioned earlier...see pics) is in the HW Heater compartment, along the outside wall very close to the rear bumper. This is definitely the most obvious...you can see the bumper through the hole about the size of your palm. Other wood along that wall looks worse than it is. Again, would you remove the entire bathroom to replace this piece, or use another case of that expandable foam? (ha!)

Well, that's all I could do tonight. Gotta get some shut-eye. I hope to squeeze away from work early tomorrow and remove some of the lower pans underneath. What a story that will tell, huh?

Thanks again to everyone on this thread and in the forum. Indeed, you are the very best at what you do....namely, helping an ignorant Newbie like me maintain his sanity. God Bless you for it!
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Old 01-13-2006, 02:41 PM   #23
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At this point I would make a list

1. Rot - not sure what extent - even with an ice pick, you should assume there is more
2. Rough roads tell me a lot - if the shell is loosely attached to the frame (which it probably is because of the rot) all that damage you are seeing is explained by the contractor driving over the rough road - as a side note something you may want to do (and this will be fun) is hook up the trailer, you get in the trailer, and wife in the truck - go for a ride - you will see exactly whats bouncing around

So this is the list

1. Remove some or all of the interior
2. Check the frame - probably have broken welds from bad roads - rot puts that much more pressure on the frame because it is now two units rather than one.
3. Fix the frame - new paint would be nice
4. Fix the floor (can be done with shell on)
5. Refasten all the rivets that came loose in the wheel well
6. Put it all back together and enjoy.......

So if you up for the above, then I would tear into the belly.

May sound like a lot - and it is, but it is very doable - many of us have been there done that - in fact I would plan on the above for most any trailer over 20 or so years old. Not near as much money as time...

Ken
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Old 01-13-2006, 04:00 PM   #24
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How to Print This Stuff Out?

Hey, all...I don't want to forget everything you've all told me, and I surely want to keep track of those who have helped in this venture. May I ask another toddler question? How can I print this entire thread? I've looked for a print button or command, but can't seem to find one.
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Old 01-13-2006, 04:09 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sierrajb
Hey, all...I don't want to forget everything you've all told me, and I surely want to keep track of those who have helped in this venture. May I ask another toddler question? How can I print this entire thread? I've looked for a print button or command, but can't seem to find one.
Sierrajb,

Good question, I have used the print button on my browser to print the entire thread. I would like to know how to print just one post, however. Can anyone help me?

Bill
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Old 01-13-2006, 04:10 PM   #26
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push file - then scoll down to print
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Old 01-13-2006, 04:11 PM   #27
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Bill

I would think you could copy then paste it to a word file.....

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Old 01-13-2006, 04:32 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wkerfoot
Sierrajb,

Good question, I have used the print button on my browser to print the entire thread. I would like to know how to print just one post, however. Can anyone help me?

Bill
I am not certain whether this method will work with Macintosh operating systems, but with recent editions of the Microsoft Windows system, you can:
  • Use your mouse to left-click and drag to select the post that you wish to print.
  • Then go to the Menu Bar at the top of your Browser's Window, click on the File menu and select Print
  • In the Print dialogue box, find the Page Range box (on the General tab), click on the radio button next to Selection
  • Click Print, and only your selection should print.
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Old 01-13-2006, 04:46 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sierrajb
Thanks for sharing this "buyer's remorse" with my family. I'll let you know the date and time of the funeral.................
Looks like you have come to grips with you new project, we just picked up a 31' that had "soft" spot. We ended up taking out the first 5' if the floor and moving on!

What ever life throws at you, iffin ya don't like it fix it
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Old 01-13-2006, 05:01 PM   #30
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File...Print or Copy...Paste to Word

KenJ,
Just tried both ways, and either approach works. Be sure to set the printer to DRAFT so it won't take so long to print.

What will I do with all this info? I'm starting my very own notebook with photos, parts suppliers, THIS FORUM, etc. I'm sure that's not an original idea, especially with such an intelligent crowd as this.

Oh, by the way...did any of you miss this forum when it seemed to have gone "down" earlier today? Couldn't get to the website. Almost went into withdrawals, if you know what I mean!
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Old 01-13-2006, 05:25 PM   #31
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Here are two attachments to see options on the thread menu to be able to go to a thread print friendly screen. You will notice theres a show all threads two use to print in one attempt and not 3.
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Old 01-13-2006, 05:26 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sierrajb
Hey, all...I don't want to forget everything you've all told me, and I surely want to keep track of those who have helped in this venture. May I ask another toddler question? How can I print this entire thread? I've looked for a print button or command, but can't seem to find one.
At the top of the thread there is a "thread tools" click on it and it will give you a selection, try the Show Printable Version, hit print and see what comes out

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Old 01-13-2006, 06:49 PM   #33
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I win!

I know, I shouldn't take joy in misery (and really I'm NOT!), but I think your observations in the wheel well point to the shell shifting down on the street side. Even if you are not seeing rot from the inside floor out, I'd be willing to bet that there is rot UNDER the c-channel that holds the inner and outer skin to the floor. If you look at Airstream's website "building the airstream" section, you'll see that the trailer is a frame, with wood going all the way around the frame, and the shell mounts to the wood. If the wood rots under the c-chanel, you may not see that compression unless you take off the inner skin on the lower level only.... or if you can see if it looks like the inner skin sinks under the wood floor surface. If it looks like the wood is solid, then I'd also bet that your outriggers sagged or came off- dropping the shell down.

I'm curious what's under your belly wrap! Let us know your next step!

As an aside - if it's only the outriggers, then to "fix" the shell - I'd mount LONG 2x4's longitudially (front to back) on the upper ceiling, and put 4x4's on bottle jacks under that 2x4 right under where the ribs are. Then I'd slowly lift the shell from inside on the street side before welding up those outriggers. But first - I'd get some other opinions before trying this! I only slept in a Holiday Inn Express, but I think Andy told us a simular fix elsewhere.
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Old 01-13-2006, 06:51 PM   #34
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FIVE! Airstreams?

Quote:
Originally Posted by balrgn
...... we just picked up a 31' that had "soft" spot.....
What, ANOTHER ONE???!!! Somebody's got it bad! I'd be buying more too if I had the parking space.
Wheww.... good thing I don't!
Marc
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Old 01-13-2006, 08:16 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sierrajb
GT6921....The size of this spot is approximately 8" x 4". Is that large enough to compromise the integrity of the floor? Would you go to the trouble of replacing that small piece?

The OTHER SOFT SPOT (as mentioned earlier...see pics) is in the HW Heater compartment, along the outside wall very close to the rear bumper. This is definitely the most obvious...you can see the bumper through the hole about the size of your palm. Other wood along that wall looks worse than it is. Again, would you remove the entire bathroom to replace this piece, or use another case of that expandable foam? (ha!)

Our floor rot was about the same size (and appearance) as your pictures in our 63 Overlander so we initially thought it was going to be a simple plywood patching deal. Turned out to be rusted-through frames under that small rotten spot.Taking out the whole bathroom was in order for the job to be done right. Besides safety issues, a nice clean new bathroom is a good thing It sounds like you are going to be doing a thourough job with your inspection with safety in mind and you have come to the right place for solid advice. Don't get frustrated even if you need to do some furniture removal and welding. Almost all of us have "been there , done that" and those who haven't are headed there
By all means it doesn't have to be perfect, take the advice from the listee who said "just go camping"!
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Old 01-13-2006, 08:25 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sierrajb
Hi, all...I am heartbroken, sick to my stomach, depressed, scared...you name it. I feel like someone might feel who searched all his life for the perfect mate, married her, then 10 days later he discovers she only has a few days to live.
"And ya need a hand to hold..reach out.."
Check out this oldie by the the Four Tops, song #1, you know, like the forum, they'll be there for ya!
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Aren't these folks great?? Uh huh, Amen!
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Old 01-14-2006, 12:32 AM   #37
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To all, a good night!

It's now 1:25 am...You'll all be glad to know I've been bonding with my 67 for the past few hours. Where does the time go? Before I say good night, let me respond to a few previous posts from my new friends:

JPAIRSTREAM & WAHOONC...Thanks for the help with printing this thread. That's exactly what I was looking for. I owe you both.

MARC: Yup! Everything you say makes sense, except using the 2x4's on the inside to roll that shell back in place (if that becomes necessary)....I know what you're talking about, but I'm guessing you'll expect me to remove the inner panels before I use that wood, right? Also, I plan to remove the belly wrap AFTER I finish installing my new roof vents/gaskets, a few window clips (to pull them tight) and a door striker pocket. We're expecting rain in a couple of days, so I don't want to chance any more problems than I already have.

SQURLGURL: I can only HOPE my 67 is not that bad, but odds are it is. Whatever the case, I am confident this forum can hold my hand through it all. Thanks!

and then there's TIN SISTA: Love that spirit, girl! Keep us all lookin' good and lookin' up!

Gotta get some beauty sleep. Visit with you in a few hours..................
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Old 01-14-2006, 01:12 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sierrajb
MARC: Yup! Everything you say makes sense, except using the 2x4's on the inside to roll that shell back in place (if that becomes necessary)....I know what you're talking about, but I'm guessing you'll expect me to remove the inner panels before I use that wood, right?
I'll speak for Marc with a 'yup', as that brings up a topic I wanted to mention. Taking off those interior panels is not very hard. I used a sturdy paint scraper, slid up behind the panel against a rivet, and tapped it with a hammer. Pop, off comes the rivet. Repeat. It really goes quite quickly. Putting them back up also goes quickly, as long as you keep track of which side is up and where the panel came off from. Then the holes should line up and you rivet them right back on with a hand riveter.

However, looks like you have other stuff to investigate before you get quite that deep into it. I just wanted to mention it because when I did it I thought that was going to be a really big deal, but it turned out not to be. They were easy to take off and put back on. So that's one part that shouldn't scare you at all.
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Old 01-14-2006, 07:14 AM   #39
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I really agree with Marc - there could be a lot of rot under those C channels

Also - here we go with 10 different opinions - I would not use a paint scraper to cut rivets - yes it works - but it is better to drill them out because if you hit the rivet from the side and cut it , it tends to make the rivet hole larger - best to drill them out.

Ken
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Old 01-18-2006, 12:44 PM   #40
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Living in Rivetville (A Brief Update)

Hey, all...a brief update on my 67 Overlander. Work has prohibited me from having time to crawl under to drop the belly pan (BUT I WILL DO THAT SOON!). However, I've had time to go inside and take a closer look at all the rivets on the inside ceiling and walls.

The previous owner fried fish a lot in this craft, so there was a considerable amount of gunk to clean off the ceiling and walls. After a gallon of 409 Deep Cleaning spray and 2 dozen formerly-white-now-grease-colored terry cloths, I was able to methodically locate, drill out, and replace all missing, loose, or questionable rivets. Wanna guess how many rivets I replaced? Somewhere in the neighborhood of 40-50 (I purchased a box of 100, and it looks half gone).

Without a doubt the previous owner definitely allowed the baby to shake, rattle and roll on down the rough, rocky, country roads and highways of Texas. Everything I've seen, from loose or missing rivets (inside and out) to possibly loose or broken outriggers and a skin that's slipped to one side indicates much traveling without proper balancing of the running gear.

I'm almost finished making sure my vessel is not going to let in rain (when and IF it should rain in Texas this year). I have one more roof vent (called an "astrodome"?) to replace and four more window clips to install before I give it the garden hose test. If it passes, I'll be scheduling a time to drop that belly pan. THEN we'll all know for sure what's caused the ripples in the sides, the missing rivets, and the crack in the ceiling panel.

By the way....what's the best stuff to use for resealing the flashing on the roof vents? The old stuff looks dark gray (or black?), but it's dried up and flaking off. Someone said use "Kool Patch" or "Parbond." Can't find anything I'm happy with from Lowe's or Home Depot. Guess I'll stop by a nearby RV place on the way home. Any words of wisdom?
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