PO Sub-floor cover up

[Isuzusweet]

Originally Posted by continentsco

Next question. And getting ahead of myself. If the interior width, i.e, from the interior side of the exterior wall to the other interior of exterior wall (if that makes sense) is 8 ft, but the width between C channels (road side to curb side) is only 7 3/4ft, how do i get a 8ft wide piece of plywood into that gap? I know I could do 4 and 4, but ideally id like one piece of 8x4 to go the entire width of the trailer so the entire front section of shell is connected to the same piece of wood.

Lets see what you got now.

If I were you this is what I'd do.....I'd first buy Coosa board, Bluewater 20 or 26 if you want the extra strength......

http://coosacomposites.com/products/...uewater-panels

I would then make a template of the front and rear curved section with a bit more, say 4-6" into the straight part of the body (more if you need to get to a structural support for attaching purposes). Since the piece will have big curves on both ends it will swing/slip into the channel on both sides and the front/rear. Fasten both ends first making sure the center section measurements are true and square. Make sure you use a half lap joint on the edge of the Coosa that faces the center section. I would then make the center section with outer pieces going to the frame rail and a big center piece fitting inbetween the outer sections. Again you want to half lap all joints, so when you fasten down through the lap joint it fastens both sheets at the same time (cuts down on fasteners and is easier.

Just to be clear a half lap joint is the same cut (50% of material thickness) routered into both pieces that will attach to each other. When you flip the one piece over the pieces fit together. I used a 3/4" half lap.

I would not recommend trying to insert a 4' sheet into one side of the channel and then try to bend the sheet into the other channel.....It may work with Coosa, but most likely not as the bend would have to be significant; it could get hung up and then distort the channel, blowing out the sides of the trailer, etc etc.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f311...me-106269.html

I made the mistake of writting 1/2" lap joints instead of 3/4" lap joints. I had 1/2 lap on the brain.


Cheers
Tony

[DavidsonOverlander]

I replaced the floor in our '74 Sovereign without removing the shell. I started at the back and moved toward the front, keeping remnants of the plywood floor in place where the C-channel connected to the outriggers until I was ready to replace that portion. In my opinion, if you're going to replace the front and back you should do the whole floor, especially if the existing floor is OSB. I found that the walls would spread enough to get the full width of each floor piece inserted into the C-channel without cutting the plywood down the middle.
Not sure about 80's trailers, but on our Overlander the crossmembers were set lower at the points where the pieces of plywood were joined to allow for a double thickness at the joint. In the photo below you can see a joint with plywood doubler below over a lower crossmember, then a regular height crossmember and in the foreground another lowered crossmember.
I treated the top of the floor and the underside in about a foot all around with West System epoxy. I also used epoxy and screws at the joints to fasten the two layers together, so the floor is, in effect, like one big piece of plywood.

[continentsco]

Well then. Talk about information overload.

All of the information is great. I have seen Coosa talked about several times but haven't gone to see it in person so I will do that over thanksgiving once i get the skins off and check out how much rot I have.

As far as joints go, I don't know what any of that means so I will be researching that as well. We will leave the kitchen side of the AS intact and not touch that but the shower and bathroom will be coming out next week and I will end up replacing all of that section as well. I would assume we will replace 80% of the floor. I know people say go all the way but we need to hit the road by July of next year (we will be full timing for a while) and 80% of it done properly compared to none of it (apparently) done properly is a huge step in the right direction.

Interesting point about the lowered crossmembers so I will check that when I get to those sections.

We can't work on it on Tuesdays and Wednesdays so once we get back in on Thursday and spend a few hours in there then I will have more information for you. I am nervous about taking off the front skin under the window around the fuse box. I know NOTHING about electricity and fuses apart from if they work, i don't need to learn anything so I really hope I don't mess anything up around there.

[DavidsonOverlander]

Take lots of photos, make lots of notes, and label everything you take apart so you know where to put it back.

[Belegedhel]

One thing for sure, is that if the trailer is that rotted, then there must be many leaks. So something you can do a little at a time while you are doing your research on the floor, is tackle all the door, window, and hatch seals, and try to get the shell completely leak free. No sense in laying a new floor, only to get it soaked with the first good rain.

good luck!

[Dingo Girl]

I did mine shell on and put it in with out splitting the sheets.
Start with the ends first then the center sections.
Take out your window screens or you will likely tear them. Open the side windows also. I could see one getting broken wrestling the sheets back in.
Good luck with your project!

[perryg114]

Best way to find leaks is to pull the inner skins below the windows and look for leaks during a long soaking rain. Another way is to pressurize the inside of the trailer with something like a leaf blower and spray the skin with soap and see where there are bubbles.

Perry

[continentsco]

Okay. So here is an update after a couple hours work on it tonight.



We pulled the front and right skin off and detached the skin right next to the door but didn't slide it out from behind the door frame - we are hoping we have access enough to the bolts behind the skin without having to completely disconnect that one. Airstreams are put together to the centimeter. It's incredible how tight and perfectly everything fits.



There is, as expected the same amount of rot on the right as there was on the left. The guy who patched it did put the plywood patch under the door frame and screwed through it to the floor but then decided not to the rest of the way around.



What are these rusted big bolts that are sticking straight up??



Question. Does this skin that runs down the road side of the trailer go the entire length of the trailer? It seems like it is one piece but we lose it when it goes behind the shower. We hoped it wasn't so we could disconnect it down to the fridge and replace all of that flooring, without having to completely disconnect it all. Could we cut the aluminum and then run a seal between the pieces? Should we?

The plan now is to take the banana wraps off to access the bolts, drill out the rivets to the belly pan and then remove all the flooring in the front section of the trailer.

[DavidsonOverlander]

Originally Posted by continentsco

Question. Does this skin that runs down the road side of the trailer go the entire length of the trailer? It seems like it is one piece but we lose it when it goes behind the shower. We hoped it wasn't so we could disconnect it down to the fridge and replace all of that flooring, without having to completely disconnect it all. Could we cut the aluminum and then run a seal between the pieces? Should we?

On our Sovereign that strip was all one piece. I don't see any problem with cutting it if you need to, then when you reinstall run a piece of aluminum to back up the cut and rivet them together.

[Al Boondy]

Those bolts are called elevator bolts and they connect the shell and floor to the frame outriggers. They are bent to prevent the nuts from loosening and you'll have to break or cut them. I used bolt cutters placed inside channel.

Can you cut skin? Yes.
Should you? Not unless you can make the splice as strong as original skin is.
Interior skins are part of the structure and that long vertical skin helps prevent sagging. The rear of my trailer started to sag and the outer skin started to buckle at the wheel wells when I removed lower skin.

It is important to block up rear end before removing inner skins on the longer airstreams.

[Belegedhel]

Yes, if you need to, you can cut the interior skin, and then stitch it back together with a doubler inside the wall and some pop rivets. Plan your cut to be behind furniture or inside cabinetry, and nobody will ever know.

The piece if interior skin that is still attached at the door frame has rivets holding it in place that are hidden by the interior door frame. Basically, what looks like a "frame" is a piece of trim with a roughly "L" shaped profile. To remove it, you will need to drill out some pop rivets on the inside of the door frame, and then pry it out of the groove it sits down into.

As mentioned above, the heads of those long rusty boltsare inside the bellypan, at the tips of the outriggers. IF you grab hold of the long bent part of the bolt sticking up with some vice-grips and bend it back and forth, it will probably snap off. You still moght have to get nasty with it to get the nut off the bolt. First try a bunch of penetrating oil, and after that, move to cutters, grinders, and explosives.

good luck!

[continentsco]

Well. We have done some work this morning and here is an update. We have taken it to the in-laws for the week of thanksgiving.




We have taken off the banana wraps and the underside trim and dropped it. The insulation was a little moldy so that'll be replaced. That whole section will be cleaned out as well. Turns out the front section has rotted wood and the section further back towards the door has no wood. He must have just ripped it out and left the bolts there.

I assume these are the elevator bolts? I will cut and then remove each of them. It looks like the elevator bolts stop around the front/battery compartment area and are just held in with lug nuts. Is this right?





We took all the window screens off and then got a hose and soaked the outside. There were several leaks, some need new gaskets so we may as well replace them all and then some are old rivet holes that need new sealant.



We are taking out the bathroom as well to check flooring underneath it. And then probably end up reworking it a little. I'm sure that happens all the time ha. Typical.

[Isuzusweet]

Be careful when removing that curved wall piece of the shower as it's ABS plastic and due to age, very fragile. Very tough to fix if you crack it. Get as many people as you need to make sure it is well supported.

Cheers
Tony

[perryg114]

Frame and c-channel look pretty good.

Perry

[continentsco]

Originally Posted by Al Boondy

Those bolts are called elevator bolts and they connect the shell and floor to the frame outriggers. They are bent to prevent the nuts from loosening and you'll have to break or cut them. I used bolt cutters placed inside .

You used the bolt cutters for the screws or the square bolt?

[Al Boondy]

Originally Posted by continentsco

You used the bolt cutters for the screws or the square bolt?

I used bolt cutters on the bolts. I was able to unscrew most of the screws, some I cut with a dremell tool .

[continentsco]

Awesome. Thanks. What did you do if there was wood in the channel?

Also, I went to lowes last night to look for elevator bolts. I found some but they had a much bigger head on them so that wouldn't work. Could I use other screws? Why did they use the flat head?

[continentsco]

For the life of me I cannot get this out! Help!

[wander-west]

I think an oscillating cutting tool like Fien or Festool will make quick progress in that task.

[Al Boondy]

Since the PO installed the subfloor incorrectly and notched around the old bolts I was able to remove screws and slide plywood out first then cut the bolts. If plywood still there you'll have to remove the bolt first. A sawsall,
Or a grinder with cut off disk can be used or even vice grips to bend back and forth.
The elevator bolts are used sometimes to bolt plywood to frame rails and the large flat head countersinks well. Regular carriage bolts should work for outriggers but elevator bolts work better for plywood to frame rails. You can also use self tapping trailer floor screws for this.
You can get elevator bolts here:
http://www.vintagetrailersupply.com/...-p/vts-375.htm