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59toaster · 09-25-2003, 07:06 PM

Bob:

Thanks for the heads up. I have not worked with this type of product before. I had a few concerns that you have helped with. I will be working outside in mid 70's temperatures so ventilation should not be an issue. I'll keep the mixed quantities to a minimum.

My main concern is to seal the decking. I wanted to do as much as I can to prevent future rot cause by water leaks that will inevitably happen. Appearence is not of concern. There will be a Vinyl flooring installed over it. Eventually a wood laminate or possibly Cork flooring in the main areas of the coach over that.

markdoane · 09-25-2003, 07:32 PM

Canoe'stream,
Thanks for the info. Read the book-very informative. The ClearCoat sounds like the product to use for coating plywood. If I did one side, cost would be about $150. Weight addition would be about 15 lbs. That sounds very attractive.

greg176 · 09-25-2003, 07:47 PM

The SystemThree book is great -it is the book I used when I rebuilt my boat.

CanoeStream · 09-25-2003, 08:03 PM

You shell-off adventuresome folks are ahead of the game in ability to follow leaks in the long term -- the downfall with any system. You have a plan anyway.

Mixing and applying epoxy isn't really offensive to breathing. Ventilation requirements are modest at this point. Don't panic if you get a little on your skin. Wash the area with soap and water as soon as reasonable. Just don't leave it sit there.

Don't expect epoxy to soak in much more than a sixteenth of an inch in softwoods. End grain and rotary cut plywood veneers absorb a fair amount. Before the material sets re-wet the surface when it looks dry and soaked in. That way you will end up with a solid plastic barrier. I would avoid quick setting formulas. Even slow set can be worked with the next day (though I find medium SystemThree works fine for me). If you mix more than 1/2 cup at a time, do so in a broad flat container so heat is spread out. Look at cheap paint roller frames and thin foam rollers for applying to broad plywood surfaces. You'll figure it out...

Using a floor system with adhesives would probably turn out best if you tried it first on plywood samples you epoxy treated the same way. Be sure you've washed off the amine blush layer (oily surface feel) and probably sanded to give the surface some "tooth."

BTW -- I don't know that the low viscosity Clear Coat is really what you'd want. You'll get a good result with the normal System Three Resin. It is the consistency of warm honey when mixed. You can stop short of the full-build decoupage thicknesses -- which is done by adding another layer or two after the first one sets (follow instructions for recoating).

And 59toaster -- just where do you come by temps in the mid-70's????

59toaster · 09-25-2003, 09:22 PM

Quote:

And 59toaster -- just where do you come by temps in the mid-70's????

Yeah really got chillie here the last couple weeks. Might even need a light jacket in the mornings next week. Another cold front coming through this weekend Got cold like Summer in Detroit! Probably have to put the hard top on the truck for the season around Holloween this year. Don't think I'll make mid Nov like we did last year. Feels like a cold winter and might get another blizard (6-7 inches) and be out of work for a week like back in 95

SO glad my folks got sick of the snow back in 79 and moved us down here.

59toaster · 09-26-2003, 06:56 PM

Anybody else having problems finding 5/8's ply?

I checked several places and even tried to order it and for what ever reason I can't find it here. Ended up going to 3/4.

I understand the center U-Channel has a lip on it that wraps under the deck. I'll have to take the router and mill it backdown to 5/8's. Not happy about the extra weight but what else can I do?

markdoane · 09-26-2003, 08:03 PM

I don't know that your model has the channel that the plywood fits into. On mine, the channel just sits on top of the floor. You may still need to thin it down if you want the original rivet holes to line up.
But if you're redoing the belly pan that won't be a problem.
Haven't tried to find 5/8 lately, but didn't have any problem when I remodelled my bathroom a few years back. Maybe the problem is Isabel? I know 5/8 is a common thickness, did you ask for 19/32?

59toaster · 09-26-2003, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by markdoane
I don't know that your model has the channel that the plywood fits into. On mine, the channel just sits on top of the floor. You may still need to thin it down if you want the original rivet holes to line up.
But if you're redoing the belly pan that won't be a problem.
Haven't tried to find 5/8 lately, but didn't have any problem when I remodelled my bathroom a few years back. Maybe the problem is Isabel? I know 5/8 is a common thickness, did you ask for 19/32?

Only Thing I could come up with in 5/8's that was void free was OSB. I asked what was the next size up and all they had that wasn't a finish grade like a maple veneer was the 3/4. Nice and clean on one side, reasonable on the other.

Have you priced it yet? Guy was telling me the price has gone up 50% in the last 3 months due to the demand the military has and it's going to Iraq.

markdoane · 09-26-2003, 10:33 PM

I guess I'll be happy to use 19/32" C-C plugged, group 1, Exterior grade. It may not be pretty. Make sure you get APA quality standard. I don't want to go to all this work and use a material I would have doubts about.

59toaster · 09-29-2003, 07:05 PM

I'm to that "what the hell am I doing" point. Now 1.5 days behind.

Have 12 ft of rivits to drill and the body is free of the floor.

I have some corrosion to the aluminum in a couple of places. one appears to be a reaction to chemicals from the toilet so either the tank is leaking or the seal from the toilet to the tank was bad. I think the later is the case.

Some of the corrosion is from electolisis and a electrical fire....yes a electrical fire. Something shorted out on the main plug for juice to the coach. At that point the PO put a very dangerious set up on that has the potential to leave a hot set of mail plug!

So what is the "Propper" plug I need for the coach?

Do I need to do anything to nutralize this corrosion to prevent future problems?

Left side is chemical reaction right side is electrical.

thenewkid64 · 09-29-2003, 07:49 PM

As you are doing a complete refurb.................

The proper AC power cord would be a 30 AMP one. Get a standard 25 foot extension form CW and lop off the female end. Gives you a molded plug and the proper gauge wires.

OR

You could get a chrome 30 AMP marine shore power coneector and have a marine style power cord. This is how many of the new units are setup. It eliminates the opening up of the electrical system when it is time for a new cord. The plate and connector should cover the hole from the old cable.

Option one is low cost, option two tends to run about double option one.

There was a thread that talked about the corrosion and how to stop it but I cannot remeber where it is.

59toaster · 09-29-2003, 08:18 PM

Found one addressing this same corrosion from William Henshall for over a year ago.

http://www.airforums.com/forum...ight=corrosion

It has a few good tips.

59toaster · 09-30-2003, 07:12 PM

Update 9/30/03

Body is off.

They did some weird stuff on our unit I think. Several of the ribs were riveted to the belly pan before the skin was put on. started lifting it and found theat. Real fun drinning out a rivet from the back side!

Finnaly got that done and at 6:30 the frame was out from under the body. Now I have a nice shinny Gazebo on our front lawn.

Tomorrow the floor get ripped up. Taking the baby over to Grandmas at 9:30 am for the day. Chili Pepper is going to start sealing the ply wood while I get the deck off. HAVE TO HAVE THE BODY BACK ON BY SUNDAY! looks like a few long days of work ahead!

markdoane · 09-30-2003, 08:45 PM

WOW! looks great. I spent the last few days (when it was warm enough) stripping the frame. Going to put "slippers" over the front frame where it's rusted. Got some 12 ga. U channels made which fit over the frame. Planning to weld them up in a couple of weeks. Meanwhile, waiting for new axle (5200#) and greywater tank.
Picture of frame repair channels:

markdoane · 10-01-2003, 07:11 AM

Hey 59Toaster,
When you get a moment, give us a daily update. Following your progress with great interest.
Had an idea for the floor: Once you get the body back on and screwed down, run a fillet of epoxy up against the floor channel to seal it against water getting under the channel. Kind of like a cove base. I guess you could use Vulkem, but why not go first class,
Then I thought, why not just pour the floor channel completely full of epoxy resin. Would cetainly seal it and stabilize everything with a kind of rim loist.
Then I thought-WOW, and I getting out of control with this project or what?
LOL

CanoeStream · 10-01-2003, 06:14 PM

Of course "The Epoxy Book" would tell you how to modify the material for fillets -- using certain fillers to make a thixotropic blend.

With the small movements that will occur between your major subassemblies I wouldn't bank on a rigid material like epoxy to keep a seal. ... yes, I knew you were kidding.

Temps are high enough to use epoxy when the water in the birdbath is "un-thawed." ( a real Minnesota-ism! )

59toaster · 10-01-2003, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by markdoane
Hey 59Toaster,
When you get a moment, give us a daily update. Following your progress with great interest.
Had an idea for the floor: Once you get the body back on and screwed down, run a fillet of epoxy up against the floor channel to seal it against water getting under the channel. Kind of like a cove base. I guess you could use Vulkem, but why not go first class,
Then I thought, why not just pour the floor channel completely full of epoxy resin. Would cetainly seal it and stabilize everything with a kind of rim loist.
Then I thought-WOW, and I getting out of control with this project or what?
LOL

I had put some thought to ideas like that and came up with a few problems.

Sealing wall: Most leaks from the outer skin work between the wall and then come out from under the wall. Sealing that may cause a leak to go un-noticed for a long time.

Filling the U-channel: Simular problems. The wood is under the track so filling the chanel you still have the potential for water between the channel and the wood.

I want to see leaks. I want it running out from where ever the leak is and my feet wet so I know it's happening as soon as it happens. That way I can fix the minor problem before it becomes a major problem.

I think the best bet is still the epoxy and fully seal the plywood. Then leave the rest as it was designed.

Todays update:

Took the youngest to Grand-ma's for the day so both Chilie (Janice) and I could work on it and try to make up time. We didn't make up time but both of us being able to work on it kept us from getting any more behind.

Belly pan fought us tooth and rivet! It took us 4 hours to get that thing off. All the rivets at the center seam were seel shank so made it a pain to drill them. It now lays becide the frame.

Pulled out a nice size bee hive. All dead. My Fater-in-law killed them but the bodies and hive were still in there. Speaks for keeping holes in the pan repaired and to a minimum!

Looks like my luck is on the upswing. Frame looks in pretty good condition. YEAHHHHHHHH! I have one cross member to replace. The very last one is done. Thats where the worst unchecked leak was. Looks like Gregs. Surpisingly the frame appears ok. About 2 hours to replace it and it will be fine. Rust is minimal everywhere. All surface for the most part and what is pitted is not deep or in critical places so I can sand blast it and paint and be ok.

Our step is not original. My wife says that's the only one she ever remembers. So the PO to my PO did that in. The current set is about 3-4 inches less in width and fits between the brackets from the original. The replacement the step was solely suported by the wood that was rotten. I'll be welding in a suport plate for that or we may try to find a step at the local RV place that is the original width. What we have is not to bad of shape but new would save me some sand blasting and painting. Couple extra inches would also be nice fore entry. See what they have in stock in the morning when I go get the steel.

Started documenting where stuff goes like U-Channel and what peice goes where. Just need to get the placement of the holes we need for stuff like black water outlet, drain lines etc measured for placement and size. Make the templets of the corners and the deck can come off. Hope to be painting it tomorrow afternoon.

We also managed to get the epoxy on the bottom facing side of the new wood. So hopefully I can bolt on the new deck Friday morning and throw the top coat on. Then have it cured enough for me to put the vinyl floor down before dark. While it's drying I can fix the problems with the belly pan on the grass and get it ready to go.

Saturday I'm going to see if Grandma can watch the youngest again so we can tag team it and make sure Sunday we can drop the body back on. Supose to have some rain on Monday. Needs to be buttoned up by then.

Here is a shot of Chili Pepper drill rivets.

59toaster · 10-01-2003, 07:05 PM

Bee Hive when we dropped the pan.

59toaster · 10-01-2003, 07:09 PM

Bee Hive loose. It's about 14x18 inches close to 4 inches thick.

Sending it to the sicence teacher at the oldests school. She didn't like the huge horned beatle we sent last time....she should love this!

markdoane · 10-01-2003, 07:24 PM

You sure are making great progess.
I was kidding about the epoxy. Started out as a "what if" and evolved into something much more dangerous and ludicrous.
I only found a few small mud-dabber nests in my belly pan.
Regarding the step, mine is broken but can be repaired easily with a few stitches. Original design wasn't that great. Broke at the back of the slot. If you decide to make your own it's pretty simple. I can send you a drawing if you want.
I've decided to upgrade my axle to 5200# and add a leaf to the springs. That will let me add some of the improvements I have planned.
Too cold in Minnesota to work outside. Below freezing last night and a hard freeze tonight.
How are you proceeding with the longer hitch?