Free 7 Day Trial RV GPS App RV Trip Planner Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Free 7 Day Trial ×
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-31-2009, 10:49 AM   #21
1 Rivet Member
 
1965 20' Globetrotter
Bend , Oregon
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9
To Shari/InsideOut

In reply to InsideOut:
Leaving that small band of remaining wood provides access to the bolts? No need to drop the belly pan? If this is right....Woohoo! I'm gonna give that a shot. I'll let you know where that leads me. Thanks.
c-beast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2009, 01:54 PM   #22
1 Rivet Member
 
1965 20' Globetrotter
Bend , Oregon
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9
RJohans and C-beast the same dude!

(Sorry 'bout any confusion regarding my multiple identities...)

Okay, now I'm really in the soup. Thanks to Shari/InsideOut's recommendation, I was able to remove most of the back floor section to reveal... a frame riddled with rust. Gee, what a surprise.

Though the front 75% of the subfloor seems in good shape, can I assume that the the frame under the floor is just as bad as the back 25%? I have a sinking feeling that I'm headed towards a frame-off resto...
c-beast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2009, 06:14 PM   #23
1 Rivet Member
 
1965 20' Globetrotter
Bend , Oregon
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9
Okay, I've cut away the bulk of the rotten floor, but I still cannot see how to get the remaining wood out from between the c-channel and the frame/chassis. I've got bolts and screws holding the c-channel to the floor.

But check me on this:

It appears that the subfloor is bolted to the frame/chassis, THEN the entire shell construction actually sits on the subfloor and is held fast via bolts and screws through the c-channel. (I think this is what Marcus/utee94 was talking about in a previous reply.)

If the floor actually supports the entire shell, how can I remove it without the weight of the shell compressing that 5/8 or 3/4"? Is this the argument for removing the shell BEFORE tacking the floor?
c-beast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2009, 06:55 PM   #24
4 Rivet Member
 
1963 28' Ambassador
Vintage Kin Owner
Northern VT , Vermont
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 360
c-beast, I'm on the last [rear] panel of floor on a '64 safari. I've replaced the complete floor, body on the frame. I'm convinced it would have been easyer and probably faster to remove the shell. I hope to find and rebuild another, it will be body off! On or off frame here's some tips that I found to late. Check your entry door alignment befor you remove the floor panel in front of it. The door frame bolts through the floor, probably does not bolt through an outrigger, and the floor is rotted at that anchor point which allows it to move. When you find the right position measure the distance between the aluminum BODY frame bows at floor level street side to curb side, measure between the bows on both sides of the door frame This will tell you exactly the plywood width you will need for this section, & where to bolt your door frame on the new floor. Theres very little + or - room on this panel. My original floor sheets had 1" "ship lap joints", all joints glued, bolted and centered on crossmembers, 45yrs later rock solid! The problem is the original sheets were 49 inches wide not todays standard of 48"s. A $10.00 router bit will make the joint but it takes some finessing to make all joints come out on a crossmember. As soon as you remove a section of floor cut a piece of it to slide back into the space between the C-chanel and frame outrigger, otherwise the body will "settle" a little making it more difficult to slid the new floor into place. Make sure your entry step assembly is perfect and PAINTED befor you lay new floor over it. I freaked out on my frame too, tail end looked bad. After I got the floor out it was OK and most of the rest still had paint! I found a way to do the floor with only 4 seams, let me know if that would be usefull to you. Good luck and do'nt forget, everbody wants one, you've got one!
putback is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 09:00 AM   #25
Rivet Master
 
InsideOut's Avatar

 
1956 22' Safari
Vintage Kin Owner
Conifer/Evergreen , Colorado
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 12,443
Images: 108
I'm sure others are in similar situations....

Quote:
Originally Posted by putback View Post
I've replaced the complete floor, body on the frame. I'm convinced it would have been easyer and probably faster to remove the shell.
I concur! It certainly would be easier to remove the entire shell when doing a floor replacement - however, not everybody has the space to store the shell out of harms way while working on the floor/frame. We would have loved to take it off - but without a barn or very large yard, it just wasn't feasible. It was also a long term replacement - not just done in a couple of weekends due to other "life commitments". So, that being the case, we worked out a way to improvise leaving the shell on with great success. It's not been the easiest way - but it worked - and worked well!

Shari
__________________
Vintage Airstream Club - Past President 2007/2008
WBCCI #1824 - DenCO Unit Past President (2005)
AIR #30 - Join Date: 2-25-2002

RMVAC | ACI - CO Unit (Formerly WBCCI) | BIRDY - our 1956 Safari | 1964 Serro Scotty
InsideOut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 09:31 AM   #26
Rivet Master
 
pbearsailor's Avatar
 
1957 22' Caravanner
Port Hadlock , Washington
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 864
RJ, I posted this yesterday, but it got lost in the forum troubles.

You asked about getting the elevator bolts out. Best tip I found on that and the one I used on mine was to get a 1" hole saw and use it without the pilot bit to drill out the wood around the elevator bolts. Just drill right over the top of them. Skill saw to cut around the perimeter and then the old plywood just lifts out. The old elevator bolts left behind can then be snapped off with a pair of vise grips.

My subfloor was attached to the c channel with wood screws and through bolts. The screws came right out and the bolts came in from the bottom and can be snapped off like the elevator bolts with the vise grips.

cheers,
steve
__________________
Forum Thread: First She Had to Take a Ride on a Boat

Blog: My 57 Caravanner
pbearsailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 10:21 AM   #27
3 Rivet Member
 
1966 26' Overlander
1963 24' Tradewind
1990 34' Limited
Cape Coral , Florida
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 224
When I removed the old deck on mine I also dealt with the elevator bolts by using a hole saw. It worked very well. But, be careful. I initially thought that I would be able to feel a change in resistance when I hit the metal frame. Wrong. I quickly learned to keep the drill vertical to the surface and quit based on depth. Wasn't the end of the world to have to weld in patches but saved time not to have to.
dieseleagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 10:57 AM   #28
4 Rivet Member
 
dnrtheil's Avatar
 
1964 24' Tradewind
Portage , Michigan
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 332
Images: 23
I just finished up replacing the floor in the back of our '64 Tradewind. The floor was bed enough the elevator bolts were not a problem as far as getting the old wood out, Vise grips were used to break the bolts in half one the wood was removed. I also removed the lower interior panels and exterior rub-trim. I also remove about 18" of one vertical rib, doing this I was able to install the new plywood down in one piece. The rib was put back in place with aluminum panel glue and a couple of exterior rivets where the original rivets were located.

If your interested, here is the link to the photos I have taken of this project: Airstream Bathroom pictures by dnrtheil - Photobucket

Derek
__________________
Operation "SAVE RUDY" Strike Team (Associate Member)
dnrtheil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 11:13 AM   #29
Rivet Master
 
utee94's Avatar
 
1963 26' Overlander
Austin , Texas
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,640
Quote:
Originally Posted by InsideOut View Post
I concur! It certainly would be easier to remove the entire shell when doing a floor replacement - however, not everybody has the space to store the shell out of harms way while working on the floor/frame. We would have loved to take it off - but without a barn or very large yard, it just wasn't feasible. It was also a long term replacement - not just done in a couple of weekends due to other "life commitments". So, that being the case, we worked out a way to improvise leaving the shell on with great success. It's not been the easiest way - but it worked - and worked well!

Shari
Yes, this!

I would have loved to be able to pop the shell off, then I could have done the entire floor at once rather than half and half.

And you know, having a rotisserie to mount the de-shelled frame and flip it over and back sure would have made for much easier and quicker frame cleaning, welding, repainting, and bellypan installation as well.

But, we don't all have access to the same resources, whether that's space, equipment, time, or money. Doing it shell-on is the only way for some people, and it can be done, and done well.
utee94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2009, 06:52 PM   #30
4 Rivet Member
 
1963 28' Ambassador
Vintage Kin Owner
Northern VT , Vermont
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 360
I was able to get all the bolts with 4 1/2 " angle grinder from topside. Used a thick [1/4" ?] disc for all elevator bolts on the interior side of the c-chanel, grind down the ctr with the edge of the disc & tap the bolt shaft down with a punch. On the parimiter inside the c-chanel the bolts came up from the bottom. I used a thin [1/8" ?] disc. There was just enough room to slice off the side of the nut knock & it off the bolt with a punch, then drive the bolt down. Had washers under the nuts in the c-chanel so did'nt have to worry about cutting down though the chanel. Had to go slow & carefull cutting inside the chanel. If the disc catches and skips out it would slice the aluminum.
putback is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2009, 12:03 AM   #31
2 Rivet Member
 
65Safari65's Avatar
 
1965 22' Safari
Staunton , Virginia
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 71
More subfloor fun!

I'm in the middle of the same project on my 65 Safari- I think I had about the same amount of subfloor to replace. I removed the belly pan and black tank, and the most annoying part of that was the "blind rivets" on the radius. I then made a cut across the floor with a circular saw set to 5/8"- for the last 3" or so on each side, I used a handsaw "upside down" (pushing up toward the edge). This gave me a pretty clean cut with just a couple of splinters at the edge. I then cut down the middle of the bad floor to the end of the trailer. I considered trying to cut around the elevator bolts, but ended up deciding on a less delicate method... a floor jack pushing up from underneath. The bolts just rip through the old wood and then get snipped off with a bolt cutter. I first had to detach the C-channel from the back (just a few rivets), and my floor was bad enough so that the bolts around the edge weren't really doing anything anymore.
The frame right under the bath was a little ugly, but will clean up with POR15 and some new paint.

I'll be doing a different thread at some point about why if you think maybe should replace your axle, then you should do it right away. We did a 30K 2 1/2 year trip in ours with the original axle that "checked out fine". The curb side was bottoming out and we ended up with two cracks in the frame- one at each end of the axle plate! Both are repairable and we replaced our axle along the way, but it would have been nice to avoid the associated fun by knowing enough to replace it before we left.

Are you going to sandwich insulation between the wood and the frame? It seems that mine was there primarily as a habitat for small rodents of the 1970s. I do feel like there should be something there, though.

My elevator bolts get here this week (Vintage Trailer Supply), and then the reconstruction begins!
65Safari65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2009, 01:40 AM   #32
2 Rivet Member
 
Currently Looking...
Arlington , Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 39
I love vintage Airstreams, but stories of rusted frames give me nightmares. So I hesitate going down the restoration path. Why didn't Airstream galvanize the frames when they were manufactured? I know it adds cost, but who wants to replace a frame ever? Are the frames in the current line still ungalvanized?
Dismayed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2009, 11:05 AM   #33
Rivet Master
 
Wabbiteer's Avatar
 
1973 27' Overlander
1972 29' Ambassador
Itasca , Minnesota
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,044
Images: 2
Blog Entries: 2
Not meaning to sound harsh but if the trailer is cared for, stored & maintained reasonably... Its indifferent owners/users that kill trailers. Galvanized steel spars, frame and outriggers will not stop seams and gaskets from leaking or caulked joint from failing. Wet rotting floors and corroded aluminum would still happen, and zinc reacts with aluminum just as bad or worse than iron since it is more easily leached and moved by acid rain's weak electrolyte action.

Indifferent owner example: it's great to have a salt-water view for a winter season, who cares the sea-spray is eating the trailer. Or more common but as bad or worse, the long term toity leak with uric acid and salts wicking through insulation everywhere in the aft section - soon the animal smell makes the trailer get used less, just parked out back for years and a frame restoration sequence is irretrievably initiated.

One thing to look at is Aluminum was once an expensive rarity and iron was dirt cheap, as was labor. The modern threshold of pain in our 'consumer side' discard society was unheard of. I'm proud to restore my 27' yet get nauseus thinking of it being sold and resold until its back in the hands of apes like those that allowed it to get so bad..
__________________
The days are short and the night is long and the stars go tumbling by.. . ~Airstream~
Wabbiteer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2009, 12:47 PM   #34
2 Rivet Member
 
Currently Looking...
Arlington , Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 39
Most 40 - 50 year old Airstreams have probably been owned by apes at some point. But I want one, but perhaps as my second AS. I'll look for something more recent to get me started.

I do enjoy reading the restoration threads, but I can't see how I'd get the time to do this myself at this point in my life.
Dismayed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2009, 10:16 PM   #35
1 Rivet Member
 
1965 20' Globetrotter
Bend , Oregon
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9
Hello 65Safari65...

I did not have much trouble with elevator bolts within the "field" of subfloor. My problem was getting to those INSIDE the c-channel. As suggested by "Putback" (the only one who understood my dilemma), I used a grinder to remove the exposed rusted stem and nut of each bolt from above, then drove them down and out with a punch. What a bleepin' hassle. But it's done...
c-beast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2009, 06:38 AM   #36
Rivet Master
 
utee94's Avatar
 
1963 26' Overlander
Austin , Texas
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,640
Quote:
Originally Posted by c-beast View Post
Hello 65Safari65...

I did not have much trouble with elevator bolts within the "field" of subfloor. My problem was getting to those INSIDE the c-channel. As suggested by "Putback" (the only one who understood my dilemma), I used a grinder to remove the exposed rusted stem and nut of each bolt from above, then drove them down and out with a punch. What a bleepin' hassle. But it's done...
Most of my bolts inside the channel broke off from above with a pair of vice grips, just as the ones in the "field" broke off from below. There were a couple in very hard to reach spaces where I had to grind them out.

But it was the slotted screws in the curved corner section that were much more difficult for me. Many of them were heavily corroded in place, and wouldn't budge. The subfloor sections in the corners were pretty rotten, so I ended up tearing out the floor, and then I had access to the threaded sections of those screws, and was able to turn them out using vice grips and penetrating oil.

-Marcus
utee94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2009, 11:43 AM   #37
Rivet Master
 
InsideOut's Avatar

 
1956 22' Safari
Vintage Kin Owner
Conifer/Evergreen , Colorado
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 12,443
Images: 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by c-beast View Post
Hello 65Safari65...

I did not have much trouble with elevator bolts within the "field" of subfloor. My problem was getting to those INSIDE the c-channel. As suggested by "Putback" (the only one who understood my dilemma), I used a grinder to remove the exposed rusted stem and nut of each bolt from above, then drove them down and out with a punch. What a bleepin' hassle. But it's done...
Not so...having "been there, done that" there are many who understand the dilemma. We ground (or broke off) the bolts from the underside once the middle of the floor was removed. The couple of inch band that remained after using the saw along the perimeter gave us enough access to the underside. Whatever - as long as you found something that worked for you...

Shari
__________________
Vintage Airstream Club - Past President 2007/2008
WBCCI #1824 - DenCO Unit Past President (2005)
AIR #30 - Join Date: 2-25-2002

RMVAC | ACI - CO Unit (Formerly WBCCI) | BIRDY - our 1956 Safari | 1964 Serro Scotty
InsideOut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2009, 05:50 AM   #38
Rivet Master
 
Wabbiteer's Avatar
 
1973 27' Overlander
1972 29' Ambassador
Itasca , Minnesota
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,044
Images: 2
Blog Entries: 2
I went with a RotoZip cutting disc plunged at a steep angle from above when I got to the C-channel bolts, just enough that the nut turns into two pieces & falls away easily, then drive the bolt through...
__________________
The days are short and the night is long and the stars go tumbling by.. . ~Airstream~
Wabbiteer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2009, 08:54 AM   #39
Rivet Master
 
memgrove2000's Avatar
 
Elkhart , Indiana
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 633
Send a message via AIM to memgrove2000
Man I love the RotoZip!! I used mine to cut out the inside plastic pane on the Vista views!! EASY QUICK NICE!!!
memgrove2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2009, 07:30 PM   #40
4 Rivet Member
 
1963 28' Ambassador
Vintage Kin Owner
Northern VT , Vermont
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 360
For the small damaged screws inside the c-chanel I stumbled onto a couple of ways. An old wasted flat screwdriver shaft [no handle]. Touch up the tip on a grinder. Use a sm/med hammer and the "new tool" to drive the head of the screw left & right. Usually this will lift the head enough to get on with good small square jawed visegrips, the the screw will then twist or pull out... Not enough head left or next to a rib. An old narrow puddy knife. It needs to be the type with steel all the way up the handle & good quality steel, if the blade is broken off an inch or two even better, less flex. Sharpen it on the grinder, steep angle, maybe a little V notch to stay on the screw shaft. Slip it between the floor and c-chanel & cut/break the screw w/hammer. Use care, it would be a real bummer to drive the blade through the outside skin.

Off topic, while you guys are deep in the walls are you leaving any messages for the next fool!!!!! I used yellow tire chauk and wrote. "If you've come this far you're as big a fool as I was in 2009, I however used stainless hex head screws & washers. You're welcome. but your still as big a fool as I was"!!! { arrow down to c-chanel} Hey you never know...
putback is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Frame/floor repair... how much $$$? menormy Repairing/Replacing Floor &/or Frame 45 10-17-2016 12:55 PM
1958 Cruiser (two door) Frame-off Restoration ankornuta Repairing/Replacing Floor &/or Frame 427 11-18-2015 05:13 PM
frame/floor sag wayne.yl Repairing/Replacing Floor &/or Frame 1 09-24-2007 10:03 PM
Replacing floor and frame.... Angel73 Repairing/Replacing Floor &/or Frame 0 06-02-2006 01:23 AM
63 Floor-up Restoration blnfuse Repairing/Replacing Floor &/or Frame 18 08-15-2005 11:40 AM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.