Looking at a 2010 International 25FB Ocean Breeze

[KJRitchie]

I'm new to Airstreams, just recently signed up to this forum, and we have our eye on a 2010 International 25FB Ocean Breeze. The problem is it's located 300 miles away at a non-Airstream dealership. We haven't had a chance to see it yet and maybe before we can make the trip in about 10 days it will be gone. Other AS will show up but the wife loves the Ocean Breeze package. I don't even have a suitable tow vehicle yet. Looking at Toyota Tundra 5.7L Double Cabs, preowned. I'm hoping I they will store the AS for me for about a month while I get the two vehicle.

1. What would be a fair purchase price? They are advertising $58.5K.
2. What are the weaknesses of this year and model of Airstream. What should I look for when I inspect it. I have downloaded a checklist from this site but is there something about these 25FB that I need to look for?
3. Photos from the dealer seem to indicate very light use of the trailer. I suspect the original owners traded it in on a motorized unit at this dealer (Winnebago)
4. Would you trust a non-Airstream dealer to perform a decent inspection?
I've read posts where even AS dealers didn't find hidden issues. Do you just take your chance?

I will keep reading the forums.

Thanks

Kelvin

[btowntincan]

Good luck. I have the '06 25' FB model and love it.
The dealer should be able to hold it for you for a while so you can square away your tow vehicle. You can always rent a truck for a couple days too.

1. Price seems a bit steep to me, but it's a lot newer than mine was (I paid in the mid $30's, but it is older.
2. I'd check the floor for weak spots, particularly in the back under the dinette. Look for any leaks. Read thru the later model forums for Safari and Flying cloud models.
3. Mine was also used lightly. Light use in my case = good shape. I got lucky.
4. I'd worry about trusting ANY dealer. You can probably find an inspector in your area on these forums somewhere (some helpful person will point you to the right forum).

[mojo]

On the right side banner of the Portal page is an area where you can search for a fellow streamer to do an inspection.

You can request the dealer to test and inspect all of the systems as most are RV generic.

[nilesrob]

Ocean Breeze - what's not to love. We own a 2008 27FB Ocean Breeze, but we bought it new. Can't speak intelligently to the price, but I would agree it sounds a bit high. Last time I did a NADA (Blue Book) value on ours, it came in at around $35 (not that that means much).

It would be great if somehow you could find out who the previous owner was, and talk to them to get a little background. I do know as a result of stopping in to an Airstream dealer not so long back that if we were to have traded in ours they certainly would have had a list of buyers. Ocean Breeze apparently is sought after because it is unlike any other models - very light and airy. We have yet to find anything we like better than ours.

[Drathaar]

Kevin,

I am not a fan of the Internationals, but have a 2012 Flying Cloud 25 FB. I was just in at the dealer today (Portland, OR), and they brought in a 2010 Flying Cloud 25 FB with Twins. Personally, I think the $58k figure is high, but then that is an International so I don't have a good reference point. i paid in the neighborhood of that amount for my AS, new. but remember, it's a trim level down from the International.

There are probably AS owners in your area that would go over the unit with you to check for defects.

Give the Portland dealer a call if you don't mind traveling. The used AS they have is immaculate per the sales staff. If you really want to go upscale, there's a 2004 34' Classic with Slide on the lot, too. They do business as Airstream Adventures NW.

Steve

[BeachHouse]

I presume you have seen this one for $55k.

2010 Airstream Airstream 25fb, Junction City OR - 107114816 - RVTrader.com

[KJRitchie]

Originally Posted by Drathaar

Kevin,
I am not a fan of the Internationals, but have a 2012 Flying Cloud 25 FB. I was just in at the dealer today (Portland, OR), and they brought in a 2010 Flying Cloud 25 FB with Twins.
Steve

What is the real difference between a Flying Cloud and an International?

My understanding of the Ocean Breeze package is the white cabinetry, the floor which looks like cork, outside awnings on the curb, road and rear, curtains and the stamped interior trim. I've only seen youTubes of Internationals which have darker cabinetry than FC. The two 2013 FC F25FB at our local dealer have MSRP $70k and $72k and the one Intl 25FB was $79k.

I did a NADA report on a 2010 International Ocean Breeze and $51k was the high retail, $44k low retail.

Thanks for everyones replies.

Kelvin

[Drathaar]

Originally Posted by KJRitchie

What is the real difference between a Flying Cloud and an International?

My understanding of the Ocean Breeze package is the white cabinetry, the floor which looks like cork, outside awnings on the curb, road and rear, curtains and the stamped interior trim. I've only seen youTubes of Internationals which have darker cabinetry than FC. The two 2013 FC F25FB at our local dealer have MSRP $70k and $72k and the one Intl 25FB was $79k.

I did a NADA report on a 2010 International Ocean Breeze and $51k was the high retail, $44k low retail.

Thanks for everyones replies.

Kelvin

Kevin, I don't know all the differences, but there is more bling on the International. What I don't like is the cabinetry. The Flying Cloud has doors that lift and lock up, while the International has sliding doors. I don't have a good reason for my dislike, other than not being able to have both sides open at once. The new FC that I saw had a suggested price close to $68k. It had the faux leather upholstery, which was probably a $1k option. I really didn't spend much time looking at anything other than the twin beds, which I really like.

If you like the International, and it passes inspection, make an offer. Make sure the dealer knows you want an AS, but you don't 'need' one if the price isn't right. I've found that if you pull out a checkbook, and are ready to write a check, the sales folks get real receptive. Don't be afraid to say no. You might also tell the dealer that you want them to put a warranty on the unit if the mfr's warranty has expired. There is usually something that needs correcting. It will probably be minor, but it's nice to not have to fix it on your time or dime. Ask for a year. They can only say no. Walk if you're not getting the deal that fits you.

You can also ask the dealer to toss in options... Bike rack, Zip Dee chairs, blocks, chocks, hoses, etc. you may not get a freebie on the pricy stuff, but maybe something at cost.

Have fun!

[KJRitchie]

Since the dealer where this AS is offered for sale is not an Airstream dealer I don't suspect they can answer many questions.

I'm not sure whether this AS I'm considering has a 13.5k or a 15K BTU. I've read some threads about some owners being disappointed their AS can't be kept cool enough when the temperatures get above 90F. Since the AC isn't ducted like stick trailers is that a disadvantage? Does the bathroom get too hot and you have to leave the door open ajar?

If the AC in this unit is only a 13.5k BTU unit what would be the performance expectations? I usually keep my home AC around 78F to 80F even during the hotest summers. I particularly don't want to start adding Reflectix to the windows. Can this size AS be kept between 78F and 80F in partial shade when temps approach 100F?

Also, how well does the furnace work in this floor plan? Does the heat get distributed evenly?

Does the AC/Furnace thermostat work similar to a residence thermostat. If you set it to cool does it cycle the AC on/off including the fan?

How well is an AS insulated compare to a stick trailer of mid level quality? What is the R value of an AS compared to stick trailers?

Does the bare aluminum walls get that cold during evenings in the 40s. What about at below freezing? My daughter and I camped in our Casita at Palo Duro State Park near Amarillo, TX in our 17' Casita and between the heat strip in the AC and a small ceramic heater we were able to keep it in the low 70s at night despite below freezing temperatures.

My understanding is the holding tanks are enclosed. How well are they insulated?

Thanks for answering my questions.

Kelvin

[Drathaar]

Kevin, I don't know which ac or heat pump unit that trailer has. The newbies guide that came with my trailer said to expect the ac to cool the trailer to 10º below outside ambient. Yes, the thermostat functions like a residential unit.

I think the walls do get cold, but a small electric heater (Polaris ceramic) will keep the trailer warm if you have AC power. The furnace will do a good job too, but it will pull the batteries down. You'll need a way to charge them back up, either AC power, a generator or solar panels with a good sunny day.

I took my trailer into the dealer today to get the solar panel installed, and chatted with the sales folks about the used FC 25 FB with twins. It's a 2011 unit, looks great, has the ultra suede interior, and a full awning package. The only down side I saw was no inverter. We rarely use ours, but they can come in handy. The asking price was $49k. I bet they are negotiable. If you're interested, call John Valente 503-496-3162.

[KJRitchie]

Unfortunately, I'm 2000 miles away from Portland but it sounds great for a 2011.

I'm also beginning to read about floor rot at the rear of the 25FB due to lack of effecting sealing where the rear bumper is mounted. I'm trying to search for that information.

Thanks

Kelvin

[Wazbro]

Originally Posted by KJRitchie

Unfortunately, I'm 2000 miles away from Portland but it sounds great for a 2011.

I'm also beginning to read about floor rot at the rear of the 25FB due to lack of effecting sealing where the rear bumper is mounted. I'm trying to search for that information.

Thanks

Kelvin

I believe that is just about all Airstream trailers except the sport models (they don't have bumpers). Possibly not the classics with the rear drawers, not sure on that.

[rodsterinfl]

Greetings KJRitchie,

One of the five used trailers I looked at was an Ocean Breeze model. It is light and airy- white formica, silver accents on edges, foil wall paper accents, woven grass looking lighting fixtures, etc. The floor is nice too with the cork look. Personally, I think the price is close to a new FC - you are talking almost $60K for two years old. What? $70K for new International?

The one that Drathaar is mentioning is good too at what, $14K less and a year newer?!

The Flying Cloud is a great trailer. They have the airplane style wood lockers that pop open. They are not lighted inside like the international. The internationals have the clear plastic sliding doors in grooves for the lockers. Basically from what I get from the trim lines - the fixtures are different (faucets,etc); the formica is different as is the laminent floor and fabrics. That is about it. The window coverings in all but the most recent Internationals seem to have an aluminum enclosed shade that is really nice while Flying Clouds have aluminum blinds. That is the difference in a nutshell. Now, the Ocean Breeze has unique fixtures on cabinets and white blue and silver stuff - striped fabric, etc. Flying Clouds are more caramel colored inside with plank look light brown laminate and semi-modern fixtures. Twin floor plans have some advantages if you can live with twins -you get open floor space in a 25' all the way to the front or back. The twins are 78x34 in actual measure of mattress but the gap space around makes it more like an 80 x 36 or half king. The queen is sideways and cuts off access. There are other considerations too. There are little pet peeves to me about Internationals. I REALLY like the ultra modern look but I do not like the slide lockers- stuff in the cracks, etc. Personal taste. Others like them the best. I would consider what I liked best taking into consideration that you are paying a premium for that specific decor rather than an Airstream 25'.

The one difference between the two that I like best about Internationals is the OceanAir shades. Now that they have seemingly dropped that on the new 2013 models, I cannot see a lot of difference- eh, formica.

Temperature and AC:

I live in FL and went camping in the middle of the summer last year on my maiden voyage. I have a 25' and it has an 11,5K AC. It was HOT and HUMID outside when I camped, in the mid nineties. I do not have pano windows and that may make a difference but my 150+ sq feet stayed cool BUT I learned something in the process. The trailer was down around 69-70 degrees inside- awful cold but the humidity was still high. The unit was more than the trailer needed! It cooled the trailer down before extracting the humidity. So, I had to adjust the fan to max speed and lower the cooling thermostat. That helped a lot. It may be different in dry climates but that is my finding.

[nilesrob]

Originally Posted by KJRitchie

Other AS will show up but the wife loves the Ocean Breeze package.

Don't over-think this.

[Scott J-24]

We have a 2009 Ocean Breeze 27FB that we purchased 2 years ago and paid much less than what they are asking for the 25FB you are looking at. I believe you have a lot of room for negotiations. Go on-line and check the NADA, do your homework and get a good price from the dealer, remember he isn't making any money with it sitting on his lot. I hope you can get the deal you want on that one, or another Ocean Breeze. We LOVE our Ocean Breeze and haven't had any regrets.

Like Brad said in the previous post... Don't over think this.

[mefly2]

Have you talked to the dealer in Buda, TX?
Many dealers (AS or not) have a waiting list for used AS; so, the value is in the eyes of the beholder ... NOT...in the NADA or other used trailer reference book. The books are most handy when the dealer is appraising a unit to take in on trade and justify their position. Retail from a dealer is usually much higher than book value... at least in this area where there is a limited supply of not only used units, but also new units.

[kennyp315]

That is too much fir that trailer. Low ball them. You have nothing to lose.

[mutcth]

I agree that it sounds very fully priced. And you can argue NADA values all day long.

But. There is a value in finding the exact trailer you want (Ocean Breezes don't grow on trees), when you want it, at a place that isn't 1000 miles away.

I'm not saying to pay what they're asking. (My guess is that it's worth mid-$40s.) But keep in mind that your time and effort has a price. It might be worth paying a little more to get what you want - pending you inspecting it, etc...

I did this with my trailer, which I bought from a private party last year. I probably paid $2500 over market, but I got an immaculate one-owner trailer with low miles, in the exact floorplan and fabric color I wanted, at a place that was 65 miles away.

Tom

[KJRitchie]

Thanks Tom. I suspect if they were willing to deal this Ocean Breeze would be sold by now. I was thinking mid 40s and not more than $50k if it looks so much better in real life. Its a chunk of money and I'm an AS newbie. I know what to look for in a Casita as that is what I own now but AS is another story.

I'm going to look at a late model Toyota Tundra 5.7 Double Cab today. I should find a silver one. This one is white.

I've been reading the Anderson WDH thread and may go that route for a hitch.

Thanks

Kelvin

[mutcth]

Good luck! Don't you wish they built bigger Casitas? As stylish as Airstreams are, I sort of do...

Tom