Difficulty Financing as a Student

[ncolondi]

Thank you everyone for the advice, truly. We will both take everything said into consideration even the albeit unsolicited advice. Our plans are not carved in stone and they are flexible but we are considering all options. Thank you to those who actually answered the question originally stated. The hypothetical was being considered due to some personal reasons, that frankly we do not and should not have to divulge. I have my answer to the question I asked and apparently I also won the lotto on opinions today which isn't always a bad or good thing.

Thank you all, I think this should be the end of this discussion for now.

Sincerely,

N & Sgt. E

[surgpsych]

Ooooo. Good point about SOB of RV. A 5th wheel has tons of room for studying and....kids??? I like this discussion. Very therapeutic. It ought to keep me entertained all night. Sounds like the Sgt. has a well laid plan and has obviously done a lot of research. So give him credit for that. Works better too, if there is one spouse actually bringing in an income. That helps a lot. My wife paid the rent during medical school $525./mo in FTW, Tx. Once I graduated in 2009, I thanked her and told her that she could work as much, or as little as she wanted. She still only works 2-3 days a week, to pay for HER toys! [emoji106] Go with your brain and family necessity when the time to commit comes. Cheers.

[gsp]

Hello to the OP and her fiancée. As one veteran to another, thank you for your service.

As a couple who’ll soon be married, I assume sometime before the completion of her bachelors degree, I’d encourage you to engage this thought-exercise as man and wife. When you marry, you’ll combine assets, debt, and income. The debt that is accrued during medical school will be both your responsibility - as will any subsequent home/airstream purchase. Only mention this because a lot of the language used thus far has been “I” or “she” vs. “we”.

That aside: medical school is 4 years, and then 3-7 years of residency depending on her specialty. Between seven and eleven years... that is a long time to live full-time in an RV. There are at least two probable relocations that must be factored in (med school, residency) - but these must be limited to locations that are hospitable for a airstream year round. Any relocations must be considered a good fit for your occupation, as you’ll be the only one generating income. Buying new means taking the most depreciation, but as previously noted - these are depreciating assets nonetheless.

Why not keep the house you currently live in (on mortgage I presume)? When it comes time to move, rent your house out - and rent an apartment in the new city. You’ll build a lot of home equity in the 7+ years of her journey to become a doctor, and you’ll remove previous restrictions on where you could/could-not live. You won’t have to take out new loans, won’t need a new truck, and can reduce the total student-loan considerably.

On planning: I have spent 8+ years in higher education while earning my Bachelors, Masters, and associated professional training & certifications (in engineering no less). While I crafted a well thought out plan, rarely do plans survive reality. I did achieve my educational & professional goals, but the route wasn’t what my 22 year old self could have anticipated.

I’d suggest deferring this decision until after you two are married, and she is accepted into medical school.

[Sgt.Estes]

Originally Posted by vintageracer

Yes I guess you could think I made the "Assumption" that you were/are Broke based upon your statement that you were considering using "Student Loan Proceeds" for the purchase of an Airstream.

EVERY student I have every met, known or associated with who was considering or actually did use their student loan proceeds for a "Non-Educational Purchase" were Broke. That's why they considered or used those student loans to make the purchase.

Since every student "I" have ever known that used student loan proceeds or considered using student loan proceeds for a "Non-Educational Purchase" was Broke I worded my response based upon what "I' considered to be a "Fact" based upon my life observations and experience rather than from the perspective of making an "Assumption".

Either way all everyone wants to do here on the forum is help you make the best decision for your particular circumstances.

Mike,

I thank you for your time and input. I can see your p.o.v. and respect it, agreeing that most college "kids" are broke, and such a lavish purchase would be unwise. However, I am no longer a student, and she is not the typical student. I am 39 and well into my life having learned some lessons the hard way. I have earned everything I own through hard work and have always planned responsibly for my future, thanks to my doctor mother and business owner father. She has a very strong financial disposition, a very well earned savings account and investment portfolio, and both MD and business professional parents. I agree her first post did not come out as clear as we would have liked. This was never a "can we afford it" post. Out of curiosity she wanted to know what difficulties she would face IF she tried to finance the camper herself,with only proof of income being student loans. It was hypothetical as we have already been approved. We currently are still in the process of deciding if we want to purchase the AS or not.

I know everyone has an opinion and I expect plenty on a public forum. Although as clear as I have tried to make this, people (even those who mean well) keep telling us that we can't afford it, or its the wrong time, you can't take care of such a nice RV, etc.. That advice IF applicable to our situation would be adhered to. However, no one should fret as we can easily afford it, have already been approved, take extremely good care of anything we pay money for, and understand how to camp, what all is needed, and have been acquainted with the not so glamorous side of what this decision entails.

Our disposition has been trying to clear up the above. We both understand it would be a better purchase if we paid cash outright in the next few months. However this is not feasible although possible. We will be able to do so in a few years, but in the mean time do not wish to rent for numerous reasons.

This post is not pointed at you, but it is a general summary for all. Being new to a forum can be daunting as is, but being railed or insulted for making a bad decision based on reasons that do not apply to our finances or personal logic feels crappy. I am sure you would agree and feel the same if the tables were turned.

We wish everyone here the best and thank everyone for all words, even those that were not necessary. We understand everyone wants to help in their own ways.

Best Regards

[Sgt.Estes]

Originally Posted by gsp

Hello to the OP and her fiancée. As one veteran to another, thank you for your service.

As a couple who’ll soon be married, I assume sometime before the completion of her bachelors degree, I’d encourage you to engage this thought-exercise as man and wife. When you marry, you’ll combine assets, debt, and income. The debt that is accrued during medical school will be both your responsibility - as will any subsequent home/airstream purchase. Only mention this because a lot of the language used thus far has been “I” or “she” vs. “we”.

That aside: medical school is 4 years, and then 3-7 years of residency depending on her specialty. Between seven and eleven years... that is a long time to live full-time in an RV. There are at least two probable relocations that must be factored in (med school, residency) - but these must be limited to locations that are hospitable for a airstream year round. Any relocations must be considered a good fit for your occupation, as you’ll be the only one generating income. Buying new means taking the most depreciation, but as previously noted - these are depreciating assets nonetheless.

Why not keep the house you currently live in (on mortgage I presume)? When it comes time to move, rent your house out - and rent an apartment in the new city. You’ll build a lot of home equity in the 7+ years of her journey to become a doctor, and you’ll remove previous restrictions on where you could/could-not live. You won’t have to take out new loans, won’t need a new truck, and can reduce the total student-loan considerably.

On planning: I have spent 8+ years in higher education while earning my Bachelors, Masters, and associated professional training & certifications (in engineering no less). While I crafted a well thought out plan, rarely do plans survive reality. I did achieve my educational & professional goals, but the route wasn’t what my 22 year old self could have anticipated.

I’d suggest deferring this decision until after you two are married, and she is accepted into medical school.

Noted, and thank you. The things above are well though out and understood. We have spent the last year researching and debating such topics. While we agree on most, and respect what you have said, we still feel that if it is well within our means, cheaper than renting, and brings social currency, and a sense of happiness, then we fail to see the issue. Since this is cheaper than renting, we would be in a worse case scenario if anything were to happen while renting.

Besides what is rent, other than another binding contract/obligation of debt?

Thank you for your service as well.
Best Regards

[Sgt.Estes]

Originally Posted by surgpsych

Ooooo. Good point about SOB of RV. A 5th wheel has tons of room for studying and....kids??? I like this discussion. Very therapeutic. It ought to keep me entertained all night. Sounds like the Sgt. has a well laid plan and has obviously done a lot of research. So give him credit for that. Works better too, if there is one spouse actually bringing in an income. That helps a lot. My wife paid the rent during medical school $525./mo in FTW, Tx. Once I graduated in 2009, I thanked her and told her that she could work as much, or as little as she wanted. She still only works 2-3 days a week, to pay for HER toys! [emoji106] Go with your brain and family necessity when the time to commit comes. Cheers.

Thank You sir for the response and kind words. If only rent were still $525, that would be an option, but in some larger cities where we will most likely be you can't touch a one bedroom apartment for less than $1200+

[Sgt.Estes]

Originally Posted by pcskier

OK. I wrote my previous post before reading the long post that the above was snipped from, where you say that getting a loan and using student loans/parents to make the payments were just a 'hypothetical', and not actually an option--and that your income would be covering everything.

So with all due respect, I don't even understand the purpose of this entire thread, as it was founded on the simple question your fiancee asked: "Can I, as a student with Student Loans and no income, get approved on a loan to buy an Airstream." Why even ask the question if it's hypothetical? Yes, the thread morphed into advice on whether doing what she suggested was a good idea or not, because based on her question, no, of course it's not a good idea. Based on her stated parameters.

If you guys want an Airstream and you (her fiancee) can and will be financially responsible for it, and choose to be, go get a loan and buy your Airstream.

We consider all aspects and plans of action before deciding which path to take. That is how we work, and it has paid off in-spades for us over the years. I do agree that the original post could have been worded differently, and may have yielded a different vein of response. However we both have enjoyed everyone's advice and we do like to use it to check our ducks and make sure they are in a row.

Best Regards

[Sgt.Estes]

Originally Posted by bweybright

Dude....this is what started it all:


"I have a great credit score, usually stays within mid to high 700s and I will have at least 10% down if not more. I'm planning to have my payments be taken care of by my student loans during medical school, but for the first few months of owning the airstream I will probably receive some assistance from my parents. My question is, I've seen some of the RV lenders like Good Sam and KOA say they do not inquire about income until you borrow over $150,000. Are the dealers the same? Or will I need proof of income? If proof of income is required I would not have anything to show other than the money I receive monthly from my parents and the refund I receive from school each year.

I'm also considering a co-buyer in the form of my parents, but I do not want to have to use them unless it is absolutely necessary. I don't own a home (since I move about every 2-3 years), but I own my car (no lease involved). "

I would suggest that you and she have a very different mind set on things?

You obviously have your mind made up so let it go and start shopping. And best of luck on the endeavor....I hope her residency doesn't end her up at Mayo Clinic in an Airstream for a couple of years........

She should have clarified that it was a hypothetical question. We have our reasoning for asking. Feel free to be at ease about us having different mind sets, as I assure you that we are on the same page.

Mayo has campuses in Florida and Arizona...

[DMP54]

Since OP has suggested this thread has satisfied her original question, and thus be closed, I would just like to thank you, Sgt., for serving our country, and extend sincere best wishes to OP in her applications to medical schools.
May you both travel safely through life!
Pam

[PhxRising]

Originally Posted by Sgt.Estes

Besides what is rent, other than another binding contract/obligation of debt?

For what its worth, rent is a consumption option that allows the renter to use something (such as a house) for a defined period of time, for a mutually agreed upon sum of money, then walk away with no further obligation at the conclusion of the rental term. I wouldn't put rent in a "debt" category any more than I'd put my utility bill in a debt category. Its simply a monthly payment on a service that I consume which has no principle balance (aside from a normal rental contract term.) When I take an Uber or a Lyft, I'm not buying the car, I'm just buying the ride.

Sign a 1 year rental agreement and make your "should I stay or should I go" assessment annually. The price you pay for that degree of flexibility is your rent. Who knows, life may throw a curve ball at you - in a good or bad way - the flexibility of renting a place gives you more options when those curve balls come across the plate.

I have a sense that the kind folks here are each drawing from their own experiences. Many (like myself) have had that debt-dynamite blow up in their hands (or have known countless others who have). This is in no way a character judgment on you and your bride-to-be. We know nothing more about you than you love your country enough to die for it - which is awesome in its own right.

If, ultimately you both decide that 280 square feet of travel trailer is the right choice, I'd recommend buying something 4 years old or older. By that point, the trailer will have lost roughly 40% of its original sold price in depreciation. On an Airstream Classic, that may be in the range of $50K in depreciation that you wouldn't have to lose.

Best of luck guys - take a few deep breaths, and keep doing your diligence as you have here.

[Foiled Again]

Originally Posted by PhxRising

If, ultimately you both decide that 280 square feet of travel trailer is the right choice, I'd recommend buying something 4 years old or older. By that point, the trailer will have lost roughly 40% of its original sold price in depreciation. On an Airstream Classic, that may be in the range of $50K in depreciation that you wouldn't have to lose.

$50K extra. You might never regret buying an Airstream, but life does throw us all the occasional curve ball. Ypu will NEVER regret having a decent cash reserve, like $50K. Money doesn't buy happiness, but it is essential for freedom of choice.

An ugly 5th wheel will also allow you two to permanently designate an area as "her study room". The biggest Airstream will not, even if you got a rare 33 slideout. An even rarer PanAmerica with a toy hauler room, maybe? But setting up, then storing her computer and books every day will get irritating fast.



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[Piggy Bank]

To the Original Poster,

May I suggest you visit with a community bank or credit union in your area for their expertise on this question. Find out how your student status and financial situation and current unmarried vs possible future married financial picture impact the options available to you.

Understood that the overall affordability is not your question, these other factors often have constraints, rules, timing factors in the ability to qualify for particular programs. Sometimes there are exclusions that prevent you from qualifying, or a large difference in what type of loan program you may qualify for, based on timing of when your "status" changes. Professional student, dependent vs non, single, married, first time buyer, the list of factors that MAY come into play is complex and there are people in the business of helping you figure this out you can turn to for assistance.

The particular reason I recommend a visit to a community bank or credit union is that it's fairly straightforward for a married couple with 2 verifiable W-2 incomes to prequalify for a loan. Your picture is more complex, and thus you need to find someone who can both understand your situation and knows the loan products, programs, rules, and how to best navigate this.

Also, my 2 cents of personal opinion - if you plan to be unmarried when purchasing, only have the 1 owner on the title and on the loan. This avoids any messy problems should something happen regarding responsibility for the debt.

[smithcreek]

Originally Posted by Sgt.Estes

She wanted to know how difficult the process would be if she tried to hypothetically finance it showing her student loans as her primary income.

I assume the reason no one is addressing the basic question you asked is that there are few if any people in the world that applied for and were approved for a $100K loan with no job or income.

I'm not a banker nor do I work in the field of finance, but I'm pretty sure the bank would not allow you to fill in the "income" section of the application with money from a loan. In fact, it would go in the section for "debt". A 700+ credit score is a great place to start, but without some serious credit history behind it, doesn't mean much to a bank, especially when looking to finance and luxury item with high depreciation rate.

Aside from that, I hope you make the right decision and if that is to buy an Airstream, I wish you the best!

[70CT]

140k trailer 20% financed for 8 years. $25,000 interest paid
Depreciation using NADA average for an 8-10 yr classic ~100k
That’s the equivalent of flushing $1,300 away per month for 8 years.
Down payment 28k. Residual value 40k. You made 12k. That’s 5% per year you made on your down payment before any other expenses. There is a reason why people rent or buy homes. Not saying don’t do it, but no financial benefit at all.

[Paprika]

Sgt. Estes - I must say you have shown extraordinary restraint, given the tenor of some of the comments. This could easily have turned into a flame war, but you have kept the discussion civil. Thank you for that.

I don't have much to add to what's already been said, but I would like to mention one caveat: keep in mind that Airstream quality is not great. Their designs are good, and their materials are mostly of high quality, but their workmanship is sloppy. You can find plenty of threads about this, so I won't go into detail about the flaws I found when I bought a new International Serenity last year, but suffice it to say they were numerous.

As a result, you'll likely be making repeated trips back to the dealer for fixes, and you probably won't be able to afford the time away from your studies, so make sure there's an Airstream dealer near where you intend to settle. (It doesn't necessarily have to be the dealer you buy from, though you'll probably get better service if it is.)

I say this not to discourage you, but to help reduce the chances of your buying a hundred-thousand-dollar item and being disappointed to find that it isn't anywhere near perfect. This is a mass-produced RV. Keep your expectations low.

Whatever you end up doing, good luck and happy trails!

[Rocinante]

First and foremost: it's your money, spend it how you like. No concern of mine.

A few thoughts:

1. You keep talking about building equity by purchasing an RV. This is a fundamentally incorrect statement built on at least one wildly incorrect assumption. RVs and tow vehicles, even Airstream RVs, are depreciating assets. You will *not* be building up "equity" over time. You will be *losing* that value over time.
2. Student loan debt is incredibly toxic. If you come upon hard times, this kind of debt cannot be discharged via bankruptcy. That debt will follow you around and haunt you for the rest of your life. Increasing that kind of debt to finance the purchase of an RV feels like a Really Bad Idea.
3. Great to know one of you is an incredibly handy engineer who feels competent to fix anything that breaks in an RV. This is a definite plus.

[featherbedder]

Originally Posted by Rocinante

First and foremost: it's your money, spend it how you like. No concern of mine.

A few thoughts:

1. You keep talking about building equity by purchasing an RV. This is a fundamentally incorrect statement built on at least one wildly incorrect assumption. RVs and tow vehicles, even Airstream RVs, are depreciating assets. You will *not* be building up "equity" over time. You will be *losing* that value over time.
2. Student loan debt is incredibly toxic. If you come upon hard times, this kind of debt cannot be discharged via bankruptcy. That debt will follow you around and haunt you for the rest of your life. Increasing that kind of debt to finance the purchase of an RV feels like a Really Bad Idea.
3. Great to know one of you is an incredibly handy engineer who feels competent to fix anything that breaks in an RV. This is a definite plus.

I tend to disagree about losing value over time.I pur. 1976 31 AS new in 1977. Today agreed value for ins. and sale is double price that I pur. less $2000.00.

[Rocinante]

So that’s a depreciation of $2,000. A house purchased new in the same year would be worth far more today. Case closed.

[featherbedder]

Originally Posted by Rocinante

So that’s a depreciation of $2,000. A house purchased new in the same year would be worth far more today. Case closed.

You misunder stood my figs. I pd. $10,000 new, now value is $18,000 not a loss of $2000 as you fig. So almost double of pur. price.....These figs. were obtained from fairly large AS dealer

and agreed to by Ins. co. and current market sales. So now case is closed.

[Martee]

As future medical doctors, purchasing an Airstream makes good financial sense over renting property. And the Airstream has highest resale value when it comes time to sell. Just make sure your very comfortable with the math. And vary the down payments and see what monthly payment works for you. Include annual maintenance costs too.

Medical school is Study... Study.... Study and more study. Majority of time will be spent in class and the hospital. Just make sure both of you are comfortable with the limited study space in an Airstream trailer. Airstream living is a very minimalist lifestyle....and maybe quite suitable for those with a very busy, highly active medical school program.

What ever your decesion on the Airstream, best of success to both of you in your future medical career.



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