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Old 03-18-2016, 07:56 PM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tap View Post
I forgot that a couple months ago I ordered a replacement window for the driver's side and it has finally arrived!

So I need to replace the old smashed one.

Attachment 258933

How do I remove the old one, drill out its rivets? If so what size drill bit?

And then what type of rivet and rivet gun do I need to install the new replacement? I don't yet have rivets or a rivet gun.

Thanks so much!
Tap,

For information on how I removed the cockpit window start reading at post #23.

My description is only slightly different than John's. Along with the rivets on the outside there are rivets on the inside where the inner skin is riveted to the window frame. Also in my description in the link above there are some screws that need to be removed. And last but not least there is a drain tube that you have to watch for. I think I described it well enough in my post above.

Overall it's not a really hard task as long as you pay attention to what you're doing. Go slow and don't be afraid to ask questions as you go.

Good luck!

Brad
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Old 03-18-2016, 08:04 PM   #142
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TAP, I am not an expert in Airstreams but, I have a lot of experience with sealing commercial buildings . I think what they are referring to as two sided tape is actually butyl tape. Butyl is used where you have a lot of movement like expansion and contraction over a long distance. Butyl never cures or gets hard it is always the consistency of playdough. I would use Trempro 635 instead . Your windows are part of the structural integrity of the coach. The buck rivets go through the window frame then through the skin then into the aluminum structural frame around the window. Others on this site have had acceptable performance from Olympic rivets but, for something structural I think I would use buck rivets.
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Old 03-18-2016, 08:09 PM   #143
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The buck rivets holding the window in are likely 5/32" you will want to drill them out with a #21 drill bit. I bought the Rivet Removal tool from VTS. It works pretty good but, if you are pretty good with a electric grill you can just drill them out by centerpunching the center of the rivet then carefully drill it out by hand. With a little practice it gets pretty easy to do.
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Old 03-18-2016, 08:17 PM   #144
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Greg, I tend to agree with you that most of the windows on the Airstreams are somewhat structural in nature. However on the front cockpit windows I don't know if that really applies. The front cab area starting at the seam behind the cockpit seats is made from 3/16" to 1/4" thick extruded C channel with flanges.

The cockpit windows are riveted into that structure. After I had the windows out and was moving just the aluminum cab framework around with my backhoe there was no give or flex to the framework. It was a pretty stout structure.

It's a shame the rest of the shell isn't made the same way!

Brad
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Old 03-18-2016, 10:12 PM   #145
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I really appreciate all of the tons of great info on the subject, but I must admit that now I'm extra confused and overwhelmed.

Does anyone know anyone in Minnesota that has done this that I could hire to do it for me?

Or... and this is probably a really stupid question, but at this point, what have I got to lose...

Better yet, any chance that it's possible for me to just remove the "fixed" window glass and inner frame from the big replacement frame and just install it in my current already (glass smashed out) riveted-in structural frame?

I assume the answer is no because that's why it's called, "fixed".

(Clearly you can see that I'm grasping at straws here.)

What say ye?
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Old 03-18-2016, 10:57 PM   #146
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You could always contact P&S Trailers in Ohio and tie it in with your drive to Pennwood this May. I'm sure that would let you watch if you're unsure of this procedure.

No harm, no foul in asking for, or receiving help with these coaches.

Cheers
Tony
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Old 03-18-2016, 11:05 PM   #147
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The only way to get the fixed window out is to remove the entire frame
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Old 03-19-2016, 07:25 AM   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shepherd57 View Post
The only way to get the fixed window out is to remove the entire frame
What John said. The bar separating the fixed window from the slider is screwed in from the bottom (and I think top).

The job really isn't as hard as it sounds. It seems intimidating but once you start it really isn't difficult at all. Just pay attention to what you're doing and you'll be ok.

The one thing I will say about using Olympic rivets is to be sure you dip the stem in Vulkem or Tempro 635 before inserting it into the hole. If you don't have the sealant ooze out of the hole when you set the rivet you haven't used enough sealant.

I had the inner skin off on my Argosy while doing some repairs and was sitting inside one day while it was raining. I noticed water puddling on the floor and traced it to the tip of an Olympic rivet that hadn't been sealed during installation. Surprised the heck out of me.
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Old 03-19-2016, 08:22 AM   #149
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Tap, find someone that can assist you with the riveting. Many of us have done it for many years and find it to be rather enjoyable.
The difference between olympic and buck rivets is that the olympics are "blind rivets", meaning they can be installed without having access to the interior. They are not as strong as Buck rivets and many people think they are insufficient.
I personally think Airstreams construction methods are insufficient, because of the lack of sealer under their seams. I just pulled a 21 foot awning rail of a 97 trailer and it was all that held the roof panel to the side panel without any sealant and only a 1 1/2 overlap. Leak city. In addition to that unbalanced running gear will shear olympic and buck rivets.
My point is, if you use Olympic (without the little washer some come with) or Buck rivets, use lots of vulkem 116. It will outlast the tempro635 by years, act as an adhesive and fill all the cracks and holes that 2 sided tape will not. Its messy to work with, yes, but it will last.
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Old 03-19-2016, 10:54 AM   #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isuzusweet View Post
You could always contact P&S Trailers in Ohio and tie it in with your drive to Pennwood this May. I'm sure that would let you watch if you're unsure of this procedure.

No harm, no foul in asking for, or receiving help with these coaches.

Cheers
Tony
Or you could schedule a nice little jaunt down to Peter's place in Texas.

If you have seen what he did to his 310 outer skin..........Enjoyable wouldn't be my description for it. But each to their own.

Cheers
Tony
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Old 03-19-2016, 04:05 PM   #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isuzusweet View Post
Or you could schedule a nice little jaunt down to Peter's place in Texas.

If you have seen what he did to his 310 outer skin..........Enjoyable wouldn't be my description for it. But each to their own.

Cheers
Tony
bring it on, its on the way to Penn wood, right ?
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Old 03-22-2016, 06:49 PM   #152
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Today, after 21 years, my 280 finally moved down a highway again! (Even if it was on a flatbed this time.)

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Old 03-22-2016, 07:31 PM   #153
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That is one heck of a trailer! Where did you find the service?
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Old 03-22-2016, 07:48 PM   #154
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My Premier RV AAA service found it and covered the 100 mile trip!
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Old 03-22-2016, 08:03 PM   #155
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I blew up the last picture and did a double take wondering what kind of badas$$ ATV tires were you running Tap. It looked like somebody had replaced the dually's with a big single.

I do love my Premier RV CAA service as it has saved my bacon and more than paid for itself a couple of times now.

Cheers
Tony
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Old 03-22-2016, 10:09 PM   #156
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Hehe!
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Old 03-22-2016, 10:12 PM   #157
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When it got up on the flatbed, I could finally get a good look under it.

I assume this is the black water tank and it has a big crack in it.

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Where does a brother get a new tank exactly like my 280's original so that it will fit exactly in the same spot?

(Good thing I didn't use it yet. Code Brown! Code Brown! &#128541
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Old 03-23-2016, 05:58 AM   #158
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On the upside, your tank is very accessible and looks to be a very plain jane square tank, versus my 310 which is very oddly shaped. I would try Inland RV first, taking as many measurements of your original as possible to match. If that doesn't pan out, there are many places out there that do construct plastic or even aluminium tanks out there that could reconstruct your tank or have a tank in stock that closely matches your tank. The only thing you may have to do is make new straps and mounting the inlet pipe.
I would strongly suggest replacement versus fixing your original as the plastic is well over 30 years old and is done.

http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/r...water-tank.htm

http://www.icondirect.com/categories...Holding-Tanks/

http://www.tank-depot.com/browse.aspx?id=9

Cheers
Tony
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Old 03-28-2016, 07:36 PM   #159
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So I really need to replace the driver's cockpit window frame as soon as possible. So does this make sense, I could drill out the old rivets with a drill bit, then attach the replacement window from to the Airstream with Olympic rivets dipped in Vulkem and maybe even some Vulkem shot into each rivet hole? And then I use a rivet shaver on the finished rivet heads?

1) Does all of this make sense and make the procedure successful?

2) What size and kind of drill bit will I need to drill out the old rivets?

2) What kind of rivet gun will I need for Olympic rivets? Can someone please provide an Amazon link to the right rivet gun that I will need?

3) Are all Olympic rivets the same size? And made of the same material? An Amazon link for the Olympic rivets too?

4) Can I buy Vulkem on Amazon as well?

5) Finally, how about an amazon link to a rivet shaver?

Thank you all SO much!!
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Old 03-28-2016, 08:05 PM   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fawcett View Post
So I really need to replace the driver's cockpit window frame as soon as possible. So does this make sense, I could drill out the old rivets with a drill bit, then attach the replacement window from to the Airstream with Olympic rivets dipped in Vulkem and maybe even some Vulkem shot into each rivet hole? And then I use a rivet shaver on the finished rivet heads?
Look back a few posts to where I describe how I removed the cockpit windows on a 345. It's not quite as simple as you hoping for. There are screws on the front where it fastens to the cockpit structure and the drain tube along the bottom channel. Among other minor details.

Quote:
1) Does all of this make sense and make the procedure successful?

2) What size and kind of drill bit will I need to drill out the old rivets?
For exterior rivets I think it's 5/32" for exterior rivets and 1/8" for interior rivets.

Quote:
2) What kind of rivet gun will I need for Olympic rivets? Can someone please provide an Amazon link to the right rivet gun that I will need?
Quote:
3) Are all Olympic rivets the same size? And made of the same material? An Amazon link for the Olympic rivets too?
No there are several sizes. Best price I've found is on ebay. You'll need 5/32" Olympic rivets on the outside and standard aluminum 1/8" rivets for the inside.

Quote:
4) Can I buy Vulkem on Amazon as well?
Probably. Vulkem 116 or tempro 635. If I'm wrong I'm sure someone will correct me

Quote:
5) Finally, how about an amazon link to a rivet shaver?
My guess is youll need to buy it from Vintage Traile Supply or Out Of Doors Mart. They run around $200
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