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Old 04-24-2013, 11:58 AM   #161
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If you present the same thing every few years, eventually the mix of voters can change to where, tired of the same old thing, and with a smaller group because bunches have left the club because of this issue, it could pass. Not this year maybe, but maybe in 2 or 3 years, or more. The same leaders, or their carefully chosen successors, can keep bringing it up, over and over.

I suppose if Thor wanted to produce an "Airstream" MH, they would, but they have decided for years it isn't worth it. But if they changed their minds (lots of orders at a very high price), Airstream could contract with Thor to provide them with Airstream MH's—build most of it at Thor in Elkhart, bring it to JC, and finish it off with Airstream badging, some shiny aluminum panels, and some Airstream stuff inside. Thus an Airstream MH, manufactured by Airstream, Inc. Then it is just a matter of the club leaders saying it is constitutional. After all, when Airstream sends a shell to Timeless Travel Trailers, isn't TTT's final product still an Airstream and ok according to the club constitution? Vehicles of all sorts are often built in collaboration with different companies.

But they tried to convince Thor to do something like this and Thor said no. Otherwise, they wouldn't be trying to change the rules. Thor is a cost cutting company typical of many corporations. They aren't going to do anything that invests capital in it and doesn't have a high return right away. Twenty such MH's selling at $250,000 means something like a $2,500,000 investment (figure their cost at half the retail) unless they get most of the money up front. They would rather invest in corporate officer bonuses. They produce big profit with their practices. This is not a good long term strategy, but so far it has worked for them.

There is also the psychology that Airstream had MH's, they didn't sell all that well, and "we'll never try that again". Having been burned on poor quality thermopane windows decades ago, Airstream has never tried that again either even though other companies use them without a problem.

So their only option is to attempt to change the rules, over and over and over.

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Old 04-24-2013, 03:54 PM   #162
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[QUOTE="Protagonist"]

"Unfortunately, the WBCCI constitution and bylaws do not include a "three strikes" rule, that a motion raised three times and defeated three times would be dead forever. As it stands, the same people can put forward the same motion, year after year after year, ad infinitum and ad nauseum until it either passes or until they leave the club due to death, sale of their Airstream, or non-payment of dues.

Perhaps we should put forth a motion to adopt a "three strikes" rule…["

Okay , I propose that a motion be presented that 'the question of allowing non-Airstream products into the wbcci shall never be allowed again'

Can I get a 'second'?
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:35 PM   #163
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I second!
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:38 PM   #164
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Question...all in favor say "I" Motion carried. There it is done .
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:42 PM   #165
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Wish it was that simple.
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Old 04-25-2013, 08:22 AM   #166
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Questions....Are you a WB member? Has your unit taken the time to read and understand the motion? Have you, as members, cast your votes or been given the opportunity to vote? Are you heading to Huron to defeat this motion? Has a delegate from your unit been determined to carry your vote forward?

If your unit is/has voted and not able to attend the International, find an affiliate who is willing to be your delegate so that your unit's voice is heard. Requirements are the affiliate must be in your region. A 1/3 count is needed to defeat this motion, 2/3 count to pass the motion.

Don't wait for your unit officers to move on this issue, take action. Apathy is not acceptable. You have a voice, please use it.

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Old 04-27-2013, 12:55 PM   #167
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The May Issue of Blue Beret has a Great Letter to the Editor in it. I hope all Airstream members of WBCCI read it this month & make sure your Unit votes !!!
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Old 04-27-2013, 05:53 PM   #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverPal View Post
Questions....Are you a WB member? Has your unit taken the time to read and understand the motion? Have you, as members, cast your votes or been given the opportunity to vote? Are you heading to Huron to defeat this motion? Has a delegate from your unit been determined to carry your vote forward?
Wisconsin Unit voted 14% in favor, 86% against the MoHo amendment at its spring business meeting. Unit president will be serving as Delegate at Huron.
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Old 04-27-2013, 09:23 PM   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverPal View Post
- - - -%< - - -
Have you, as members, cast your votes or been given the opportunity to vote? - - - -%<- - - -
Has a delegate from your unit been determined to carry your vote forward?

- An Official Airstream Fanatic
The ballot is out to the 4CU members and voting will close May 10.

We will have a representative at Huron.
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:06 PM   #170
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Hey Nuvite-F....similar to Oregon Unit. 88% against with 33% of respondents saying they would leave the club if the motion passed. Glad to hear your voice will be heard @ Huron.

Safe travels - look forward to seeing you there.
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:20 PM   #171
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Obie...thanks for the BB letter shout out. We are out there, those who are passionate about our club and willing to step up to the plate and affect change. But we need our members support. It's important that your unit has a delegate at the International!

Nuvite, Howard....well done. This is the type of information we are looking for. Does anyone else have any numbers to report on voting? Bring this issue to your unit president's attention and make certain you have the opportunity to vote.

Keep those numbers rolling in; let us know if you have voted or will be voting!
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Old 04-28-2013, 04:28 PM   #172
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The true silver Airstream has been an icon for many generations. It is an institution representing many with individual ideas. It stands out from the rest of the pack. How many times have you been asked about your 'stream by a passerby? Yes, Airstreamers are admired for their individual thinking, not following the pack, supporting and preserving an icon.

As are Corvette's, do they allow Chevy's when the owners need a larger vehicle, NO. This example can be shown in many ways.

If this passes the Airstream club will be diluted to the point of non existance and the silver icon will be lost in a sea of white boxes. I do not want to belong to a Thor club.
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Old 04-28-2013, 05:22 PM   #173
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I went to my first Rally this year. I heard this discussion more than once and also on this board in one form or another but not just about motor home inclusion. The tradition is to have an Airstream only group. The "traditionals" want to make sure there is autonomy and group benefit. I understand that. It was cool to see over 300 silver trailers together. I like that tradition. It had an historical presence too with the vintage area. ***The other side of the coin though is that Airstream as a group thing is dying out. They said so at the Rally. They had over 1000 in 2000 or so and the number keeps going down. Market share, cost, etc all play a part in that. When I was at the big show in Tampa this year I heard person after person around the Airstreams talk about how neat they looked BUT they also made comments about no slides, not enough beds for the family, too tight inside, too much $$$, etc. We like Airstreams obviously but there are many options out there. My thought is that Thor or someone should corral the travel group into a different heading and have SIG groups, one of which would be Airstream. That way there could still be autonomy and group benefit but also incorporate others and increase opportunities for all. They mentioned at the Rally that the numbers were so low that paying for the facility becomes a problem with few campers. We need something worth visiting if a groupie thing is going to exist. Perhaps Wally Byam's Club can get off the brand and onto the spirit of camping that he encouraged. One vintage owner shared with me about the motorhome fiasco and how some people bought motorhomes and suddenly could no longer be in WBCCI. I am not sure what way would be best to open the door to non Airstreamers but I believe it must be consolidated in some way or they will die out.

When you go to a car show, they put like with like quite often. Corvette group, Mustang group, etc. They have autonomy within the bigger group "Hot Rods" so it needs to be with Airstream. StreamNTyme, an Airstream will always be an Airstream. Perhaps WBCCI should remain AIRSTREAM only. I do not know but some part of it at least should be open for growth and benefit to all.
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Old 04-28-2013, 05:27 PM   #174
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Wally was onto caravans, camping was a part of it. The first caravans had dif types of trailers in them, but this was changed to AS only, as it should be. Jim
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Old 04-28-2013, 05:44 PM   #175
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Rod, it is true that Airstream has a smaller market share than they used to have, but a good deal of that is simply that there are more SOB companies and many more RVs out there than there used to be. And, of course, WBCCI has shrunk in size (sometimes due to its own actions, though that may be debated in some quarters). But die out? Kind of doubtful. Airstream Inc. is still thriving in its niche market. WBCCI also serves this niche market, and many feel that that's exactly the market that it should be serving. Uniquely.


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Old 04-28-2013, 06:07 PM   #176
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There are many other clubs for other brands. Why should these many brands be included in WBCCI?
Airstream is Airstream.
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Old 04-28-2013, 07:27 PM   #177
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Airstream's market share may be shrinking but the number of Airstreams is not. They are selling everything they build. The number of owners joining WBCCI is also shrinking not because of market share but because WBCCI is not offering what the owners need or want. It may be politics or attitude or simply the way they operate. The only thing for sure is WBCCI needs to act in the best interest of the majority members not just the few. The majority has said no to Thor Moho's several times but nobody listens.
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Old 04-29-2013, 05:44 AM   #178
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"The other side of the coin though is that Airstream as a group thing is dying out. They said so at the Rally. They had over 1000 in 2000 or so and the number keeps going down. Market share, cost, etc all play a part in that. When I was at the big show in Tampa this year I heard person after person around the Airstreams talk about how neat they looked BUT they also made comments about no slides, not enough beds for the family, too tight inside, too much $$$, etc."

The last large FMCA International rally that I worked at had 5500 motorhomes of all sizes, types and descriptions; that was in 2007. The same rally in the same location 5 years later had a meager 2000 units attending and attendance has been dropping ever since.

This has been the trend across all of the RV industry, not just with Airstream.

Sorry, but that is NOT an acceptable reason to include THOR products in the brand-specific WBCCI. Either you have an Airstream club or you don't!
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Old 04-29-2013, 06:02 AM   #179
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Thor offers the following Class A models:
Ace, Windsport, Daybreak, Hurricane, Challenger, Outlaw, Palazzo, Tuscany.
They include a membership to the Thor club.
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Old 04-29-2013, 06:09 AM   #180
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Lewster's right: Membership is dropping like mad in FMCA. A good friend of ours is on their board (something like the IBT, I guess), and he reports all manner of discussions there to deal with the membership issue.

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