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Old 12-20-2011, 11:44 PM   #781
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Due you? Or don't you?

Due you? Or don't you?

How much is a return receipt requested? And just how much is the International dues? Is there any discrepancy between that difference? Remind me again, why mere members pay more than mere unit dues for mere accommodation, and what that difference entitles a member to. Is paying membership dues an act of altruistic alliegance and monitary subsidy for the ruling class' travel and recognition, or are there benefits beyond courtesy parking that actually comes from mere members' generosity and hospitality? I am surprised the EC hasn't also passed along the printing cost to listing members for offering free parking as they did to discounts from campgrounds in their grand quest for increased revenue. Those pages aren't printed for free you know! Make room for the credentials of the high ones and don't even think to add the unnumbered caravans of the units, that might add up to 8 pages... Remember it isn't about the recognition. WOW did they really say that at the meeting and it not stick in their collective craw?
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Old 12-21-2011, 12:18 AM   #782
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Thumbs down

I forgot to mention that the only reason WBCCI does not have a members' forum is because they do not want to assist members to compare notes or hasten the spread of news betwixt its "mere" members or to have to address them as leaders directly. The WBCCI forum was "cleansed" two times and still managed to render "inappropriate" results so it was shut down permanently. No officer was harmed in its making or closing and any semblance to real characters is purely coincidental. Tell me what organization you currently belong to that discourages interaction online, and then tell me WHY you would seek to enroll in an organization of that sort in this day and age. It isn't that they don't get it. It's just that you aren't solicited to join or stay. Now do you get it and fit the mold?
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Old 12-21-2011, 03:42 AM   #783
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Sorry, incorrect. jim
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Old 12-21-2011, 05:48 AM   #784
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In the opinion of our committee members, "Our club is in a death spiral." We believe that WBCCI cannot afford to lose more and more valuable members whose dedication and expertise have made this club what it is, a "family" whose interest is enjoying "fun, fellowship and adventure." The suggestion has been made that we confine Thormotor home membership only to those currently owning an Airstream motor home, but that would restrict the possibility of ever regaining those former WBCCI members that dropped out. It was also suggested that if Thor motor homes were allowed in the club, the owners could not hold office in WBCCI, and, in fact, they could only be affiliate members. The majority of this committee's members judged that to be extremely biased and prejudicial.

That statement from the MOHO Committee report alone tells you everything.

Who are those "valuable" members anyway? Am I considered one?

See post 301 for a copy of the full report.

Enjoy,
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Old 12-21-2011, 06:03 AM   #785
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Prejudicial??

Quote:
It was also suggested that if Thor motor homes were allowed in the club, the owners could not hold office in WBCCI, and, in fact, they could only be affiliate members. The majority of this committee's members judged that to be extremely biased and prejudicial.
Of course it is. After all,it IS AN AIRSTREAM club.

What is really prejudicial is the way members at large are treated with no right to vote or hold any office including intraclubs. They even have to pay a premium for this treatment and they do own an Airstream.

It would make no sense to treat a Thor owner better than some one who owns an Airstream in an Airstream club
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Old 12-21-2011, 06:58 AM   #786
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WDCU members informed

I have informed our members of the Moho amendment and some have already sent their e-mails to the EC and IBT. Now if the other unit presiendts can do the same, maybe Barry & Co. will get the message.

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Old 12-21-2011, 07:27 AM   #787
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For those who might question the motivation of the Clubs leadership it is all explained in the last 2 or 3 minutes of the movies J. Edgar.

If you haven't seen it I will save you the admission.

When Nixon got the word that Hoover had died his aids asked if they should start write his comments for the public. Nixon said "NO" first I want those "Fin" private files, go lock his office. The next scene his him before the cameras giving an all praising eulogy.

Let no one beieve we are dealing with a group that has our best interest as their guiding light.

As for the WBCCI Forum that software has long been written and presented to the PP. A simple yes would have it on the web in minutes.
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Old 12-21-2011, 07:41 AM   #788
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MotorHome Issue

To All Members of WBCCI IBT.
It is time to STOP this Motion at the IBT meeting in Jan. 2012. This talk of letting Non- Airstreams into the club has got to STOP!!! This is tearing this Club apart!! Please do not be a part of this yes vote but be on the members side and vote NO to the Motorhome Maddness!
Thousands more Airstreamers with trailers will leave this club in droves if this happens. This a unique club of Trailers that are noticed when going down the road. Newspaper reporters flock to the trailers for stories about Airstreamers not the motorhomes.
If you really care about the club Please Vote NO!! Due to Air Forums and the internet, many airstreamers are meeting at various campgrounds throughout the USA for Fun, Caravans, and Fellowship without the benefit of the club. They know how to meet and share airstream stories and don't like this negative talk about non-airstreamers joining our ranks. Let them buy airstreams to join our unique club.
Remember if you own a Chev. you can't join the Corvette Club, also a Ford does not allow you into the Thunderbird club. Remember Harley Davidson isn't about Hondas either.
So IBT, do your part and LISTEN to The Airstreamers PLEASE!!

Thank-you and I will be waiting for your Vote, Dennis Ober #2590
A Member for 21 years and 4 airstreams later. Also Past President of Central Penn Unit.
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Old 12-21-2011, 09:04 AM   #789
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Originally Posted by wheel interested View Post
I forgot to mention that the only reason WBCCI does not have a members' forum is because they do not want to assist members to compare notes or hasten the spread of news betwixt its "mere" members or to have to address them as leaders directly. The WBCCI forum was "cleansed" two times and still managed to render "inappropriate" results so it was shut down permanently. No officer was harmed in its making or closing and any semblance to real characters is purely coincidental. Tell me what organization you currently belong to that discourages interaction online, and then tell me WHY you would seek to enroll in an organization of that sort in this day and age. It isn't that they don't get it. It's just that you aren't solicited to join or stay. Now do you get it and fit the mold?
Quite so, Carol. Don't forget that several IBT meetings ago one of the elders of the WBCCI indicated that the club needed quality over quantity in the membership. I suspect his definition of quality meant "rendering prompt and cheerful obedience to one's superiors". The "quality over quantity" effort continued with the expulsion of one high-profile dissident (at the cost of around $20,000 in legal bills) and the subsequent no-doubt-hoped-for nonrenewal of a thousand or so like-minded sympathizers.

What we are seeing here is the "rightsizing" of the WBCCI. What is the "right" size for the WBCCI, anyway? I reckon by the Internationals' lights it's probably a few hundred Thor motor home owners, with perhaps a few diehard aluminum trailer owners thrown in.

But don't get upset about it, Carol. Life's too short. There's a whole wide world out there that knows little of the WBCCI and cares less. Maybe it's time to join them.

It's Christmas time! Go mix yourself an eggnog and enjoy the spirit of the season, in the company of your loving family, both 2-legged and 4-legged!
.
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Old 12-21-2011, 05:55 PM   #790
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This is the letter I have sent to EC-7 and Region Presidents. I first, got the blessing from our Region. So here it is:

Dear Executive Committee and Region Presidents.

I am writing to you this day, a single voice of a mere member of the WBCCI.
I have been a member of the Club for almost 2 decades. I have volunteered
on the Unit level to maintain a fun and successful Unit.
I have been responsible for adding new neighbours into our Unit.
Our Unit is fun, with great people and we have taken care to ensure this
which has member-added-value.

The reason I am taking the time to write is first, I am a big fan of WBCCI
and what it stands for. The Airstream is an icon to the world and a great
American asset. People from all walks of life one time or another in their
lives has wished for an Airstream, and some are lucky enough to attain that
wish. The iconic Airstream is the epitomy of RV ownership, and a recognized
commodity worldwide.
And second, the mere thought of allowing a non-Airstream RV of whatever
fashion into the WBCCI sends shutters and shivers up my spine. The Airstream
is what defines the WBCCI. Its the Airstream that defines us as members. If
there wasn't the Airstream RV, there would not have been the club formed for
the Airstream.

It is not anyone's fault that Airstream decided to stop building Class A
motorhomes. As a former owner of 1999 35ft Cutter Diesel and a current
owner of a Classic 270 Motorhome, I am appalled the IBT is still
comtemplating this idea. The members in Perry 2007 International, I thought
spoke loud and clear. No non-Airstreams allowed in WBCCI.

At that time in 2007, we were being told by the Board and others that
Mandalay Coach owners were waiting for a constitutional change within WBCCI,
so they could join and boost our Club's numbers. As I spoke in Perry during
open-mike, I said I had talked with then President Jack Finley of the Mandalay
Travel Club. After explaining what was going on and how the WBCCI maybe
opened up for Mandalay coach owners to join, his response was, "Mandalay
Coach owners didn't know the politics of WBCCI and NO they had NO interest in
joining, adding to our member count." He said they had worked hard to get
where they were as a club, and had no interest in WBCCI

Flash forward to 2011. I have recently communicated with the Membership
Chair for the THOR DIESEL CLUB, (TDC) Patricia Koritta.
I again explained how a change to the WBCCI constitution could allow THOR
Motorcoach owners into the Airstream Club.

Mrs Koritta told me that NO ONE in the THOR DIESEL CLUB has any interest in
joining the Airstream Club.
Mr Koritta told me that Airstream Class A's were not allowed in the THOR
DIESEL CLUB.
Mrs Koritta also told me, one reason Airstream Class A's were not allowed in
the TDC, they were not supported by Thor Motorcoach. Thor Motorcoach
supports their coach owners at Rallies with service visits, and a Class A
Airstream would be considered a foreign coach. The TDC would not be part of
having any second class coaches gathered at their rally. . Airstream Class
A's were not built by THOR Motorcoach. Thor Motorcoach is not THOR
Industries. THOR Industries as we know owns Airstream.

So, I ask you as a mere member of WBCCI this question. What is the member-added-value here
allowing a foreign non-Airstream Class A Motorcoach into WBCCI for the few,
and what does the general membership, the many, get in trade.? It makes no sense
what-so-ever given the atmosphere this dilemma has caused.

Sure it is sad that a WBCCI member who wishes to upgrade their Coach,
doesn't have the choice to choose another Airstream for their replacement.
However, this is not a decision for WBCCI members in general, and not of the
Board. If someone wants to buy another brand of RV, its their business. If
that choice prevents them from being a member of WBCCI, that's their choice.

It is our choice to belong to a single brand RV Club. It is the Airstream that defines us. It is the Airstreams that bonds us together!. The Airstream is the avenue for the creation of WBCCI.. If there were NO Airstreams, there would not be the Club that we have today.

Mrs Koritta (TDC) also told me that any Airstream Class A owner is more than welcome to join
the Thor Diesel Club, PROVIDED they own a Class A built by Thor Motorcoach.
So, there is tit for tat here. NO NONE Airstreams in WBCCI..


Regards,

JIM LANE

WBCCI member #5812

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Old 12-22-2011, 06:17 AM   #791
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HowieE View Post
DONE

If anyone else wants a copy let me know
Howie, and the many others that have posted here,
Thank You for all of your efforts to keep the WBCCI AirStream only.
I am new to the WBCCI and TAC, and with both, I thought I was joining Airstream only clubs! If the WBCCI’s leaders allow brands other than AS in, I will not renew with the WBCCI…

Please send me the emails, and I will let the leadership know my position.

Ask yourselves, what would Wally do?
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:20 AM   #792
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:35 PM   #793
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheel interested View Post
I forgot to mention that the only reason WBCCI does not have a members' forum is because they do not want to assist members to compare notes or hasten the spread of news betwixt its "mere" members or to have to address them as leaders directly. The WBCCI forum was "cleansed" two times and still managed to render "inappropriate" results so it was shut down permanently. No officer was harmed in its making or closing and any semblance to real characters is purely coincidental. Tell me what organization you currently belong to that discourages interaction online, and then tell me WHY you would seek to enroll in an organization of that sort in this day and age. It isn't that they don't get it. It's just that you aren't solicited to join or stay. Now do you get it and fit the mold?
Carol,

This statement may be an attempt at humor making a point but I have to say that it is patently untrue. The reason that the club does not have a forums right now is because there is no desire for the members of the ECC to be dragged into flame ward over how the forums are moderated or maintained. There is a strong desire for a forums at many levels and for many reasons by many people - all of them good in my opinion. But based on the experiences with the last 2 forums, the committee is very wary of being accused of moderating negative viewpoints in an attempt to foster only a positive viewpoint of the club.

Also, the reason the old forums was shut down was not in an attempt to silence MEMBERS viewpoints - but rather was due to differences which existed between the previous forums owner and the club leadership.

I just thought that fact should be corrected.
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Old 12-22-2011, 02:06 PM   #794
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Wally allowed all trailers in his carravans. All brands, only when airstream owners formed the WBCCI did it become exclusive. jim
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Old 12-22-2011, 02:17 PM   #795
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Originally Posted by zigzagguzzi View Post
Wally allowed all trailers in his carravans. All brands, only when airstream owners formed the WBCCI did it become exclusive. jim

Having become "EXCLUSIVE" it should remain exclusive. The market scale has long since grown large enough to support exclusivity.
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Old 12-22-2011, 02:32 PM   #796
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Yes the past Airstream Forums existed and were managed under some very strange conditions. The technology has advanced way beyond that.

I accept your comment that the Leadership is not interested in standing before a firing squad on a routine bases but some form of improved communication within the Club is needed. Units are not getting information because of the bias of their Regional Officers and some members are not getting information because of unit limitations.

If and when a Forum for members only is opened you night consider limiting, electronically, the number of post per week or month that each member can post. That may limit my frequency and that of others that are willing to drink the cool aid but I think it will serve the overall picture and would not require a moderator to enforce.

Open free discussion should still be available here.
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Old 12-22-2011, 03:10 PM   #797
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Zigzag. your assumption above is partially correct. From what I read, all trailers were allowed to travel with Wally, but those non-airstreams were breaking down more frequently. One reason for Airstream-only.
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Old 12-22-2011, 03:27 PM   #798
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""If and when a Forum for members only is opened you night consider limiting, electronically, the number of post per week or month that each member can post.""

a good start might just having a simple Forum poll. one AS - one vote on the overall MOHO issue.

one question to start: AS only vs non-AS only.

i have a good idea as to which way THAT poll would go.

hopefully, these results would then be used as an indication of the direction in which the vast majority of the WBCCI members want the
club to head.

i think the answer would speak volumes and most of the 'forum talk' would not be needed.

unfortunately i doubt that this will come to pass.
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Old 12-22-2011, 03:33 PM   #799
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I had heard that Wally make the decision to only allow Airstreams on his later caravans was that there was too much demand and he did not want to increase the number of caravans above the number the factory could support. Why wouldn't you treat your customers better than SOB's. WBCCI headquarters were an office in his factory administrated by his cousin Helen and Wally paid her salary and partially funded to caravan support. When Beatrice bought the company, after Wally died, they move all manufacturing to Jackson Center, Ohio and WBCCI moved into an independent building with their own dues paid staff. It is still that way. The Airstream company did get the benefit of customer run field testing and factory failure analysis, which helped them build a better product. Now failures are reported on Airforums and the engineering staff simply needs to lurk here to identify design flaws. It seems simpler than hiring a big staff to do the testing.
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Old 12-22-2011, 03:51 PM   #800
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I had heard that Wally make the decision to only allow Airstreams on his later caravans was that there was too much demand and he did not want to increase the number of caravans above the number the factory could support. Why wouldn't you treat your customers better than SOB's. WBCCI headquarters were an office in his factory administrated by his cousin Helen and Wally paid her salary and partially funded to caravan support. When Beatrice bought the company, after Wally died, they move all manufacturing to Jackson Center, Ohio and WBCCI moved into an independent building with their own dues paid staff. It is still that way. The Airstream company did get the benefit of customer run field testing and factory failure analysis, which helped them build a better product. Now failures are reported on Airforums and the engineering staff simply needs to lurk here to identify design flaws. It seems simpler than hiring a big staff to do the testing.
Hi, Airstream was on this forum, got an ear full, packed their bags, and ran back home. Closed the thread and probably will never return. Do they really care?
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