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Old 05-26-2010, 06:38 PM   #541
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheel interested View Post
"Stand down," is how they quiet you at their meeting.

I can not agree more with some the preceeding posts in this thread.... if I were going to the International next month, I'd be getting in touch beforehand not with the IP or IBT, but with their Parlimentarian.

I'd be really interested in testing that individual's actual, working knowledge of:
  • the Club "rules" as they might or might not actually exist;
  • Roberts Rules of Order, Newly Revised, 10th Edition (RONR) ( actually last revised, I believe, in the year 2000 ? );
  • their own actual responsibility, and scope of authority as Parliamentarian; and,
  • their own culpability in these proceedings as a member and Club Officer;
and if they understand the phrase "Point of Order, Mr. President.... "

of course, anyone speaking that phrase must, in turn, have at least some idea of what they are saying! Parliamentary procedure is not usually a Level 1 course, my friends!

my best wishes and support to anyone bold enough to stand in defiance of " the Wizard " in Gillette!!! you're likely to have at least a small to medium sized cheering section this year!

we all know that Dorothy's story had a happy ending; perhaps those seeking to force a positive change in the Club this year will have one, too.

best,


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Old 05-26-2010, 06:46 PM   #542
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Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In View Post
I belonged to the WBCCI club for over 20 years.

I never went on a rally with a trailer.

However, once in a while, I gave a program on some of the "how to's" as well as problem prevention or solving, at a rally, as well as periodically being supportive.

Since I do not have the time to be active in the WBCCI club, I resigned early this past January.

In short order, I received a check for $ 55.00, from headquarters, dated January 7, 2010, as a refund for my membership.

I signed the check and mailed it to the local WBCCI group, as a gift.

Today, May 26, 2010, I received the same check back in the mail, from the local group.

A hand written letter came with the check.

The letter said,

"Thanks for the offer of this check. The bank won't allow us to deposit it to our account. Hope all is OK. Thanks again.

It was signed by the treasurer.

Wonder what that's all about, and/or the rules it violates.

Andy
Andy,

It is very simply the banking regulations. The bank for the unit does not know that the person who endorsed the check over is the person to which the check is payable. One way around the problem is to have your signature guaranteed by your bank and then send the check back. Much easier to deposit the check into your account and write the unit a new check.

Bill
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Old 05-26-2010, 08:06 PM   #543
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jm2 has a good idea if I understand it—learn parliamentary procedure. Robert's Rules were written after the Civil War to organize the rules that were generally used in meetings. The idea is to run a meeting in an orderly manner that protects the idea of democracy. If you understand them, and I'm not saying they are all that easy to understand, you can cause some grief to the people running roughshod over free and open debate and decision making.

But, an organization can adopt rules that supersede Robert's Rules and make it hard for people to speak freely and to make it easy for the leaders to be undemocratic.

Nonetheless, such leaders often don't understand either Robert's Rules or the organization's rules very well and people well schooled in both may be able to cause some democracy to break out.

I have read most of Robert's Rules and it can give me a headache even though interpreting rules and statutes was my profession. Getting people to run a meeting properly is not easy, even people who want to be democratic but forget themselves. Knowing when to make points (they take precedence over any other business) is helpful. A point of order is to raise a question of the order or rules being used. A point of information is to ask what's going on or for more information about a motion or action being taken. The fun one can be the point of personal privilege used when you have been personally insulted; you have to right to challenge that. I've never had to use that one even though I have been insulted, it just didn't seem worth it. You have to use these judiciously so you don't come across as a complainer.

When the chair makes a decision about procedure, you can appeal the decision of the chair—it takes a 2/3 vote to overturn the decision. The parliamentarian does not make decisions; he advises the chair.

The trouble with all this is that this is for a plenary meeting—one where everyone at the meeting has the right to speak and the entire group can vote. At a board meeting, generally only the board members can make these points, appeals and such. A board can allow members to speak and to limit the amount of time alloted—this is often done by boards, at shareholder's meetings, by town and city governments. I have no idea how WBCCI meetings are conducted, but if there are meetings where everyone may speak and possibly vote, then you have a chance to do something. Otherwise you have to get someone on their board (I guess it's the IBT) who understands procedure very well.

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Old 05-26-2010, 10:05 PM   #544
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I hate politics!

Sorry I even stumbled across this thread. Has me rethinking my WBCCI Membership altogether.
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Old 05-26-2010, 10:11 PM   #545
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Sorry I even stumbled across this thread. Has me rethinking my WBCCI Membership altogether.
Then ignore it and enjoy the friends in your unit.

Bill
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Old 05-27-2010, 12:02 PM   #546
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Or embrace it and fight to change! ...because $55.00 dollars and rising is your cost to join International before your additional cost to a local unit can be accepted. More than likely you will not be shunned by any Airstreamers in your local, member or not... Or sup it up as most WBCCI'ers do and let it go because your compadres are so wonderful. AND SO WE ARE!!
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Old 05-27-2010, 06:03 PM   #547
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Sorry I even stumbled across this thread. Has me rethinking my WBCCI Membership altogether.
What matters is if you are enjoying your unit.
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Old 05-28-2010, 05:28 AM   #548
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Quote:
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Sorry I even stumbled across this thread. Has me rethinking my WBCCI Membership altogether.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goin camping View Post
What matters is if you are enjoying your unit.
Quote:
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Then ignore it and enjoy the friends in your unit.

Bill
But isn't it an international club? Wasn't one of Mr Byam's goals to spread good will everywhere? What you are saying is buy the cow, feed it, and go enjoy your one cup of milk. A club like the one with Mr Byam's name in it should be for everyone to enjoy where ever they may be. Keeping it local kind of destroys the reason for an International club does it not?

Bob you can turn the ignore button back on, I am done.
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Old 05-28-2010, 07:22 AM   #549
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But isn't it an international club? Wasn't one of Mr Byam's goals to spread good will everywhere? What you are saying is buy the cow, feed it, and go enjoy your one cup of milk. A club like the one with Mr Byam's name in it should be for everyone to enjoy where ever they may be. Keeping it local kind of destroys the reason for an International club does it not?

Bob you can turn the ignore button back on, I am done.
Let's say you are unhappy with Washington D.C. and whoever is President. Does that mean your State, County or City is now not worth living in?

Nothing in life is perfect or flawless. Enjoy what you can and attempt to change what you don't.
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Old 05-28-2010, 08:44 AM   #550
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"But isn't it an international club? Wasn't one of Mr Byam's goals to spread good will everywhere? What you are saying is buy the cow, feed it, and go enjoy your one cup of milk. A club like the one with Mr Byam's name in it should be for everyone to enjoy where ever they may be. Keeping it local kind of destroys the reason for an International club does it not?"


I agree with this. If the International must keep all of our annual dues, they need to be more responsive to the wants, needs and wishes of the worker bees in the local unit.

Maggie
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Old 05-28-2010, 09:33 AM   #551
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Frank has a very good point about the WBCCI being an International organization. I have attended three Internationals and enjoyed meeting brand new friends from all over the United States and Canada. I hope the price goes down and they offer 3amp service again and that the interesting features go up and I hope to attend again in Illinois next year.

An International rally is very different than camping locally. I encourage people to take the luck of the draw with general parking because you already know who you know, the International or Region and State Rallies is an opportunity to widen out and get to know others that you don't already know. It is no great feat to like and take care of your own, but to like and take care of strangers is what an International assembly is all about. If they split up the VIP parking and dispersed the leadership into the general population perhaps there wouldn't be such a casm between the priorities of the IBT and the desires of the general membership. It's the interaction of Airstreamers that bring most to the Internationals while the entertainment and activities are largely shunned by many. It's the ambassadorship that will lead one to travel outside the familiar comfort zone and share new and different ideas and cultures. Costs associated with gathering together should be greatly reduced to allow more participation and benefit for the majority of regular members. For those days I suggest leadership become one of the regular members and have the benefit of mainstreaming rather than segregating themselves by title and activities. That's what I think would keep things really fresh and lively and make a major improvement. Splitting up groups of intimates always creates new dynamics. The rewards of reaching out is an awesome experience.
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Old 05-28-2010, 10:05 AM   #552
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I always thought the "International" part of the club name referred to units internationally not the international rally.

We belong to three units, all of which we enjoy or we would not be members of them. We have met people from all over the country, who we would not have met without the club.

Bill
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Old 05-31-2010, 01:57 PM   #553
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The International President has offer his final monthly newsletter for distribution to the membership. Unlike normal when this news letter is circulated only to the higher levels Officers he did in fact ask that the membership be advised of it contant.

With that in mind I have offered some counter points that may make things a bit clearer to those members that are interested.

The following is an unedited copy of his newsletter with my comments in Bold.

The News Letter

This is my last newsletter to you. I have enjoyed this opportunity to share information with you and have attempted to keep you informed as to some of the “behind the scenes” happenings. Due to some disharmony in WBCCI, it is most important that you share this newsletter with all unit members. A few months ago, some non-members, The immediate past President of the WDCU unit who when he first announced the rally was a member of WBCCI were using a facsimile of the WBCCI logo on their web sites, when the site was originally put up his membership was in good standing, and one was advertising a rally using Wally Byams’s name. WBCCI’s lawyer sent Cease and Desist letters, and one non-member renamed the event and changed his logo. The second person has refused to change the logo he uses on his web site so that situation is still pending. That logo in question is not copy written as per the records of the United States Copywrite Office. It saddens me that so many of our members choose to get information from web sites other than WBCCI.org, the official web site for our club. The information attempted to be posted to that site is highly censored or removed and managed by a third party who’s many interest is selling used Airstreams. Much of the information on the other forums may be misleading, half truths, and rumor. Everything that has ever been posted on Airforums.com is open to rebuttal, question or scrutiny. One of the latest postings is that WBCCI is being sued by the Metropolitan New York Unit, which has 32 members. The suit was originally brought by individual members and the Metro NY unit seeing the merit of the suit has voted to join it.
To date, neither WBCCI Headquarters nor any International Officer has been officially notified of a lawsuit against the club. I trust the suit will be filed before the International. Should a lawsuit be filed, WBCCI will vigorously defend itself. However, even if a lawsuit is not filed, all the disharmony and talk of a suit has already caused the club to overspend the budget line for legal fees.
The budget was overspent by $10,000.00 and reported as such in the 3rd quarter report before the suit surfaced. That money was spent harassing 4 members for action and comments they had made directed at correcting several of the shortfalls within the management of the Club. The money spent on legal harassment was one of the driving forces behind the suit. Some letters have been mailed to WBCCI members by members of the Metropolitan New York Unit requesting members to send money to help with the lawsuit. An E Mail was sent to every member that has an e mail address notifying them of the pending action and advising them that they could get information on the action at the Defendwally web site using the addresses available to all members and such use as given on page 2 of the Membership Directory. These letters are not condoned by WBCCI Headquarters, the International Officers, or the Region Presidents. These letters are very politely written and say that the money will go to save the
club. If a few members sue and the club defends itself in court, lawyer fees could be exorbitant. The question is, “How will this save the club?” It will save the annual lose of money incurred at the International, it will curtail the use of members dues that go to support the free travel of the Officers, it will reduce the use of fibulas grievances and legal actions against anyone that dares to question or suggest the change of anything relating to the Club, it will separate the function of making and declaring viable constitutional and bylaw changes from the one committee (the IBT) to at least one other unrelated level of the Club. Anytime a lawsuit is filed, there is only one winner, the lawyers.
If you wish to not receive any more of these letters, then please let the authors of the letters and the MNYU know how you feel All that requested they no longer be copied with future correspondence (12 I believe) have been removed from the master list far more have asked to be advised in the future.
Hearing from other members and units will have impact.

As with all past postings those whose disagree with any point, mine or the the IP, are free to comment.
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Old 05-31-2010, 05:34 PM   #554
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Old 05-31-2010, 08:05 PM   #555
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I agree with the notion that Airstreams should be sort of "aluminum without boundaries." Through this forum, I've had the chance to interact--even help--some fellow Airstreamers. Good stuff.

As for the Int'l poobah newsletter, let me see if I have this right. The rumors about a lawsuit have been promulagated by those nefarious "other (web) sites" where "...much of the information ... may be misleading, half truths, and rumor." In response to these baseless rumors--the very kinds that WBCCI members are supposed to disregard and some vague "disharmony"--the WBCCI has blown its buget line it for legal expenses?

If the lawsuit isn't real, why is the WBCCI spending money on it? If the WBCCI doesn't have a legally enforceable copyright on Byam stuff, why are they sending cease-and-desist letters? Where did they get the Int'l board members... from the Pentagon "E" ring? The only thing missing from the newsletter piece is a "That is all, dismissed."
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Old 05-31-2010, 08:12 PM   #556
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Goal #1 for Birthday Bash: cause disharmony. Everyone knows a successful rally is one filled with unhappy people.
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Old 06-01-2010, 03:54 AM   #557
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Goal #1 for Birthday Bash: cause disharmony. Everyone knows a successful rally is one filled with unhappy people.
Frank, for those who don't know you, you needed to add the to indicate your sarcasm.

The original #1 goal of the Birthday Bash was to, in actions, not just words, show the IBT what many want from a club rally. It still could serve that purpose, if the IBT was open to learn from what 80+ Airstreamers do when they get together to have fun. Instead, Pres Tom thinks it would be better to just label us all dis-harmonizers.

This is the sort of behavior by WBCCI leadership, along with a keen desire to have fun with our families in our Airstreams, spawned a new club... The Airstreamers Club (TAC).

The Birthday Bash, is an event that the four host families created to share the fun we have had together... sounds like sweet harmony to me.
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Old 06-01-2010, 04:07 AM   #558
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Old 06-01-2010, 05:32 AM   #559
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More like this :cla p:
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Old 06-01-2010, 06:03 PM   #560
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This is like the big three auto makers going to Washington in private jets to ask for money....remember that?

Next trip was in a regular cars.

The IBT should have waived that 125K expense until they balanced the budget.
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