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Old 10-08-2007, 11:26 AM   #261
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Agree with taste and less confrontation. Also recognize the need to pic battles, but when someone blatently (can't spell worth a darn dyslexic) ingores the voices, and this has been the rule of thumb for the past 7-8 years I have been a member, it's time to change.

Who's club is this? We seem to be in this tug Membership's or a small body of individuals? What are we as members to make of this. We were asked, we spoke up, we volunteered, we supported (Liason Committee Member) and yet the beat goes on......

I will double check my numbers BUT for the record, the 2004 survey was filled out and primarily by older members if I recall correctly. So it again does not seem to be about age, but about attitude. I always found the older generation to be the most charming of folk. They don't want it either!

I'll get back to you if my numbers are wrong but I don't think so as I live in a world of probability & statistics. I re-worked some of the data as I was Unit President during the time that body of work was completed and as I have already said it was a poorly designed tool in some respects but still had tremendous value if you are familiar with statisics.
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Old 10-08-2007, 09:37 PM   #262
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Lets talk "Respect"

Lets talk “respect”. I think we all “respect” the members of the WBCCI that have been part of the club for so many years. We may not “agree” with how some have been and are currently running the club. But out of “respect” most if not every member, every year, puts on the “uniform” for the opening ceremonies, the delegates meeting, Unit Presidents dinner and the list goes on and on. This is not only at the “IBT” level, but also at the “Region” level as well. The same type of flag ceremonies at the “Region” level, having all the units in that Region parade in full dress “uniform” and also during the “biz’ meeting at the Region level. Now lets go to the “Unit” level. I’m sure many of us have been to “Installation Rallies” for the Unit officers were the dress is once again, “full uniform”. Granted, there are some “Units” that don’t adhere to this “policy”, but many do.

So, time and time again “most” of the members out of “respect” dressed up in the “official uniform” even though they don’t want to, think that it’s not needed and don’t understand why they are doing it in the first place, again, do it out of “RESPECT”.

Now, lets take the “fact” that most of the members don’t want to do it and have said so to everyone they meet, say so on every survey and have ask so many times the “policy” be change they are blue in the face, but it’s still “REQUIRED”.

One would think, out of “Respect” a letter would be sent down from the “President” of the WBCCI saying the following.

“I understand as President of the WBCCI that many of the newer and younger members of the WBCCI do not like or agree with the more “traditional” dress codes of the WBCCI. With that said, at this time, we are “relaxing” the dress requirements of the club during official business meetings, dinners and installations. Understand, those who wish to continue to use the more formal dress may and can do so. Those who wish to dress in a more “casual” style of “blue kaki pants and polo-shirts” may do so as well. We would like to ask, during the usage of polo shirts, they have a “WBCCI” logo on the breast area of the shirt. I ask that all “Regions” and “Units” in the WBCCI also move to this new dress code. Out of “Respect” for the newer and younger members we feel this is in the “best” interest of the club and its growth for the future. But please be “Respectful” there maybe still many of us that prefer the more traditional dress that has been use by the club for over 40 years.

Now tell me, "Who is and has been "respecting" who??"


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Old 10-09-2007, 08:51 PM   #263
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Respect

Paul,
All I can say is "Well Done", a great post that gets right to the point of the whole matter.
Thanks for the comments
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Old 10-09-2007, 10:53 PM   #264
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Thumbs up Hear, hear!

Ed & Paul,

Right on!

(For those who may not be aware--Paul and Ed are both ex-Unit presidents who helped their Units grow, and understand the relationship between excess ceremony and attracting new members.)

Ed, I wish you could have been at the Bailey's Harbor rally just concluded. I was amazed to see "unauthorized flags" flying all over the place. One Unit officer who didn't make it to the Installation rally (who shall remain nameless--but you know who) was installed by a Region officer (who shall also remain nameless--but you also know who). Not a red coat or a blue beret in sight.

But what *were* in sight were new members right and left--eager to participate and help the Wisconsin Unit grow!

Hmmm. . . do you suppose there could be a connection?

See you up the road,
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Old 10-10-2007, 06:50 PM   #265
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Nuvi,
The WI Unit has grown over the years because the new members feel wanted and are not always thrown into the fire to become Unit leaders if they don't want to. The leadership in the past has been all over the board, some very pro Old School and some like me, wanting to have fun, meeting the club requirements while not stuck on the pomp and all. I would like to say that when I was pres in 2003 that I sort of set the stage for a less formal approach to the club. Business meetings of 1/2 hour, no excessive ceremonies and lots of new things to do. Most of all a laid back rally schedule that gave the membership lots of time to have fun as they saw fit. I know that one of the best things I did was open the Vintage Open House up to all years of units and boy did that catch on.It is so cool to see old and new, young and old involved in that event. That is just one example of things that others have continued to incorporate into their presidency. This open mindset in Wisconsin is the key to drawing and more importantly keeping our members. I hope it continues and looking at the slate of officers we have going through the ranks I can't help but feel we will do well!

Itís so cool to be a part of this Unit; most of the people are very open to the likes of me!
Ed
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Old 10-10-2007, 08:10 PM   #266
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If you are an ex-military or education type, you will enjoy WBCCI immensely. If you like to just camp and have fun,well.
bfred,

Iíve been a wbcci member for four years now. I am neither a teacher nor a military man and have enjoyed the time in the club immensely. While not unique, my association with the club has introduced me to hundreds of fellow airstreamers I am proud to call friends.

There is no other place in my life where I can get all of this entertaining and harmless controversy for a measly $70/year. And as Iím sure you know, this club delivers on controversy. Itís been wonderful. If the IBT didn't throw garbage as us year after year the club might become...dare I say...just another camping club. I've found we can count on the IBT to keep us in a tither year in and year out.

I say if you're an Airstreamer and you haven't ponyíd up and joined the fray, you're probably one who never leaves the shallow end of the pool...or your just really cheap.

This club is awesome because of the people in it and their affinity for the atomic number 13.
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Old 10-11-2007, 01:01 PM   #267
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WDCU Installation Rally

Hey RJ,

Thank you so much for being the unofficial photographer at the WDCU Installation rally. The pictures are great and they do capture the fun that we had from playing "dress-up", to eating the crabs, to the the microphone that Paul used to give his speach.

The WDCU certainly knows how to have fun. We are so glad that we are members of such a great unit and have developed wonderful friendships.

We can't wait for next weekend's Hot-Air Balloon and Wine Festival rally!

Sonia
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Old 10-13-2007, 05:50 AM   #268
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Jerry Larson's Post on the offical website

Jerry finally posted yesterday on the Lower activity "Offical" website but does not seemed to have posted it here yet so, I am moving it over here where it can get wider distribution.

"Your Unit, Region and International Officers make several decisions during their terms of office. Some are complex and difficult, some are easy.


The matter of what is worn by the International Officers and Region Presidents during the Installation Ceremony on the evening of July 3 has been a tradition since before I joined this Club over 30 years ago. It has not significantly changed, that I am aware of, except for last year (for ONE YEAR ONLY) when a decision was made to relax part of the dress at this ceremony. Based upon receiving an overwhelming number of comments and requests that we return to the time honored traditional dress for this occasion, I made the easy decision to do just that. Also, as a courtesy to those few individuals that may be affected, I decided to provide an early heads up of my decision to keep the traditional uniform for the upcoming installation on July 3, 2008. It is regretful that a minority few have decided that to keep tradition is not in their personal best interest and we should discard a tradition this Club has been doing since it began.


If someone must find fault in how I conduct Club business, you might consider being critical of me for listening to our Members and then letting the majority influence me.


I continue to support and encourage discussion, debate and the expression of different opinions. It is through this process that we help each other become better together. Becoming better by helping and supporting our leaders and helping build this Club to confront the challenges of the future should be our objectives, not some personal agenda to discredit our leaders and our Club. When we are willing to work together (especially with our differences) we can accomplish great things for the WBCCI. Are you willing?

I am.

Jerry Larson #144, your Int'l 1st VP"

I believe Jerry's heart is in the right place but he is listening to the wrong people. These people are likely the same ones that brought us the "SOB motohome" and the "Airstream Owners Association" proposals in the last two years. In the end, votes of the general membership proved these people are in the minority. They are also the people who have led the club down a twenty year path of declining membership.

PeeWee's archive pictures do show that years ago the leadership did wear white dinner jackets to the installations. Early "70's Airstream ads also show ladies in nylons and heels serving gourmet meals in their Airstreams. I admit. I wore a tux to my wedding 38 years ago and to my daughter's wedding 14 years ago as well as wearing three piece suits to company meetings 20 years ago. I think that kind of dress code has its place and I will likely be buried in a suit. I do not think "POMP" fits that well with "Fun, Fellowship and Adventure" in a camping club.

I think the recent votes and membership trends show that a more casual atmosphere is more in line with what the general membership wants. The more progressive subgroups within WBCCI including: the Vintage Airstream Club, New England Unit, Four Corners Unit, and Save Wally, better represent the majority of the members' desires for the future of the club. I hope Jerry, (when he helps select people for the new "Long Term Strategy Committee",) will be listening to the right people and the committee is given the power to implement improvements to how the club is run.
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Old 10-13-2007, 06:48 AM   #269
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My wife and I had this conversation last night about who is feeding Jerry his info. I think that he is right (can you believe that just came from my keyboard!), the majority of the people that he talks to are traditional WBCCI members. This kind of dress is from that era. If you go to the Installation Ball and take a look, it is attended mostly by the older more traditional member, they like to dress up and they want the Ball to continue on as is. I donít see many of us younger members there so he will not get the feedback that will influence how he sees the dress code ( or other changes we see that are needed). Itís very simple, those that are going to events like this and speaking to him about those activities are the traditionalists, we who want to see a change have bailed and he will not be influenced because we arenít there. I guess we have to participate more to influence more and to get more. We need to increase our face time with our leadership to increase the amount of input he gets so change will occur. Heck Iíll be in that reception line in Bozeman, Iíll dress in my business casual and Iíll bend his ear for the 2 or 3 seconds of his time Iíll get, maybe just maybe heíll remember me!
Ed
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Old 10-14-2007, 12:40 PM   #270
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I didn't mean to stir up any more controversy. The people like me that disagree with various things the club has done are simply trying to improve the club; the humor and comments here aren't meant to be nasty but to try and improve (at least, no one I know is trying to be nasty). We're all on the same team here.

Thanks for the comments, Sonia - I know plenty of others are taking pictures, too, but I haven't seen any yet from other rallies.

dwightdi, pardon my ignorance, but were tuxes required before?

Also, this is one of those situations where people (on both sides of the issue) have to remember that only 2% of the listeners to a radio show ever call in, if you see what I mean...
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Old 10-14-2007, 12:58 PM   #271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Emerick
My wife and I had this conversation last night about who is feeding Jerry his info. I think that he is right (can you believe that just came from my keyboard!), the majority of the people that he talks to are traditional WBCCI members. This kind of dress is from that era. If you go to the Installation Ball and take a look, it is attended mostly by the older more traditional member, they like to dress up and they want the Ball to continue on as is. I donít see many of us younger members there so he will not get the feedback that will influence how he sees the dress code ( or other changes we see that are needed). Itís very simple, those that are going to events like this and speaking to him about those activities are the traditionalists, we who want to see a change have bailed and he will not be influenced because we arenít there. I guess we have to participate more to influence more and to get more. We need to increase our face time with our leadership to increase the amount of input he gets so change will occur. Heck Iíll be in that reception line in Bozeman, Iíll dress in my business casual and Iíll bend his ear for the 2 or 3 seconds of his time Iíll get, maybe just maybe heíll remember me!
Ed
THIS IS SO RIGHT .Some times you just have to stop , join up and for change where you will be heard. Nice to see this. Go get them
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Old 10-14-2007, 05:52 PM   #272
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munimula,
As you know, I own a motorhome which will bring a frown from almost any trailer owner in the WBCCI. I don't know why. I thought we were all about camping and having fun. My wife and I get a lot better reception from the folks at FMCA and half the price and also a lot of benefits. I'm usually a fighter, but I don't think the WBCCI is going to change with or without me.
I was a military man and I also served on our local school board for 14 years. The IBT reminds me a little of The Joint Chief of Staffs or the school teacher who knows a lot more then the parents at conference night.(sound familiar)
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Old 10-15-2007, 11:31 AM   #273
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munimula,
As you know, I own a motorhome which will bring a frown from almost any trailer owner in the WBCCI. I don't know why.
I agree with 65 GT. The only thing that matters is that your motor home is from Airstream, Inc. and made by the Airstream production line, or at least fitted by them (I realize they buy their chassis and drive trains from reputable commercial vendors). What matters to me is that YOU are an Airstreamer!

I know in the beginning WBCCI didn't allow Argosy trailers or motorhomes with either badge or even B-vans; it took long enough to get that changed and the change was for the better, IMHO. I know that there was controversy over the Base Camp and that was quickly resolved (relatively speaking!). I bought our Airstream just before the vote on the name change. I waited 'till after the vote to join because I didn't want to be a part of it and really wanted to wait to see how it turned out. Then, the motor home issue came up. I really wish Airstream motor home owners wouldn't think that this issue was about Airstream motor homes or their owners. It wasn't for me and I don't think it was for most WBCCI members. I haven't been to a WBCCI rally so I don't know how motor home owners are treated at them but I hope they aren't treated as second class citizens, but I'm beginning to suspect that they might be. If so, I'm glad I haven't been to a WBCCI rally yet.

I can understand that other RV clubs may offer better benefits to its members. I haven't seen much from WBCCI yet other than camaraderie of being in a club of unique, single branded RV's, monthly magazines, and a sense of history and identity. But I think the club is worth the $70/year and will continue to belong until I see whether it will join the 21st century or stay in the 1970's. If there is no progress, then I guess I will drop out, too. I hope it doesn't come to that.
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Old 10-15-2007, 03:00 PM   #274
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Thanks for the kudos. No matter what, I will still be around on the forums here expressing my opinions right or wrong.
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Old 10-20-2007, 06:19 PM   #275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnie's Mate
I really wish Airstream motor home owners wouldn't think that this issue was about Airstream motor homes or their owners.
There were quite a few comments during the whole debate about the issue that made me, as a motorhome owner, feel pretty second-rate. Certain members weren't afraid to belittle people who owned motorhomes for various reasons (my favorite: "Old fogies that can't pull a trailer any more" - excuse me, I'm 32, younger than most of the membership, and I own a motorhome because I take my car to car-specific-events - the cars I own and go to these events for can't tow a trailer, so I go the other way around).

Quote:
It wasn't for me and I don't think it was for most WBCCI members. I haven't been to a WBCCI rally so I don't know how motor home owners are treated at them but I hope they aren't treated as second class citizens, but I'm beginning to suspect that they might be. If so, I'm glad I haven't been to a WBCCI rally yet.
Fortunately, that hasn't been my experience. At the rallies I've been to so far (all WDCU), I've felt quite welcomed. Though I admit I had some trepidation before the first one after reading some of the comments in this very forum.
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Old 10-23-2007, 09:39 AM   #276
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There were quite a few comments during the whole debate about the issue that made me, as a motorhome owner, feel pretty second-rate. Certain members weren't afraid to belittle people who owned motorhomes for various reasons ...

Fortunately, that hasn't been my experience. At the rallies I've been to so far (all WDCU), I've felt quite welcomed. Though I admit I had some trepidation before the first one after reading some of the comments in this very forum.
Wow, I'm sorry to hear that. I would have been very embarrassed to have witness that kind of treatment. I am glad, though, that you haven't been shunned at the local rallies. It seems local folks are much more tolerant of most every issue than the International rally folks are. I wonder if they feel that way and hide their feelings locally and then show how they really feel when they congregate en masse at the International?
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Old 10-23-2007, 12:01 PM   #277
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I wonder if they feel that way and hide their feelings locally and then show how they really feel when they congregate en masse at the International?
Trust me on this one, the members of the WDCU are the same no matter were we go and that could be the very reason we have the reputation we do in the club . At the WDCU rallies, I would like think we include any and all, no matter what you drive or pull, as long as it's an Airstream. Plus, our members look great in "white tux" to boot!!
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Old 10-23-2007, 01:22 PM   #278
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsideOut

I thought the same...camping clothes? church clothes? same thing - at least at my church.

Shari
Amen Sister
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:32 AM   #279
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Saw this cartoon. It made me think of this thread.
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:05 PM   #280
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LOL That is a perfect cartoon!

I think what many here have expressed or felt is a frustration occuring with so much feed-back from members wanting a more casual and updated look and club. This decision to keep to a 30 plus year tradition of formal dress is one area where change and response could easily have been implimented and it was not, possibly being interpretted as a blantant disregard for members' priorities. You know a good political candidate would be prompt to be PC and show evidence of prevailing attitudes.

No one begrudges the IBT their function or manner of dress but to some this seemingly small issue is representative and emphasizes the casm between IBT and the members and whose desires should prevail. In good will a sensitive IBT would go out of their way to satiate the majority of members rather than continue with their own agendas whether in whatever is small as in dress or in whatever is large such as the name change and brand identity of the club.
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