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Old 09-20-2007, 12:41 PM   #201
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Leadership we can follow...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck
Quote:
Originally Posted by wam52
No offense Ed, but pointing out the obvious regarding the disconnect between our leadership and its membership in this forum does little more than entertain the non members and and confuse the uninitiated.





Boy, did YOU ever hit the nail on the head with that one!!
Chuck & WAM52,
As a non-member (soon to be member) and one of the uninitiated I appreciate Ed's commentary.
The direction of an organization is charted by the example set by it's leadership. If the membership chooses to follow a different path, then the leader has failed to lead and the organization begins on a road in which it ceases to exist.
My perception is that the IBT feels the membership has an obligation to follow their lead... in a free society this is not the case. It is the obligation of the IBT to lead in a way that the membership is compelled to follow. This is how to grow an organization.
The continued growth of the VAC has demonstrated that it's leadership has compelled it's members to follow. This is the kind of leadership that will do the same for the International Organization.
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Old 09-20-2007, 01:27 PM   #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnie's Mate
The current system makes it almost impossible for a non-retiree to be a member of the IBT, or some of the other high level offices, with all the cross country travel required. If you still work like I do, you can't travel to all the meetings that are required. I have forgotten how many there are and where they are located, but I know I can't take a family vacation and attend the Mid-Winter and International rallies.
The current system perpetuates guarantee of that. A new system would allow dues to be less and not allow traveling on club money and eliminate the need for appreciation perks of so many volunteers and simply conduct business online or by telephone conferencing. Aren't there WBCCI members that could truly volunteer (without club cost) to conduct necessary business in all areas of the country on behalf of the officers as a proxy? It's a matter of goals. The IBT is self perpetuating rather than looking to change the club in the best way it can to serve the majority of members for their activity and enjoyment.

What does this have to do with Tuxs not as much as it has to do with mandates?

And Steve I agree with your comments and share your perception also.

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Old 09-20-2007, 02:09 PM   #203
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Said the Sheriff to the Incarcerees - What we have here.. is a failure to communicate

The Forums does well because we can communicate - what we post is instantly available to all 23,000 plus members.

The WBCCI population, at least the pre-baby boomer “older” generation, is, in general, hampered due to the communication via snail mails being read at once a month meetings or being read in a poorly printed and mailed magazine - at best the info communicated is at least a month old, possibly two months old.

This entire thread is an excellent example of just that type of generation gap – lack of communication.

In the WBCCI unit I belong to comprised of over 100 members I truthfully believe that if I sent an e-mail to every member the e-mail would be read by only about 6 of them within the first 24 hours…and of those 6 there are 4 under 60.

What is broken within the WBCCI, in my opinion, is communication – and there is precious little any of us younger than 60 can do about it – I use 60 years of age because the communication revolution of e-mail really started in the mid 1990’s. The majority of people readying for retirement in the mid 90’s are now the backbone of the WBCCI and do not use the internet as their primary mode of communication.

This will surely change as the first generation of computer literate retirees (the 1950’s baby boomers) join their camping organization of choice. For me, this will be (and is) the WBCCI. Are there plenty of things wrong within the organization? – Sure.

Will things change? – Absolutely…and soon. And the change will come from within.

The next generation of leaders for the WBCCI will be elected in about 3 years, and then take 2 more years to “ascend to power”. I am certain that as surely as we are reading this on computer screens this change will take place.

This change has already happened within the VAC simply because the older mindset and financially secure members are minority members of the VAC. Due to increasing age and declining physical ability the “VAC old guys” are now secure in more modern trailers and Motor Homes. The rank and file of the VAC is now the computer literate baby boomer generation. Therefore, the VAC has the communication abilities that the general WBCCI could only hope for. If you don’t believe this, just compare the popularity and traffic of these Forums and the various “rebuild” sites to the WBCCI Forum.

There are certainly exceptions to communication capability at both ends of this age spectrum, and I am basing my assumptions only on my observations. I am sure I will be taking some hits because of these assumptions without documentation, but, I assure you, change is approaching.
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Old 09-20-2007, 02:37 PM   #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 87MH

Will things change? – Absolutely…and soon. And the change will come from within.

The next generation of leaders for the WBCCI will be elected in about 3 years, and then take 2 more years to “ascend to power”. I am certain that as surely as we are reading this on computer screens this change will take place.
I agree with everything you said except I think you are optomistic in the time-table. It's too bad that we will have to wait until our kids are grown and we are retired to join, that is if we should live that long.

I just had a thought. To stay in power, they don't want younger people changing the mix of old VS. young. They do things like this (tuxes) to alienate the younger generation. Young people don't join and therefore don't vote (for change). They are doing a good job keeping themselves in power.
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Old 09-20-2007, 03:00 PM   #205
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Change comes from within. Don't just voice an opinion. Run for a seat and start making changes.
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Old 09-20-2007, 04:44 PM   #206
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IBT vs. Membership

Funny how laying low for a few months on the forums can bring so much joy. My blood pressure has gone down, less keeping me up at night, etc... I was wondering how long it would take for this thread to turn into the "IBT vs. Membership" thread, not sure of the count, but I think less than 10 reply's, not bad.

Guy's, all of you are right in what you say (IBT is out of touch, we just want to camp, lets make a joke out of it) in regards to the problem. Bottom line is this: Until "YOU" the membership of the WBCCI understand that "YOU" are the WBCCI and it is "YOUR" club to make it as you see fit, nothing will change! Sitting here, typing away complaining about the "IBT" will do you little good other than the old saying "Misery Loves Company". With that, you must also understand, when you go to make the changes you think are needed, you will come under the gun! I know this first hand! Though I made many friends with the "Pirate" gig at International this year and my complaining about the MOHO issue with the IBT, I "P*SSED" off a bunch of people just trying to make some changes to were the club/International could be a lot more fun.

That's why I will say again, "If you want change, step up and make it happen". Start at your local level and work your way up! I return now to my blood pressure meds!!
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Old 09-20-2007, 05:09 PM   #207
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I'm not wound up about this, in fact I think it's pretty funny. Yes sad to see the bylaws so interestingly interpreted (Article 7 Section 2 reads to me that you take office immediately following the election). Anyway, no matter what, every time I see this thread, I keep thinking of this, apologies to the Python challenged:
Quote:
Arthur: I am your king!
Dennis' Mother: Well I didn't vote for you.
Arthur
: The Lady of the Lake, her arm clad in the purest shimmering samite, held aloft Excalibur from the bosom of the water signifying by Divine Providence that I, Arthur, was to carry Excalibur. THAT is why I am your king!
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Old 09-20-2007, 09:29 PM   #208
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What's he smoking???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Emerick
In coming 2008-2009 IBT President Jerry Larson (who will be installed in Bozeman) has mandated the formal dress for his Installation Ceremony. In an email to those officers who will participate in this event Larson mandated dress WILL include men in white tuxedos and the ladies in floor length formal gowns.

Many of the Regional participants responded to this mandate with comments like “this is in the wrong direction”, “remember we are a camping club”, “we are sending the wrong message to the membership”, “most of the younger members and some of the older members feel we have too much pomp and ceremony” and last “If we are going to take this to take this organization from good to great we will need to make some major changes which will include less formality”

Larson has turn his back on these comments and responded with the following email message:

“This upcoming Installation Ceremony is one of the most significant events that I will have had the privilege of experiencing. Other events that I have dressed similarly for are High School and three college graduations, my children’s weddings and a visit to the White House Oval Office. So you see this is not just merely a passing event. It is VERY important to both Joan and I. Events like this have set the WBCCI apart from “just a camping club” or “just a recreational club”. Wally Byam set high standards several years ago for us to perpetuate and keep the WBCCI special from all the others.”

All I can say is WOW! The leadership of this club is so full of themselves that they compare an Installation event with a visit to the Oval Office! No wonder this club is dieing, the leadership is more interested in their own wants that they turn their back to the needs of the membership.

I am so flabbergasted by this mindset that I just don’t know how to respond but felt those of you out there should see how the inner workings of this club are NOT moving forward.

Now I have to go study my WBCCI history and see if I can find the photo of Wally at a rally with a white tux on!

Amazed,
Ed

This is all about ego. I truly suspect that Wally wouldn't have been caught dead in a tux. Come on guys....quit taking yourselves so seriously!!!

This truly is a camping club that is focused on the fellowship that we all have, which is our love of aluminum. Not formal attire.

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Old 09-20-2007, 11:28 PM   #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swanny
This truly is a camping club that is focused on the fellowship that we all have, which is our love of aluminum.
I don't know about that, from all the post on here seems more like a Association for a Retirement Community. Makes me think of a friends mother when we went by to see her, she was upset over a nasty note sent to her from a board member about planting a bush in the yard for a home she bought and paid for. She told me she might be 65 but no one was going to tell her she could not plant a bush in her own yard. That fight has gone on for like 6 years now. Age is a state of mind, but when those in charge only think in terms of one age group, the group will not grow. I don't think any of this is about right or wrong, but more what part of the club suits you best. Everyone I have talked to thinks things at local units are much better. So enjoy that part and let those who wish wear what they want.
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Old 09-21-2007, 04:54 AM   #210
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Put me at the top of the guilty list.
Of those who have sniped, criticized, and generally made fun of another club member.
After all is said and done that is at least one thing many of us have in common, being club members.

Having read many of the comments, my perspective has modified and is certainly less mean spirited.
At first there was the desire to make light of a closed community mentality that appears exclusive rather than inclusive. But how many are on the Board of Trustees and is the number significant enough to really matter?
I offer a motion to let the IBT handle their own (how to dress) affairs, including giving their new president support or rebuttal.

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Old 09-21-2007, 06:34 AM   #211
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I was wondering if the incoming Prez has been informed of this discussion? How about the IBT members? There have been posts by their detractors and supporters. Have any of their supporters clued them in to this discussion so they might read how some of the "common folk" feel about our clubs direction? Maybe someone should. A lot can be learned from lurking... now would be a good time for the IBT to lurk.
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Old 09-21-2007, 06:58 AM   #212
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They are always watching!

Trust me on this one, the IBT knows what is said on the different forums.
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:28 AM   #213
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Unfortunately, they seem to write them off a being from a fringe element that doesn't count.

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Old 09-21-2007, 08:35 AM   #214
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Just shows how wrong they can be. If they read this and still think the way they do. Seems pretty arrogant to me. Or is it they just don't get it???
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Old 09-21-2007, 09:29 AM   #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airboss
Just shows how wrong they can be. If they read this and still think the way they do. Seems pretty arrogant to me. Or is it they just don't get it???
Here is what I said in post #206:

"I just had a thought. To stay in power, they don't want younger people changing the mix of old VS. young. They do things like this (tuxes) to alienate the younger generation. Young people don't join and therefore don't vote (for change). They are doing a good job keeping themselves in power."

It's funny, I'm now 51 years old and there is still a "generation gap". "Young people" in this discussion are now the 40 -50 - and some 60 year olds and the "establishment generation is the 70 to 80 year olds.

If each generation keeps living longer and staying healthier longer, when we finally get in power and are in our 80's and 90's, some young whipper snapper 70 year old will be bi***ing and moaning about us .
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Old 09-21-2007, 09:59 AM   #216
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Yes, but...can't you be of a different generation and still allow younger generations to shape your thinking and embrace them? I want to grow older to be one of the old dogs that you can teach new tricks to. The IBT does not represent their generation. They are most definitely a special interest group that has been isolated unto themselves for far too long and we see that result. When I am queen of all, I will look to my subjects, so all in the land will live happily ever after. Through the eyes of a child...
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:59 AM   #217
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Just a few thoughts but one reason that the dress code is mandated is for PR and photos, I suspect. These will probably be in the Blue Beret in the showcase at Airstream and at WBCCI headquarters possibly? I think the club would be more appealing to younger Airstreamers if the officers weren't always shown in dressed up head shots like the members of an institution and they each were pictured as in an environmental portrait as doing more and living more in their Airstream and on their travels. How much more interesting the Blue Beret and club would appear for old and new and prospective members alike. Teen Queen cover, how many new members came into the club this year after that inspiration? Promote active lifestyles and fun rather than dry worn out static shots. It's all about selling the club to new members, or is it?
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Old 09-21-2007, 11:54 AM   #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rideair
Trust me on this one, the IBT knows what is said on the different forums.
They may know, but the question is... Do they listen?
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Old 09-21-2007, 12:05 PM   #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wader
They may know, but the question is... Do they listen?
They go that one further, they discontinued the communications liason committee and member share column and WBCCI forums threads just so they could stop hearing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Instead you have won three pages of welcome new member names for club news.
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Old 09-21-2007, 12:53 PM   #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by safari57
Geesh, a guy goes camping for five days and is out of the loop and look what happens.....things just fall apart all around ya.

I joined WBCCI because of the 4CU. The folks who drove this unit from an idea to a valid and functioning unit within WBCCI have proven that the system can and will be changed from within.

You can't change a thing by being outside looking in and complaining - sorry, you can make all the noise you want but it won't get you anywhere because only those who paid the dues get to have their say (excepting MAL's I guess - that needs to change ASAP). So, by being a member, I'm anticipating making my views known and supporting those in office who fairly represent what I think the WBCCI needs to be. I know it takes time, but we do live in an impatient world.

I know it's fun to take shots at these folks and I enjoy it myself . But in all seriousness, change will happen - these folks are only in place now because of roles they fulfilled over many years and as these come to completion and the newer breed take hold we'll see the changes we need.

So, if you want to change WBCCI there's only one way to do it - become a member and cast your votes. I hope you do.

I do believe it's a good thing for the IBT to be dressed in white tuxes. They will stand out so that those in attendance who want change will be able to find them easily and make them aware of the challenges the club faces if it doesn't change, and quickly. So, don't be shy, pick out a white tux and have a chat with them, and see if you can do so with all 25 or whatever the number is of white suits in the crowd. All evening, drop by, introduce yourself, let them know we appreciate their hard work (they have done so or they wouldn't be in the role they are in now) and then let them know that you, as a member, have concerns about lack of direction and focus and hope they are willing to listen to the members.

Barry
I also joined the WBCCI this year because of the new 4CU.
I agree with this posting, as the owner of a 1989 Squarestream the WBCCI rejected membership to them back then because the coach "wasn't acceptable".Even the "Airstream Silver Key Delivery" binder DID NOT come with a WBCCI information package for membership in it.So things can be changed at the WBCCI even when some classic member do not like it.
I beleive the people that DO NOT care for the WBCCI leadership should fight for change NOT run to leave.If you like to the WBCCI Join now, talk loud and carrying a big sharp stick to poke the poor WBCCI leadership into change or be quit .Come join the 4CU camping and help empty the M ball.
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