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Old 12-02-2009, 08:10 AM   #121
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Originally Posted by kmtyme View Post
Howie,
I think that information is on line at the WBCCI site, the units and officers, inc. tel #s.
Kate
I looked for this information but did not find it.

However I did find the "2009 Mid Winter Report". Have any of you red it? Who ever wrote that report could already be on our side.

http://www.wbcci.org/documents/New%20Directions%202.doc
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Old 12-02-2009, 08:10 AM   #122
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Gene,

Unlike others, my professional career has taught me that financial information is to be confidential. I am hesitant to discuss the details of WBCCI finances on a public forum such as this.

Bill
Bill, the financial information of a nonprofit should be available to members of the organization. They should be able to do an analysis of the information and comment on the wisdom of the leadership as stewards of the organization.

Depending on the type of entity it is, financial information may or may not be public. A sole proprietorship's info is confidential. But a nonprofit, because of the tax breaks it gets, has to release more info to the public, plus the members (like stockholders in a corporation) have access to the books. Some info seems to be public already, some may be available if asked for.

There are a lot of statements about WBCCI finances, primarily about reserves and travel expenses. It's important if people are to challenge the financial stewardship of the organization's leaders that they have accurate information and present it clearly. That's why I suggest finding a CPA to gather it all together and analyze it. A CPA should know what can and what cannot be discussed publicly and advise people accordingly. Of course, the question is whether there is a CPA willing to donate time who is an Airstream owner and dissatisfied with the WBCCI leaders. There are others capable of analyzing the numbers, but a CPA has the authority that goes with the title.

Gene
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Old 12-02-2009, 08:38 AM   #123
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Bill, the financial information of a nonprofit should be available to members of the organization. They should be able to do an analysis of the information and comment on the wisdom of the leadership as stewards of the organization.

Depending on the type of entity it is, financial information may or may not be public. A sole proprietorship's info is confidential. But a nonprofit, because of the tax breaks it gets, has to release more info to the public, plus the members (like stockholders in a corporation) have access to the books. Some info seems to be public already, some may be available if asked for.

There are a lot of statements about WBCCI finances, primarily about reserves and travel expenses. It's important if people are to challenge the financial stewardship of the organization's leaders that they have accurate information and present it clearly. That's why I suggest finding a CPA to gather it all together and analyze it. A CPA should know what can and what cannot be discussed publicly and advise people accordingly. Of course, the question is whether there is a CPA willing to donate time who is an Airstream owner and dissatisfied with the WBCCI leaders. There are others capable of analyzing the numbers, but a CPA has the authority that goes with the title.

Gene
Gene,

As I stated in post 118, the financial information is available to members, just ask. If I understand your post, you are asking for this information to be discussed on an open forum in front of and with non-members. I believe that this is inappropriate. WBCCI is a membership organization and as such differs from other non member non profit organizations such as the Red Cross. I don't believe that financial information of any member only organization should be discussed on an open forum with non members participating.

Bill
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:45 AM   #124
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Gene,

If I understand your post, you are asking for this information to be discussed on an open forum in front of and with non-members.
Bill
Bill, what I am suggesting is that the info be analyzed by an expert. Whenever challenging leadership about their actions, it's best to have your info correct.

Whether that info should be shared outside membership is a different question. That question is best answered by lawyers familiar with the laws of the state where the WBCCI is organized; I have only stated general principles of law in my post above. However, when there is a dispute between members and leadership of an organization, it is fair to presume a lot of info will be talked about openly whether or not it is legal, moral and wise—that's just reality.

This thread and others shows that info is being discussed openly, although I do not know whether that info is accurate. Having an expert analyze data may help with clarity and accuracy, something I hope everyone would support.

Gene
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:11 AM   #125
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I have been keeping up with this thread on both the wbcci forum and this forum and agree with Gene. If this is to take place everything needs to be in order, checked and double checked with lawyers and CPA's. I also see this as an out in left field agenda. Wouldn't it be best to make it a petition that Aunt Mary in Ohio would want to sign. Think cutting travel cost in half first year. No Rally fee reimbursement. Just my thoughts.
Sincerely,
Aunt Mary in Ohio who winters in Florida
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Old 12-02-2009, 12:35 PM   #126
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Howie,

Go to WBCCI.org
near the top are several categories...open regions/units
open a region
it will list the head chairman, address, tel, email, website
below are the units, membership chairman, tel
many units have their own websites which you can open and get further info

Good Luck
Kate
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Old 12-02-2009, 12:59 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by kmtyme View Post
Howie,

Go to WBCCI.org
near the top are several categories...open regions/units
open a region
it will list the head chairman, address, tel, email, website
below are the units, membership chairman, tel
many units have their own websites which you can open and get further info

Good Luck
Kate
Yes found it. That is about a 50% chance of the officers listing their e mail but even that will be a great help with cut and paste.
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:31 PM   #128
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Old 12-16-2009, 07:59 AM   #129
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IBT Meeting in January


I have just read the IBT future notes to bring up in Jan 2010 and I am
Appalled!! at the notes..

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

$103,279.76 in the HOLE!!! Come on where are our LEADERS!!! Someone really
dropped the ball on this International!!! Lets stop this Runaway Leadership,
They have to be held accountable!! How come we as unit rallies have to be within
budget? I cannot believe that this continues to happen. I for one WILL NOT be
attending this years Rally in Gillette. Again we are being overcharged for this
Rally?? WHY?? when Region Rallys are run for less than $100.00 plus per night
camping? Now you want to raise dues to $75.00 plus unit dues, you are Killing
the membership.. Does anyone agree with me or is it just me? 169 committees to
run the International is Foolish. We need to revamp the whole International
before you breakup this Great Club of Airstreamers ...Don't let the Leadership
steer us down one more road of of this overpriced week of showing off. Grandpa
always said..Son...Pay your own way!! Dennis Ober #2590


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Old 12-16-2009, 11:20 AM   #130
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Thumbs up Thanks

Dennis,
Thanks for taking the time to post the information. I didn't know about it, and found it interesting and useful.

Mr. W _ _ _ _ _
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Old 12-16-2009, 02:52 PM   #131
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So what are we to do?

I was told by a little birdie that some amendments would be coming down the pike at the winter IBT meeting that would take care of some the concern over spending, membership, Regions, etc… and thus, the reason for laying low for the past week or so.

When I read the amendments that were being proposed, I was even more disappointed in the IBT and their leadership. Their solution is like:

Taking the time to put a band aid on a paper cut when you just hacked off your arm with a chain saw and are bleeding all over the ground”

I’m also starting to agree that it will be very difficult to get the 1000 members to sign up to call a meeting when most are not even up in arms about how our money has been spent over the past couple of years.

I may “pee-off” some folks with this one, but I blame much of the problem on many “UNIT” Presidents and leaders by “NOT” keeping up with what the IBT/EC7 is doing and informing the members of their units on that information.

Most members look at the club the way they do a rally, if you are not the host or helping out, for many (maybe not the ones on this thread), you show up, have a good time and leave. You don’t think about the entire goings on behind the scenes and the management of the money, who did what, etc…

So what are we to do?
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Old 12-16-2009, 04:44 PM   #132
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Old 12-16-2009, 05:20 PM   #133
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Quote:
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Most members look at the club the way they do a rally, if you are not the host or helping out, for many (maybe not the ones on this thread), you show up, have a good time and leave. You don’t think about the entire goings on behind the scenes and the management of the money, who did what, etc…

So what are we to do?
Paul, you've got to hit them in the pocket book. As long as there are funds, nothing is going to happen. So you wait and watch the bleeding and figure out if these guys running the show will finally get the picture and do what has to be done. In the mean time you all continue to pour most of your dues into the sink hole.

The other alternative is to talk to the members locally who will listen, and the tough side for you guys is to take the action to pull out of the organization. That hastens the economic woes, but at that point might grab some attention at the high end.

The process today as I see it doesn't encourage change. Those of you unfortunately who recognize what's going on aren't going to get the keys to get into the positions to effect the change that needs to be done.

Get out now and maybe come back in when saner leadership prevails.

Jack
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Old 12-16-2009, 05:37 PM   #134
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What are we to do? What I did three years ago. Submit my resignation letter.

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Old 12-16-2009, 06:31 PM   #135
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Old 12-16-2009, 06:38 PM   #136
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Old 12-16-2009, 06:39 PM   #137
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They look like the hosts of the Wally Byam Birthday Bash.
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Old 12-16-2009, 06:56 PM   #138
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Old 12-16-2009, 07:52 PM   #139
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So what are we to do?

So what are we to do?[/QUOTE]

You all know what has to be done but no one has the energy or the stamina to do what it takes to create a competing airstream club!

All we want to do is talk about it!

So as I told Leo 4 or 5 years ago! Its the only answer to an entrenched group that will not bend and I will not go it alone. Until a group becomes so outraged and is willing to go the distance and can show they are serious I will remain a WBCCI member because its the only Airstream game in town!

There is no alternative!

Free form rallies are ok if your a one or two event kind of camper but if you plan ten or twelve outings a year you need to be organized and insured to protect yourself and your principles from financial predators the same as doctors and and anybody else performing a service for the general public.

If your serious, you know where to find me!

WAM
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Old 12-16-2009, 09:04 PM   #140
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Holy mackerel - Wayne shows up at the Forums. Now I know this subject is serious. I look forward to a discussion or two on this subject around the fire at Myrtle Beach.

All I know is that when my day comes to Caravan this club better still be rolling.
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