2004 Models

[Silvertwinkie]

Why were the prices removed from the 2004 line up post by Hubba?

Hubba, can you please send me those figure in a PM?

Eric

[dtbw]

I know that I posted these a few days ago, but can't remember which section they wound up in. Anyway, they were originally posted on anther forum, but are from Airstream.

2004 List prices

19' Safari Bambi - $33,203.
25' Safari - $38,603.
25' Safari 6-sleeper - $39,143.
28' Safari Non-Slide - $45,353.
28' Safari Slide-Out - $51,293.
16' International CCD Bambi - $32,393.
19' International CCD Bambi - $37,793.
22' International CCD - $40,493.
25' International CCD 6-sleeper - $47,243.
28' International CCD - $52,643.
25' Classic - $53,753.
28' Classic - $57,953.
30' Classic - $62,433.
30' Classic Slide-Out - $69,713.
31' Classic - $62,153.
34' Classic - $71,113.
34' Classic Slide-Out Dinette - $79,513.
34' Classic Slide-Out Lounge - $82,313.

[LuvSub]

While at WBCCI International, I was speaking to some of Airstream's management and they mentioned the demise of the 22' International AS. The theme didn't meld with the rest of the CCD lineup so the floorplan will be merged into the Safari line. As such, it will lose the wrap around front windows and some of the trim of the original AS (mercifully, it was also lose the Lazy Susan).

My thought on the AS was that Airstream was taking a big leap with the original CCD concept and was pretty nervous about such a radical departure. They hedged their bets by launching the CCD and AS together. Whichever theme survived would be expanded and I guess that was the CCD. I'm glad I got an early '02 AS with the nice cabinetry and other features. I'll roll over 10,000 great miles on The LuvSub this weekend when I head to the Outer Banks from Vermont!

[Hubba]

Sorry about not posting my price sheet - but I see where dtbw has done so!

Interesting that the CCD remains and the AS has gone to Safari. Although the CCD is very nice it has 3 major concerns for me:

1. smaller refer than the AS (3 cu. ft. vs. 4 cu. ft.)
2. smaller bed width
3. that unnecessary desk

If you remore the desk, turn the bathroom sideways, slide down the kitchen, get rid of the nightstand, you can make the bed one foot wider - 60" rather than 48". You would have room for a pantry between the bathroom and the dinette. Who says you can't put in a 4 cu. ft. refer and cover (from the inside) the lower small window?

[Silvertwinkie]

Thanks to David and Hubba for getting us the info!

Eric

[Pahaska]

Originally posted by Hubba
Interesting that the CCD remains and the AS has gone to Safari. Although the CCD is very nice it has 3 major concerns for me:

1. smaller refer than the AS (3 cu. ft. vs. 4 cu. ft.)
2. smaller bed width
3. that unnecessary desk

If you remore the desk, turn the bathroom sideways, slide down the kitchen, get rid of the nightstand, you can make the bed one foot wider - 60" rather than 48". You would have room for a pantry between the bathroom and the dinette. Who says you can't put in a 4 cu. ft. refer and cover (from the inside) the lower small window?

Months ago, I posted almost exactly the same ideas as in your post. It sursprised me how many folks jumped up and defended the desk which I think is a rather stupid use of space. The layout fairly cries for a bathroom across the back (with a shower) and the changes that you outlined.

[85MH325]

Originally posted by Pahaska


Months ago, I posted almost exactly the same ideas as in your post. It sursprised me how many folks jumped up and defended the desk which I think is a rather stupid use of space. The layout fairly cries for a bathroom across the back (with a shower) and the changes that you outlined.

John, I suspect that the appeal of the 'desk' is that it's something different. Not necessarily the best use of space, or even particularly practical, just different. IMHO, the entire CCD treatment appeals to the buyer who's looking for something out of the ordinary, and the desk is just another piece of that appeal. I don't find the CCD interiors to be especially comfortable to be in. The kind of remind me of a spruced-up walk-in refrigerator. They're 'edgy' and 'cold'. I prefer 'warm' and 'homey'. To each his own, I guess.

Roger

[Pahaska]

Originally posted by 85MH325


John, I suspect that the appeal of the 'desk' is that it's something different. Not necessarily the best use of space, or even particularly practical, just different. IMHO, the entire CCD treatment appeals to the buyer who's looking for something out of the ordinary, and the desk is just another piece of that appeal. I don't find the CCD interiors to be especially comfortable to be in. The kind of remind me of a spruced-up walk-in refrigerator. They're 'edgy' and 'cold'. I prefer 'warm' and 'homey'. To each his own, I guess.

Roger

You are probably right about the "something different" appeal. I think the CCD decor is a love it or hate it proposition.

When I first looked at my trailer on the lot, I was able to make a quick tour of a CCD that had been sold while the new owner was getting his checkout. I stepped in and felt it was totally foreign to me; I walked right back out knowing that I would never buy that model. Obviously, there are a lot of folks that don't feel that way.

[Pahaska]

Originally posted by LuvSub
While at WBCCI International, I was speaking to some of Airstream's management and they mentioned the demise of the 22' International AS. The theme didn't meld with the rest of the CCD lineup so the floorplan will be merged into the Safari line. As such, it will lose the wrap around front windows and some of the trim of the original AS (mercifully, it was also lose the Lazy Susan).

I think a straight pull-out pantry would have as much space as the Lazy Susan and be a lot easier to organize and to view the contents. The Lazy Susan seems like a whimsical idea to me that added product cost without adding function.

Actually, my Lazy Susan works quite well after I modified it to prevent items from bouncing off into the void in the corner of the trailer (see 2003 AS thread). I also riveted several plastic trays to the shelves to keep tall bottles upright and small items contained.

One problem with the layout is that there is no good place for a trash can. I use a small can on the counter, and empty it daily. With a straight pullout pantry, it might be possible to embed a trash receptical in the countertop with a nice chrome swing top.

Damn, I'm giving myself ideas and that usually results in rework to the trailer.

[KIMILI]

CCD versus AS

well, it is absolutely a matter of taste, we all agree on that, but the CCD does have character.

In our opinion it did not appear cold, but fresh ! Also, easy to clean and airy. The use of light colours and fresh or warm tones make it seem larger and roomy. The linear looks give it a cool, simple, yet elegant aspect of comfort. Definetly modern and more appealing to a different generation than the one who first fell in love with the Classic version.

The CCD line represents the future, as does the computer desk. Yes, the desk everyone is misunderstanding and under estimating.

AS is trying to attract new customers, lets also say different customers. People who don't have extended vacation time and are not yet retired, but still want to enjoy, a few short trips camping, in style, in an AS.
These are people who are - like us - often online, for work or pleasure. Need a last moment recipe? Doctor's advice? Urgent repair tips from fellow AS lovers? The web delivers.

My mom never thought the telephone would've left the house but now she won't leave the house without her cell phone! Same story for PC's, therefore the DESK will become more and more a necessity not an addition.

In the meantime it's a perfect diaper station!

I will agree on all the comments on the wet bath!!i Still don't understand why AS did that. Although, as a couple with two teenage daughters who recently bought the 22' CCD told us: it's camping get over it!

Our two cents on CCD's behalf.

Cheers
KIMILI

PS
By the way if anyone is looking to purchase any of these 2004 models here's a great tip for you fellows here on the east coast:

AS dealer with Unbeatable prices, great service and really honest!!! Check them out, highly reccomended.

"Shining Time Express II Inc.", Darien Center, NY.

[Pahaska]

My mom never thought the telephone would've left the house but now she won't leave the house without her cell phone! Same story for PC's, therefore the DESK will become more and more a necessity not an addition.

I just spent 4 over 100-degree days in my AS which has no dedicated desk. I used my laptop computer comfortably for hours on the dressing table and in the dinette area, both of which have power outlets and phone jacks handy. I didn't miss a dedicated desk st all.

Just like the wet bath vs a shower, I don't think large areas of a small trailer should be dedicated to activities that occupy a small fraction of our time.

[85MH325]

Originally posted by KIMILI
CCD versus AS

Definetly modern and more appealing to a different generation than the one who first fell in love with the Classic version.

Cheers
KIMILI

Actually, Kimili, the CCD interiors are most closely reminiscent of the '40s Airstream production pipeframe trailers' interiors. They had oval windows front and rear, and (it's my understanding) could be bought with unpainted aluminum interiors, although most that I've seen had a light green paint applied. I have seen a couple in native aluminum, although I'm not sure whether that was stock, or just that some PO had the paint removed. The galley was entirely aluminum and stainless. The upholstery fabric was typical of the era, generally a large floral pattern. Airstream dishes were melmac and brightly colored, and stored vertically in racks on the wall above the galley, giving a similar effect to the CCD interiors of today.

One example of a '47 that I saw had the bed in front and a rear dinette.

I guess that I see the CCD as an 'Art Deco' style makeover of the current production.

Does anyone have a good photo or two of the interior of one they could post?

As some wise sage once said, "Everything old becomes new again..."

Roger

[frozen chosen]

We have a 16CCD on order, what are your early impressions as to fit and finish on your trailer? Any defects or problems so far? Some recent posts have been downright scary on the subject. I'm glad to hear you like your 22, we also felt the CCD style was extrordinary.

[Silvertwinkie]

For the most part, the units are sound, it's the combo of all the little things that get you pissed...

Latches that break, sawdust everywhere, metal shavings, furnaces that stop working, lino flooring that has cuts in it from install, fridges that have bent tops inside the door...I mean obvious stuff that proper QC of the coach would have stopped the unit from proceeding out the door.

Airstream talks a mean game on quality and for a good part if you compare them to SOBs, you're right. The bottom line is that to compare an Airstream to a SOB is like comparing apples to pears. Given the price, talk of quailty, etc, as many things that do go wrong shouldn't. Now keep in mind stuff like furnace that stops working, etc is not entirely Airstreams fault. They like other RV builders buy appliances, etc and install them. But when it comes to the coach design and you find seperating countertops and shower walls, that is something that is frustrating when your list can get to be more than 10. Huge items, not really. Just not conv for the customer to have to keep getting issues fixed, esp if a dealer as in most cases is at least 2 hours away...one way. Thank god for a two year warranty though.....

I think that the Airstream of today in some part is relying on it's older reputation and the American Icon status it has. Just remember Harley Davidson also had the same cult like following and almost went belly up for similar quality issues.

All that said, I'd still buy another Airstream, but I'd be much more critical before I took delivery now that I know what to look for based on info on this forum and my personal exp with my '03. I only hope Airstream gets back on track. On positive note, once you get in touch with Airstream they do have some great folks out there to help you out for questions, problems, etc.

Soapbox off....

[gklott]

I agree with your comment on the quality if AS compared to SOB. Plus the components in out 2004 Classic are almost always superior to SOB we reviewed.

However, when paying 3 to 5 times the SOB prices, you exxpect QC. When things simply do not work, obviously, QC was missing.

We're working thru the warranty items with AS of San Antonio. Chuck is being very supportive. He said he has contacted AS with our list. We're set up to do the repairs early in Sep, after our next trip.

Here's the initial warranty repair list. I included several of the pictures in previous posts, and I can post other small pictures if anyone is interested.

Wiring:
1. LG tank indicators inoperative. Fixed by dealer before we picked up the unit.
2. Patio/step light wired incorrectly. Only the step light functioned. Owner repaired.

Refrig/Freezer
3. Is it normal for the top of the freezer to be bowed
downward in the center? We can't tell from Fig. 2 in the
manual. The top of the refrigerator door is flat. (see previous post for image)
4. There is a lot of moisture entering the freezer. We had
excessive frost, even with the A/C on reducing humidity.
Believe it may be due to item 1 and the top of the door not
sealing well.
5. The refrigerator freezes everything effectively on all
settings, including setting #3. Items even freeze when
placed on higher levels on the door.
6. There is a crack in on the left inside panel of the
freezer door. If item 1 is bent, then this probably cracked
with the top deformation.

Exterior
7. The curbside rear stabilizer is difficult to extend and
retract. The screw does not turn evenly, tending to bind at
one point on each revolution. We've examined it, and see no
obvious cause.
8. Bath vent leaks in closed position, when it rains.

Flooring
9. The linoleum is slit at the corner of both dinette
benches (see previous post for image)
10. Staples and subflooring are visible, and there are
staple(?) holes in the linoleum at the door (see image below)
11. Linoleum has been installed crooked. Most noticeably at
the master bedroom door and the bath/Mbr wall. (#160)

Other interior:
12. Shower door overhead needs caulking, gaps in original job.
13. Shower light switch needs adjusting to be flush with the
switch plate.
14. Lounge folding table street side swings open. Its latch
does not keep it secure. The latch seems loose, possibly the
screw is not holding.
15. There is a slit in the upholstery on the dinette bench
back by the refrigerator.
16. Forward front center lounge window, curbside handle
needs aligning. Nearly impossible to open to the highest
notch. The problem is not noticeable until you try to
operate the window. The handle seems to bind in the metal
opening.
17. The master bedroom emergency window's street side lever
will not reach it's highest position. We have not tried to
force it. Not noticeable until operating the window.
18. Kitchen shade installed off level.

Will see how Airstream stands behind its warranty.

73/gus kr4k

[Silvertwinkie]

I totally agree with you. That rig should have NEVER left the factory. So much for the leak test that talk about on their website on the factory tour.

Funny folks seem to think that the Classic line is immune to these and that it is always the Bambi, Safari or other lines.

This proves that in 2004 business as usual...

BTW, if it's any consolation, my list is as big as yours is on my '03 Bambi.....can you say Harley Davison story all over again?

At any rate, I planned on taking my Bambi to the factory since it's not too far away and have them deal with the growing punch list, but as of this moment, I am unsure I will do it and may just trade the unit in since I fell in love with the 25' Safari 6 sleeper.

Good luck with your coach. I know Airstream will make it right, it just stinks that the don't QC like they say the do.

Eric

[Pahaska]

I went through a bunch of new units at the dealer this morning, ranging from a 22' CCD up to a 34' Classic. The dealer told me that he is increasing his stock of Airstreams from 10 to 15 and moving to a new, larger site next door.

I really wasn't there to be looking for poor workmanship, but
one Classic apparently had a very tough journey to the dealer. There were several major damage spots in the interior including the hinge screws on the upper front cabinet which were torn right out of the oak, The folding shower door was laying in the shower. Apparently, the only fastening for the shower door is some double-sided tape which had torn apart just like the double-sided tape on the rear bumper storage on my trailer.

I really liked the Safari 28' slide except for the upholstery which, IMHO, was horrid. I liked the Safari 25s, both the SS and the double-bed. They had a 25 Safari with single beds, but I don't care for single beds so I didn't stay long in that one.

They also had a 25' Classic with double bed and I fell in love. After having the wraparound windows on the Intl AS,, I would hate to give them up.

They sold their 28' CCD and have some more CCDs on order including a 16;. That;s the one I want to see.

[KIMILI]

The 16' CCD is truly a jewel box!!

When we first saw the floorplan we were scared. We thought it would be just too tiny like living in a silver pill box but then we went to see it.

Boy we were wrong. The big windows lend to a real spaciousness inside. Yes, it's compact but it still feels very comfortable...for short trips and a couple with small pets.

We're curious to see the 19' , although size wise we feel the 16' is a better choice because of it's smart floorplan. The dinette and bed both take advantage of the beautiful large windows. The small wet bath does not feel claustrophobic because it is enhanced by the windows and lemongrass colour.

Unfortunately it was too small for our needs.

Great buy except we feel the price tag is out of proportion given the footage of the unit.

Here's a picture of the wet bath.

Cheers

PS
AS quality was a real let down! Given their price there's no excuse for their poor QA.

[frozen chosen]

I'm trying to understand your post....did you love the 16 or hate it? You say "The 16' CCD is truly a jewel box!!" ; but also "AS quality was a real let down! ". Then you write ". Yes, it's compact but it still feels very comfortable...", followed by "Unfortunately it was too small for our needs".

[KIMILI]

sorry guys,

sometimes I type slower than I think while doing other things, resulting in the messy message above.

We did not purchase the 16' because it is too small for our needs: long trips with kids and two fairly large dogs.

Before setting out to see the 16'CCD we had seen the floorplan and didn't think much of it. It seemed really crammed and suffocating.

Well, after going to the dealer and actually stepping in one we had to retract all our negative thoughts: it is a jewel box.

Even though it felt roomy, airy and comfortable it is still only 16' and that limits it's cargo capacity and livability to short outings for a single person or maybe a couple, with one small pet.

Therefore we bought the 22' and are now going for the 25'.

If we were ina different situation we'd probably have bought the 16' because it is really stunning! Great, great buy for a single person!!

Hope this clears it.
Cheers
Kimili